10% Ethanol, Heads Up!

[keegs]

A few simple ideas:
1) Trade out V8 gas for diesel V6 in trucks and SUVs pulling less than 10,000lb
2) Trade in 4 and 6 cylinder diesel or DI gas/turbo for whatever else is in passenger cars these days
3) Crank up the gas tax to encourage more efficient engines and to pay down the deficit (tied to some sort of cap on spending). Works in Europe. I know this is getting political but I'd gladly pay more taxes if it meant conserving fuel so we don't send our treasure and troops overseas to keep us moving.

How is it that our European forebearers seem to be able to travel and do business with about half the fuel per mile we do? Whatever that combo is would be a good target even if we don't cut our use by quite as much.

I just bought a new SUV that averages about 19mpg. That sucks. I'd have gladly traded a couple of seconds in 0-60 for a 25mpg average but didn't have the choice. I was disappointed that the only way I could have purchased a diesel SUV was by forking over $50-60+K to Mercedes, VW BMW or Audi. I'm not that stupid having already suffered for twelve years with my last MB SUV. The Jetta diesel is great but not quite big enough for my purposes. Why can't we get fuel efficient diesels in non luxury vehicles made outside Germany? The Germans only charge an extra grand or two or three for a modern diesel. I'd pay that no question to get 25mpg from an SUV. I would have been happy to pay a premium to buy GM or Ford or any Japanese or Korean brand if they sold one with a modern diesel.

I'm on the fence with the diesels. They get better mileage but fuel costs are typically higher and I'm not sure whether there's that much benefit when you consider how much can be derived from a barrel of imported oil.

You implied a higher fuel economy standard. I agree with that and we're in fact heading for 34.1 by 2016. I just sold my Toyota Echo, it averaged 41-45 mpg. I'm now driving a new Cobalt XFE. It's averaging 40.1 mpg right now. There are and have been plenty of good quality, relatively inexpensive, fuel efficient options out there. Getting people in them has been the issue IMO.

I'm also on the fence with an additional tax on fuel. I wouldn't mind paying it myself but in rural areas gas prices are already higher, incomes are typically much lower and distances traveled much greater. The 34.1 mpg CAFE standard by 2016 seems more equitable idea.

 

[IslandTractor]

I'm also on the fence with an additional tax on fuel. I wouldn't mind paying it myself but in rural areas gas prices are already higher, incomes are typically much lower and distances traveled much greater. The 34.1 mpg CAFE standard by 2016 seems more equitable idea.

I agree there needs to be some protection for those in rural areas or with long commutes but I imagine there are ways to refund or make some sort of tax credit available in such situations. A little creativity is called for.

 

[MossRoad]

I read an interesting article a couple years ago that mentioned how inefficient it is to produce automobile fuel from corn. It takes too much energy to convert it to ethanol to make it cost effective. The article concluded it would be much more cost effective and energy efficient to switch our cars to natural gas and burn corn to heat our homes. Corn, when burnt, is a very efficient fuel. When converted to alcohol, not so efficient. Ponder that one for a while.

 

[Duffster]

I read an interesting article a couple years ago that mentioned how inefficient it is to produce automobile fuel from corn. It takes too much energy to convert it to ethanol to make it cost effective. The article concluded it would be much more cost effective and energy efficient to switch our cars to natural gas and burn corn to heat our homes. Corn, when burnt, is a very efficient fuel. When converted to alcohol, not so efficient. Ponder that one for a while.

This has been prove wrong by pretty legitimate studies. Several of them in fact.

 

[tallyho8]

Americans are too spoiled to drive small fuel efficient vehicles. In the 1960s cars outsold trucks by 4 to 1. As cars started getting smaller more people simply started buying trucks and the manufacturers started gearing trucks for personal use, such as making 3 door then 4 door pickup trucks.

Just a couple of years ago trucks finally outsold cars for the first time in history.

If the gov't mandates higher mpg ratings on small trucks we will soon see buses and semis parked in people's driveways.

 

[beppington]

This has been prove wrong by pretty legitimate studies. Several of them in fact.

Link(s)?

 

[dmccarty]

Dan...If you couldn't sell your house because it got in your well water would you blame the government?

Keegs not really sure what you are getting at....

Are you saying if my house fell into the well I should blame the government?

Later,
Dan

 

[mmurphy]

I'm on the fence with the diesels. They get better mileage but fuel costs are typically higher and I'm not sure whether there's that much benefit when you consider how much can be derived from a barrel of imported oil.

You implied a higher fuel economy standard. I agree with that and we're in fact heading for 34.1 by 2016. I just sold my Toyota Echo, it averaged 41-45 mpg. I'm now driving a new Cobalt XFE. It's averaging 40.1 mpg right now. There are and have been plenty of good quality, relatively inexpensive, fuel efficient options out there. Getting people in them has been the issue IMO.

I'm also on the fence with an additional tax on fuel. I wouldn't mind paying it myself but in rural areas gas prices are already higher, incomes are typically much lower and distances traveled much greater. The 34.1 mpg CAFE standard by 2016 seems more equitable idea.

The one thing on fuel economy that people do not understand with alcohol is, if a car was to run on nothing but alcohol, you can get as much mileage and power as gasoline. Reason being is timing with engines on gasoline is not set to fire at the proper time or you get detonation. Gasoline engines run at a lower compression or you get detonation. Now if we were to use studies as an example I heard less then 5% actually is used for transporting the person in the vehicle. I myself once again think that is a crock. Diesel gets better economy because it does not have the same issues.
If we did not have the government involved in controlling manufacturing of alcohol, the cost of making it to run an engine straight would be much cheaper. You can run a engine as low as 70% with 30% still being tied up in water content.(140 proof) That would save lots of energy getting that 30 % water content off. Alcohol can only be dried now naturaly to 94%, the rest is ran through a mechanical drying system that requires lots of heat. By mixing with gas, any portion of water left behind, well you have problems, cause we all know water and gas does not mix. Straight alcohol would evenly absorb the water and no problem.
Google David Blume if any one is interested in "Alcohol Can Be a Gas."

 

[beppington]

Keegs not really sure what you are getting at....

Are you saying if my house fell into the well I should blame the government?

:laughing:

 

[keegs]

Keegs not really sure what you are getting at....

Are you saying if my house fell into the well I should blame the government?

Later,
Dan

Your house fell in a well Dan??? How'd you manage that? :laughing: