nortrac dozer need help with a repair

[20 20]

Hey folks just wondering if any of the dozer owners have had to take apart the final drive on the nortrac dozer, left side? I am trying to get the "drive shaft{part#13}" out of the "final big driving gear {Part #6}". I'm not sure if these are pressed together or if when it broke it jammed itself in there. There is limited space to push from the inside{toward PTO}, maybe 4". My shaft broke right at the "final big driving gear" so I have no way to grab it from the outside. Thanks for any help.

 

[Bob Rooks]

Let me get to my book. You may have to heat and press the gear of you twisted the splines.

 

[20 20]

Thanks Bob Rooks. It twisted off just before it enters the "final big driving gear" I was/am hoping that it is just suppose to slide in. I'm affraid if I put to much pressure on the shaft I may end up breaking something else.

 

[Bob Rooks]

After you remove the bull gear, remove #1 through #5 then knock out the broken spline shaft from the tractor side.
I'm on my phone so I'm limited

 

[Bob Rooks]

Replace all of the bearings and seals for the drive shaft too.

 

[20 20]

Thanks again Bob Rooks; That is where I am at right now I have everything removed even 3/4 of the driveshaft{where it broke off} I have put a small scissor jack against the shaft {tractor side} and tried to jack it out. So far no luck, I'm trying to figure away to get more leverage on the shaft from the tractor side. Part #6 is lose but can not be takin out because of what is left of the driveshaft #13. It must have jammed itself enough to be a pain, I really don't think it should be this tight????


Just so everyone knows, this happened while dredging out a pond. I was in about 2+ feet of muck and must have got a rock stuck in the track. The dozer never gave any issues I was even backing up to make sure I still had hard ground to continue on. The rock must have pinched in while backing up{no way to see through the goop}, once it caught and snapped it was to late. This was in no way an issue with the dozer, my fault completely.

 

[teg]

Friend broke his the same way, rock in the track.

That must have been fun getting yours out of the "goop"

 

[20 20]

Teg, that is exactly what happened to mine, I finally got the %&^%&^ thing to pop out some heat and a rubber mallet.
I bought an old hein werner excavator{40,000lb machine}awhile back that is what more or less picked it up and pulled it out of the soup. We tried hooking chains and cables but they kept breaking even the hooks. I finally drove as close as I could and used the bucket to pick up the front and turn the dozer, then hooked a chain and pulled it out.

Looks like getting parts is going to be a real blast :drool:

 

[Bob Rooks]

Looks like getting parts is going to be a real blast :drool:

I have found that Circle-G stocks the most dozer parts. If you know of anybody else, I'd appreciate it.

Working in slurry is one of the worst conditions for tracked machines, especially the glacial till variety. If these dozers had decent rock guards and carrier covers it would greatly reduce failures like this.

 

[20 20]

Hey Bob Rooks I'll keep my eyes open I have started ordering parts from CG. I called Northern Tool a few days back to give them a heads up on what happened and that I may need to order parts. The guy that day told me "no problem we have all the dozer parts in stock". Well quess what, today I call to make an order and for some reason the only part they had was ONE seal everything else would be back ordered, for who knows how long {I was told possibly 3+weeks}. I'm going to see if a friend can machine the driveshaft out, if he can I'll probably get it cheaper and a whole lot faster.

I agree working in the slop can be nasty and most of this area was covered in glaciers way back when. I did remove the rock guards because in my opinion they did more harm then good for most of what I do. The rock guards seem to hold rocks in, instead of keeping them out. What I was doing this time, I don't know if the guards would have helped or not???? I believe this rock came from the top side??? I still can't complain about the machine especially for what I paid and how well it has worked. I believe any time we decide to play with tracked machines things are going to get pricy sooner or later.

 

[Bob Rooks]

Hey Bob Rooks I'll keep my eyes open I have started ordering parts from CG.
Who is CG?

I'm going to see if a friend can machine the driveshaft out, if he can I'll probably get it cheaper and a whole lot faster.
By the time your friend cuts one from 4140 steel and mills the splines I doubt that it will be cheaper than OEM, but it's worth a shot. Tell him to keep the drawings, he may have some future customers

I did remove the rock guards because in my opinion they did more harm then good for most of what I do. The rock guards seem to hold rocks in, instead of keeping them out.
The OEM rock guards should not be called rock guards, they are superfluous sheet metal IMHO.

What I was doing this time, I don't know if the guards would have helped or not???? I believe this rock came from the top side???
Real rock guards that are close to the rollers is the only thing that really works. One of the inherent misgivings of tracked machines is that they will carry soil and rocks on the backside of the tracks and dump them right on top of the swing frames where they fall through and land on track links. Most all dozers since the late 50's have sheet metal covers on the swing frames and trunnions.

I believe any time we decide to play with tracked machines things are going to get pricy sooner or later.
Yep!:thumbsup::laughing:

12345

 

[20 20]

CG is Circle G. They have most everything in stock, so far the only ones I can find. I did talk to the guy but he can not do the job he wouldn't be able to cut the splines.

I agree about the "rock gaurds"

 

[20 20]

Well started to put things back together having a real hard time getting the last bearing in, closest to machine. And to top that off, now the starter doesn't want to engage. I had to walk away before I completely lost my temper, this repair should not be this hard

 

[Bob Rooks]

Are you having problems getting the bearing into the housing or onto the shaft?

Does the starter just spin without engaging the flywheel?
Did you check the clutch safety switch?
Is the battery fully charged?

Being a heavy duty equipment mechanic can have it's frustrations but it's far better (IMHO) than office politics.
Take a deep breath and count to ten...:thumbsup::laughing:

 

[JoelD]

Surprised to see that shaft shear like that, would expect the motor to stall first. Would hate to think something like this would happen each time you get a rock stuck in the track??

Joel

 

[Bob Rooks]

Surprised to see that shaft shear like that, would expect the motor to stall first. Would hate to think something like this would happen each time you get a rock stuck in the track??

Joel

Seen much worse on D7's, 8's & 944's. Happens to the best of them regardless of metallurgical prowess.

 

[20 20]

Surprised to see that shaft shear like that, would expect the motor to stall first. Would hate to think something like this would happen each time you get a rock stuck in the track??

Joel

The engine never even died down I quess it was just one of those things, who knows maybe the shaft was faulty from the start? The rock was big and because I was in deep muck I never saw it.

 

[20 20]

Are you having problems getting the bearing into the housing or onto the shaft?

Into the housing I took another look this morning and believe it is at a very slight angle which more then likely is causing it to bind. I was thinking of getting one of those mini hydraulic kits with a small ram to help press things together. Infact I think it might have been a post you made about how you use the pull back ram to help put tracks on{???} I've used a come-along to pull the track before but it is a bit clumsy.

Does the starter just spin without engaging the flywheel?

I shorted it out at the starter and all it'd do is spin, might have got some muck into it???

Did you check the clutch safety switch?
Is the battery fully charged?

Safety swith is okay, battery was new last winter plus I've had it on a charger and also used another good battery to try and jump start. I'm also wondering if a wire came lose somewhere?

Being a heavy duty equipment mechanic can have it's frustrations but it's far better (IMHO) than office politics.
Take a deep breath and count to ten...:thumbsup::laughing:

Agreed. I figured it was better to walk away and get a new outlook instead of stand there frustrated and messing things up while loosing tamper :laughing:

 

[Bob Rooks]

You definitely don't want to force a bearing in while it's cocked, it must go in straight. You can pack the bearing in dry ice for four to six hours and warm the housing slightly with a heat lamp, then it should fall right in if it's correctly lined up. I would also use some green anerobic compound such as Loctite Bearing Mount around the outer race.

The issue with the starter appears to be that the solenoid isn't pulling the pinion gear into the flywheel. This has been an issue with these solenoids that have gotten wet and corroded on the inside. They can be taken apart and cleaned. I recommend using dry graphite lube on the solenoid plunger because it won't thicken and gum-up with low temperatures, and doesn't attract dust and dirt.
You can also purchase new solenoids separately.

 

[20 20]

Thanks again Bob Rocks, It was the bearing being cocked. I didn't force it, gave up before that happened. straightened things out and it went in straight. I still had to leave it unfinished though, the rain took over so I have to wait. Hopefully tomorrow the weather will give me enough time to atleast get the rear end back together.

Are the starters like the ones on the tractors? I did have to take my 254 apart and clean that up, after that I never had another problem. Oh I also forgot the switch made a buzzing noise but nothing would engage, now all it will do is click. I'm wondering if the mucking clay was thin enough to get into the solenoid/starter? The starter doesn't look to hard to get at once the left engine guard is off. Again I'm hoping ma nature will give me a long enough break to work on the dozer. I hate leaving my machinery out in the weather, this time I didn't have a choice.