Consumer Reports on Vehicle Manufacturs.

[Diamondpilot]

Firstly, in my opinion Consumer Reports isn't worth the paper it's printed on. Especially in the automotive world, you get much more in-depth analysis from people who actually understand cars and trucks from magazines like Motor Trend. Consumer Reports is fine for little appliances but I wouldn't take any car/truck recommendations from them.

Nissan and Dodge were going to exchange vehicle manufacturing with Dodge rebadging RAM's as Nissan's in exchange for Dodge rebadging small Nissan cars. That deal was dissolved when Fiat acquired Chrysler since they will be making the next line of small cars for Dodge/Chrysler. Nissan will be redesigning the Titan for 2012 model year.
It's too bad because that Titan needs a good 400hp HEMI!

On your first point I agree with you. Its not worth much to me either. Edmunds is even worse. I would swear they are owned by GM and the US government which is one in the same.

The main reason I posted it was because I was sent it and I actually have been impressed with the GM products that have been making there way to the dealers here in the last 6 months.

On your second point I was unaware that Nissan and Dodge dissolved the deal. Good thing. That was the reason I went out and bought a Titan a year and a half ago. I had always wanted one but wanted nothing to do with a Dodge built one, especially with a Hemi.

Lets face it. We agree on some points but not on trucks. Thats fine. We can have a good rib at each other and buy what we want. Its America.

Chris

 

[brokenot]

I really don't believe they are independent either. Anything Asian=good. Anything US=bad. This is the first time in my life I've seen any objective report from them on US manufacturers. Maybe because of the gov't money?..Who knows.

While I may not put much stock in what's reported by CR either, it's not because I think they necessarily have any bias.

Their title says it all: "Consumer Reports". They do surveys and compile the data they receive from those surveys. If they report a better result for one brand/model, they're only reporting it. They have no control over who does or doesn't choose to participate in a survey about a particular product, nor do they have any control over whether or not a person choosing to participate in a survey comes into it with any bias themselves, or.....whether or not the person participating in a survey is volunteering anything resembling useful information. What one person considers a minor annoyance when it comes to a product, is the end of the world in another person's eyes.

But they're both looking at the same survey form and trying to decide which box to check on that form. The question might be, "Has you vehicle experienced any major issues?" One consumer may choose "no", while another may check the "yes" box.....even though their vehicles produced the exact same performance/reliability/etc., because people perceive things differently AND have different sets of expectations.

All of those "yes" and "no" answers are sorted and compiled, and the end result is "Consumer Reports".

 

[timswi]

What I found amusing was that they rated my GMC as a good vehicle and the exact same year Siverado as below average. They are exactly the same truck.....Things that make you go hmmm.

 

[buck12]

i wonder if the perceived gas peddle/floor mat issues was responsible for lowering the toyota rating by 3 spots?

From what I have seen from friends and family Toyota's problems are bigger than floor mats. My mother's new Camary required a water pump before 25,000 miles. My boss's new Toyota truck required a new transmission at 10,000 miles. I know these are isolated incidents but it seems their quality has slipped.

 

[JoelD]

I had to replace a tranny on the wife's crv at 80000 miles I purchased a honda to avoid such issues

My dodge durango still drives strong at 125000 and I'm towing a boat with it granted I need to replace the ball joints every so often but they are cheap and easy to do

Joel

 

[brokenot]

What I found amusing was that they rated my GMC as a good vehicle and the exact same year Siverado as below average. They are exactly the same truck.....Things that make you go hmmm.

That's what I mean. They really didn't "rate" it at all. They compiled data they received into a report. They have no control over how accurate/appropriate any commentary or opinions they receive from consumers is.

If anyone has any ideas about how they could weed out consumers with bias, an axe to grind, unrealistic expectations, misconceptions, etc. I'm sure CR would love to hear 'em.

As an example, a few years ago when we were shopping for a new sedan for my wife, I read a few report summaries and some of the owner commentary selected to be included with the score summaries.

Two in particular caught my eye, and I've wondered ever since if CR included them to *sort of* clue readers in as to what is often going on with consumer perceptions and how those perceptions can skew the report results because peoples' emotions can very much determine which boxes are checked on a form when they're asked to answer a question like, "rate your satisfaction by checking one of the four boxes below".

Consumer "A" bought a Honda after years of hearing from others how great they were. He had a minor mechanical issue in the first few months he had it. It made no difference that the issue was resolved....he was still mad because he'd heard nothing but good things and made his purchase based on that. He assumed his choice was some sort of guarantee that there would be no issues ever.

Consumer "B" purchased a domestic sedan, and reported that despite all of the poor reliability/dealer service ratings the car had received, his new car had "almost 10,000 miles on it and has had NO issues.....so there!" He obviously thought that the ability to go 10K without any trips to the dealer proved that what everyone else had said about the vehicle was wrong.

Perception is a powerful thing.

 

[MESSMAKER]

I think CR gives you some useful info. It is not difficult to point out when a vehicle has the most features for the money or even the best performance. The trouble starts when time goes buy and things start to break. They all break sometimes and some way more than others. How do you track this? Where is this info? The best source is the people that have the vehicles. CR gets info from the readers through a yearly survey. Does the system have flaws? Of course, It involves people. Some that are pissed off because of their vehicle. If 1000 f-150 trucks are sold and the only the people that have sour grapes return the survey, It will be skewed, and it will appear that it is a worse vehicle than it is. The fact that trucks are all pretty good and they come in dozens of different configurations. It makes it difficult to compare apples to apples.

 

[Diamondpilot]

That's what I mean. They really didn't "rate" it at all. They compiled data they received into a report. They have no control over how accurate/appropriate any commentary or opinions they receive from consumers is.

If anyone has any ideas about how they could weed out consumers with bias, an axe to grind, unrealistic expectations, misconceptions, etc. I'm sure CR would love to hear 'em.

As an example, a few years ago when we were shopping for a new sedan for my wife, I read a few report summaries and some of the owner commentary selected to be included with the score summaries.

Two in particular caught my eye, and I've wondered ever since if CR included them to *sort of* clue readers in as to what is often going on with consumer perceptions and how those perceptions can skew the report results because peoples' emotions can very much determine which boxes are checked on a form when they're asked to answer a question like, "rate your satisfaction by checking one of the four boxes below".

Consumer "A" bought a Honda after years of hearing from others how great they were. He had a minor mechanical issue in the first few months he had it. It made no difference that the issue was resolved....he was still mad because he'd heard nothing but good things and made his purchase based on that. He assumed his choice was some sort of guarantee that there would be no issues ever.

Consumer "B" purchased a domestic sedan, and reported that despite all of the poor reliability/dealer service ratings the car had received, his new car had "almost 10,000 miles on it and has had NO issues.....so there!" He obviously thought that the ability to go 10K without any trips to the dealer proved that what everyone else had said about the vehicle was wrong.

Perception is a powerful thing.

I think you hit the nail on the head. A co worker of mine bought his first Ford 15 years ago. It had a shimmy in it above 70 mph. He searched out the best deal in the country and bought 2 states away. Now he has a car with a shimmy and the local dealer really does not want to work on it because he took his business else where. They did replace a few parts but it did not help. I always thought it was a bad tire but he sold it with 30,000 miles on it. Long story short he will never own another.

We only work with 6 people and 4 of us have owned a Ford/Lincoln/Mercury consistantly for nearly the 20 years we have worked together and none of us have had any major issues. Biggest thing were power windows, ball joints, ect. He still will not give them another try. He is now a GM man. He now has a 2005 Yukon with 88,000 miles that has just had the AC replaced this summer, got a tranny last year, had to have the front axle fixed, ect. He thinks that is acceptable and loves GM while he throws money and time at it and the rest of us keep on trucking. Kind of funny but I have went and picked up his truck twice now with my trailer and my Ford. By the way, his son and wife drive GM products also, a Pontiac and a Caddy. Both of them have been towed in this year also. His older son has a F-150 and it stranded him with a dead battery and he bad mouths it up and down. I mean come on, its a 05 with a dead battery.

Chris

 

[JD755]

Remember three years ago (before the later acceleration issues), amidst widespread quality problems with Toyotas, Consumer Reports CEO had to apologize when it was revealed they were automatically giving all Toyotas an automatic "recommended buy" without ever testing them?

WardsAuto.com, Oct 16, 2007 3:55 PM
The poor performance of the three vehicles also is causing the magazine to stop automatically recommending new Toyotas as reliable. In the past, because of its sterling quality record, CR automatically would recommend a new model to its readers without any testing or survey data.

Now, only two brands will get such treatment, Honda and Subaru, though Champion says that status could be reinstated to Toyota in the future.

 

[dodge man]

I can remember filling out one of their surveys years ago. I can't remember what problem I had with the vehicle, but it was something easy and cheap to fix, like a thermostat. Sure enough, I noticed a year or two later, that car had poor marks for the cooling system, even thought it cost me like 10 bucks to fix. You have to filter the data a little bit. I can in all honsetly say I've only had one vehicle I hated and had a lot of problems with, a 77 Ford Granada, which was my first vehcile and given to me by my dad. The rest I have lived with the problems and fixed what needed fixed.