Ballast It must be a conspiracy.

[jesseb3@att.net]

The balance issue holds true for virtually every type of tractor or excavator. If you do a search for "Loader endo", "Loader stoppie", "Dancing diggers" on youtube, you'll see even the big boys could do with a little more weight. (And the employers could do a better job of hiring.)

These guys are doing this intentionally, but if you've never seen these videos before, you may be suprised that those big loaders lift enough to counter their own engine's weight.

YouTube - Front End Loader Stoppie
YouTube - loader stoppie

I can't imagine how heavy my BX2350 would have to be to counter the implements, since weight attached to the tractor itself isn't nearly as effective as a longer (moment) implement.

 

[mwb]

... Kubota should definitely have some basic charts for calculating load and slope angles...

Manufactures are not able to do this for a few reasons; the first one would be liability. Second reason is dynamics; they have no way of calculating your center of gravity while on a slope lifting a load. They have no idea what you have or don't have for weights, 3pt implement, etc. Firmness of the ground, rate of speed and turns are also critical.

I bet a lot of tips happen not during raising loads but when lowering them; if you are lowering and stop with a jerk that would be the "straw that broke the camel's back".

The limits of your machine, and you as an operator have to be based on common sense and experience. Hopefully you have the first and don't wreck yourself getting the second.

 

[TripleR]

Manufactures are not able to do this for a few reasons; the first one would be liability. Second reason is dynamics; they have no way of calculating your center of gravity while on a slope lifting a load. They have no idea what you have or don't have for weights, 3pt implement, etc. Firmness of the ground, rate of speed and turns are also critical.

I bet a lot of tips happen not during raising loads but when lowering them; if you are lowering and stop with a jerk that would be the "straw that broke the camel's back".

The limits of your machine, and you as an operator have to be based on common sense and experience. Hopefully you have the first and don't wreck yourself getting the second.

Agree completely, just too many variables and I can guarantee that any table would be far too conservative to be of any real use. An example of this can be found on some of the implement limitations IE width of cutters etc.

 

[corey9212]

What they could do though is state maximum load without any ballast or counter weight and state max load with ballast or counter weight. Cause the manual just states what the maximum load the loader can handle. I know there is a lot of variables but having what the max load is with just the loader and tractor with nothing else on it is a good start to knowing limits.

 

[TripleR]

What they could do though is state maximum load without any ballast or counter weight and state max load with ballast or counter weight. Cause the manual just states what the maximum load the loader can handle. I know there is a lot of variables but having what the max load is with just the loader and tractor with nothing else on it is a good start to knowing limits.

Having spent years in courts watching lawyers get rich, I think doing so would only open them up to lawsuits when someone used this as an excuse for their mistake. Look at the millions Yamaha has been out with lawsuits on the Rhino.

Someone like nebraskasparks or an engineer could explain the variance in a static load or one in motion etc, and I believe due to product liability, the numbers given would be useless, I think my Rhino or Grizzly manuals say not to ascend a grade in excess of 15%. Who pays any attention to that, but it gets the manufacturer off the hook.

 

[corey9212]

Bu going by that then the manual shouldn't be giving the maximum lift capacity especially without saying with proper ballast. A lot of new people (I know a few) who got a tractor with a FEL for the first time and used it without any weight on the back and ended up in a bad situation very fast. They said they were under the max weight the loader can handle and can't figure it out cause it doesn't say max weight with counter weights. They see big tractors with nothing on the rear using a FEL with ease and not tipping so the little ones should as well. We of course know different but we were once all there and could have used that bit extra info. From the manual.

 

[TripleR]

Bu going by that then the manual shouldn't be giving the maximum lift capacity especially without saying with proper ballast. A lot of new people (I know a few) who got a tractor with a FEL for the first time and used it without any weight on the back and ended up in a bad situation very fast. They said they were under the max weight the loader can handle and can't figure it out cause it doesn't say max weight with counter weights. They see big tractors with nothing on the rear using a FEL with ease and not tipping so the little ones should as well. We of course know different but we were once all there and could have used that bit extra info. From the manual.

I have never seen a tractor manual that did not address the need for proper counter balance.

 

[corey9212]

It does later on in the manual. But at the beginning where it gives the specs it should say with proper counter weights. To cover their butts for legal issues. Some people don't read the manual till it's too late and an incident has happened (it was the case with my neighbor) she bought a tractor and FEL the dealer showed her how to use it, she got it home and started using it and tipped it forward cause of too much weight and no counter weight. She looked at the specs and it said it can lift that much so she called the dealer and they couldn't figure it out why it tipped (they presumed she knew about counter weights so never mentioned it to her) I talked to her and told her about them and showed her in the manual where near the end it talked about using them.

 

[rdsaustintx]

All the warning labels make 'em top-heavy.

 

[corey9212]

Anyone want to start a school teaching new owners how to safely use their equipment? Lesson one read manual before use. Lesson two read warning labels, lol. Seriously though it would be great idea to have some sort of school teaching people how to safely use equipment. Too many farmers need help but don't wan to train and too many new people getting tractors and don't know how to safely operate. We have courses for regular drivers and big truck drivers, now how about tractor drivers and using implements.