HST over Geared tractor

[SPYDERLK]

Soundguy, I've driven both gear and HST tractors... hope you have as well.

Safety for me comes from the following:

extreme slowness of operation without risk of foot slipping off clutch

significantly reduced exhaustion factor when operating all day

if something happens, just get off the hydro pedal and vehicle stops
moving.. much faster and more smoothly, IMHO, than reaching for clutch and brake.

When at risk of tipping, HST can creep far slower than a gear tractor, thus you can "feel" your way into and past the danger point, or stop before getting TOO far into it so you can take remedial action (drop FEL, change angle of front wheels, etc.)

When operating with a partner in front or rear, extreme slow operation allows partner to get out of way and stay there when hooking up implements, chains, etc.

Agreed, either tractor can be operated in an unsafe manner if you really try.
HST gives a wider range of safe operation and recovery options, IMHO.

As regards reliability, this topic has been addressed before on TBN... and my recollection is that HST was viewed as extremely reliable, even more so than gear/clutch.

In the long run, however, HST or Gear seems to be a mostly religious/emotional argument with proponents on both sides...... some of whom are extremists!

[[ I wouldn't have made a comparison post if I hadn't.. that would be kinda uh.. pointless... I've also driven just about every make of heavy equipment fromt he 50's up till present including rollers, dozers, loaders, rubber tire hoes, track hoes, gradeall units, scraper pans, and motor graders. Though I don't currently have a cdl, I've also driven some heavy trucks including dumps on jobsites.. etc.

Clutch is not designed to be a speed control device. it's to engage or disengage the drive train and or pto. Using a clutch as a speed control device will lead to premature clutch wear, and getting real familiar with splitting a tractor to replace the clutch.

completely subjective statement based on task being performed. For instance.. when i mow with my gear tractor, I use the clutch once when starting off int he apsture, and generally don't touch it again till I leav ethe pasture hours later.. not sure how that gets any easier... ( again.. subjective statement based on a specific job.. it's already been covere dthat different trannies will have + or - depending on specific tasks...

kinda like dumping the throttle and or killing the ignition.. pretty much just got inertia to deal with... at average tractor speeds which are in the 1-10mph range... that shouldn't be too hard a chore.

If I'm doing something that I think a millisecond of difference matters.. or a couple pounds here or there is the difference in a tip or not.. I simply avoid doing that task that way... there's nothing I've ever done on a tractor.. EVER that's worth my life.. and if I have to be that close on the edge of oblivion then.. heck.. I just don't need to do that task that way...

sounds like you are letting someone hook up an implement while on a running tractor, perhaps in a range gear but foot ont he brake/ sounds like bad news to me.. same as having a person in clsoe proximity to a moving machine.. besides.. your argument predisposes that a gear machine can not have a creeper gear. I've seen plenty of machines with creeper gears that move in the (low ) feet per minute range.

wider range??? how.. the tractors have the same basic controls.. the workings of those controls are different, but the end result is exactly the same.. an op in either machine can manipulate the hyds, and make the tractor move forward or back, steer, operate the pto, etc... As with any equation involving a non senient tool and a human, the human is the one making the situation safe or not... not the tool ]]

soundguy

These are extraneous arguments to the obvious. Truisms, some specious, inaccurately applied...
larry

 

[jenkinsph]

These are extraneous arguments to the obvious. Truisms, some specious, inaccurately applied...
larry

A new tractor buyer would do well to test both types before making a purchase decision understanding that both gear and hydro transmissions seem to be very reliable. This would be much easier than trying to make sense of this thread. Nothing constructive being added by either side and way too much BS.

 

[RoyJackson]

Soundguy, I've driven both gear and HST tractors... hope you have as well.

Safety for me comes from the following:

extreme slowness of operation without risk of foot slipping off clutch

significantly reduced exhaustion factor when operating all day

if something happens, just get off the hydro pedal and vehicle stops
moving.. much faster and more smoothly, IMHO, than reaching for clutch and brake.

When at risk of tipping, HST can creep far slower than a gear tractor, thus you can "feel" your way into and past the danger point, or stop before getting TOO far into it so you can take remedial action (drop FEL, change angle of front wheels, etc.)

When operating with a partner in front or rear, extreme slow operation allows partner to get out of way and stay there when hooking up implements, chains, etc.

Agreed, either tractor can be operated in an unsafe manner if you really try.
HST gives a wider range of safe operation and recovery options, IMHO.

As regards reliability, this topic has been addressed before on TBN... and my recollection is that HST was viewed as extremely reliable, even more so than gear/clutch.

In the long run, however, HST or Gear seems to be a mostly religious/emotional argument with proponents on both sides...... some of whom are extremists!

It's a bit obvious you don't have much experience wth geared tractors.
The throttle controls the speed...and believe me, a tractor in low gear and low rpm crawls!
And, as far as reliability...assuming one knows what they're doing, a gear transmission will last a long long time.
You're just trying to justify the extra money you spent on the hydro, I think. And, I suggest you're last comment shows you're taking this thread too seriously...and maybe you aren't the only one. I'd suggest we're all forgeting these are nothing more then machines.

 

[JC-jetro]

This argument more and more sounds like " right wing branch of Republicans vs left wing branch of Democrats" and there is never a winner. As so elaborately stated here on many occasions both HST and gear tranny are just fine for given situation and application. I love my gear tractor and feel perfectly safe with it but sure would like to have an HST tractor with good FEL as well. I would never let go off my gear tractor when I buy an HST


JC

 

[timnjaneb]

Having grown up on a farm in the 50s and spent many hours on tractors of various brands gives me some perspective on such issues. In the 70s I owned several small tractors mostly for fun, IH Cub, A and an Allis C and a larger Massey 55 with a 4 bottom plow. Four years ago I could "justify" a compact tractor and now have a 32.5 HP tractor with Hydro Transmission.

My initial thoughts were to purchase a standard transmission due to cost and knowing that it should be the most reliable and last a life time. Well my nephew who was the service manager at the dealership where I purchased it soon talked me into the hydro. The gist of the conversation was. "Hey! We sell $400,000.00 combines which only come with hydros and your brother's 12 year old combine has never caused a moments trouble as far as the transmission is concerned. Now because I have a pretty good idea of how you are going to use this machine I really think you should have the hydro."

I took his advice and have been more than pleased with the decision ever since. First off with a hydro plowing snow or grading a gravel drive way is a real treat as you can maintain a high rpm and power ratio to various ground speeds from creeping around obstructions to flying at top speeds with only the amount you depress the pedal.. And even more important the infinitely various ground speed while maintaining proper PTO speed really comes in to play with equipment such as a tiller, sickle bar mower and other such equipment. This became so apparent to me when I loaded my tiller on the trailer and took it down for my BIL to use. His equally high quality gear tractor was not capable of doing a good job of tilling as the lowest gear was still too high of a ground speed. Make sure the tractor comes with a good cruise control on it then you can then set it for .1 MPH on up to anything the tractor is capable of in increments of .1 MPH.

Many times I yearn for the good old days, but not when I think about the tractors and equipment that I used then in comparison to what is available today. Still like to drive an old Cub but mostly just for the fun of it.
Tim

 

[jenkinsph]

It's a bit obvious you don't have much experience wth geared tractors.
The throttle controls the speed...and believe me, a tractor in low gear and low rpm crawls!
And, as far as reliability...assuming one knows what they're doing, a gear transmission will last a long long time.
You're just trying to justify the extra money you spent on the hydro, I think. And, I suggest you're last comment shows you're taking this thread too seriously...and maybe you aren't the only one. I'd suggest we're all forgeting these are nothing more then machines.

Roy,
Why not run an ehydro for a few years and get back to us.

 

[canzipper]

The 3 Greatest Inventions of the last 50 years.

1. The TV remote
2. The HST transmission
3. A tie between: The GPS navigational system and
the battery-operated personal vibrator

 

[Matt_Jr]

The 3 Greatest Inventions of the last 50 years.

1. The TV remote
2. The HST transmission
3. A tie between: The GPS navigational system and
the battery-operated personal vibrator

Battery-operated personal vibrator?.

 

[mostly_gas]

If I sound like I am "bad mouthing" HST then you are missing my point. I had a friend who killed himself on a tractor years ago. He thought he could control the tractor well enough to hook to the top of his 3pt and flipped the tractor over backwards. He knew better but did it anyway. To restate my point, better tools don't fix bad decisions.

 

[Soundguy]

I disagree. I have owned the tractors from 50 and 60 years ago and still have one from 35 years ago. The new ones are easier to operate, and safer to use. Experience is an important component of safe tractor operation, it is not the only component though.


I remember the good old days, used to kill people,

That's an awfull vauge statement there.

A new tractor is safer and easier to operate than an old one?

Hmm..

Yep.. uh.. no not really.. can't drawn -any- usefull conclusions from that statement.

Lets compair my 75 ford 5000 ( same as a 65 by the way for the purpose of this argument ).. and my 2000 NH 7610s.

same op platform.. same twin stick crash box.. same hand throttle in the same place.. same on off switch ( same key fits either! ) same op controls and same info from the dash.


7610s does have flasers mounted differently.. but 5000 DOES have them.

rops are available for the 5000, so you can nix that difference.

takes the same amount of work to stomp either clutch and push a couple sticks into gear...

easier and safer huh... hmmm...

soundguy