What to look on a Plasma Cutter?

   / What to look on a Plasma Cutter? #31  
As the 11th Employee....I did not get a chance to help name Hypertherm. The name was the name of a project that the founder used in his previous job as a project engineer working on plasma research and development.

We do however have a Powermax45.....it has been suggested that we would sell more if it was called the Colt45....

Jim
 
   / What to look on a Plasma Cutter? #32  
As the 11th Employee....I did not get a chance to help name Hypertherm. The name was the name of a project that the founder used in his previous job as a project engineer working on plasma research and development.

We do however have a Powermax45.....it has been suggested that we would sell more if it was called the Colt45....

Jim

I have a PowerMax45 - I'm getting out my Sharpie when I get home....

-Jer.
 
   / What to look on a Plasma Cutter? #33  
There are some cases, as I said previously, where a cheaper purchase price may be the best decision on a plasma cutter, just as it may be with any other tool.

A few years ago (actually about 30 years!) I was pretty young and had a passion for metal fabrication. I worked for a small company in NH that had 11 employees, that produced 1 product, a 1000 Amp mechanized only plasma cutter that could cut 6" aluminum and stainless. We worked hard, built about 3 of these systems a month, and didn't make much money. When I went home, and on weekends I worked in my garage building racecars, trailers, tractor implements with my low cost used and cheap import welding and cutting equipment (there were no hand held plasma's that could run on air and single phase power at the time). I bought cheap tools, and searched for used equipment that I could fix up...so that I could work (play) in my shop in my spare time.

Today Hypertherm has over 1200 employees (all have stock in the company), we have over 35 different plasma cutting products, and are (by far) the largest manufacturers of plasma cutting equipment in the world. We can produce in the range of 5000 plasma systems a month. I still work hard, and I make a bit more money, and I still have a passion for metal fabricating. My home shop is bigger, I can afford better tools, and someday my sons will own all of the equipment. I buy equipment that works as advertised, that will last and have parts available for many years, and that I expect my sons to be able to get some use out of.

So....when you talk pricing and performance on major tools such as a plasma cutter or a welder....the above types of life situations certainly have an effect on the amount you pay. The other alyternative to buying low cost import equipment (which means sending your money to another continent!) is to use the internet and find good used equipment from a major supplier that can meet all your criteria for use. I still buy used equipment if it is a major brand....just bought a 6 year old Miller 250 Amp Mig for far less than an import....and I am very sure that service and parts will be available for a long time!

Plasma systems (power supplies and torches) are not all alike. 60 Amps on one model does not cut like 60 Amps on another model, trust me. There are major engineering breakthroughs in torch technology that occur monthly....but only from the companies that make a big investment in that engineering. When the patents expire 13 to 17 years later, the other manufacturers can catch up. The breakthroughs involve higher energy density, better control of cut angularity, faster cut speeds at a given amperage, better piercing capability, ease of use, reliability, and of course...lower operating cost.

Most of the import plasma's use torch designs that are copies of older technology. One of the most common import plasma torches is a copy of an over 30 year old Esab PT31 torch! Another is of an almost 20 year old Trafumet (italian) torch design. Even some of the major plasma system producers only come up with new torch designs every 10 to 15 years.

Hypertherm has over 75 plasma patents, mostly on torch and consumable designs, but others are related to gas flow control, power supply output control, all of these technology breakthroughs are to improve performance, reliability and to lower the cost of operation.

So, to conclude:

- yes Jim Colt (Me) may be biased on his first choice for plasma cutting...but he has been around, and can offer good advice....which is what this thread's original poster was looking for!

-Try out a few different plasma systems on the thickest and thinnest materials you are going to cut. Your local welding supply store is a good place. You also can go to the manufacturers and ask for a specific cut sample....or better yet ask me. I'll cut a part and post a picture for everyone!

-Make your price decision based on whhat you are going to use it for, how long you plan to keep it.

- Don't forget....there are a lot of good used plasma systems out on the market. Craigslist is a great source. If anyone finds a used Hypertherm, contact me and I'll tell you what it is worth, or I may even tell you to steer clear (depending on vintage and model!)

- It is not Amps that does the cutting.....it is Load Voltage X Amps, which equals killoWatts. The best systems may have a lower amperage rating, but will have a higher killowatt rating, duty cycle rating, and a better technology torch.

Jim Colt

We do not use the pt31x...But if the basic torch is still being used by ESAB and others, it must be a good design. But what is being claimed as breakthroughs make some difference, but in reality, not everything really helps that much. Our 50 amp cutter with a "20 year old" trafimet design has been proven to cut almost to 1 1/4". The advancements claimed after 20 years seems slight when compared to this. While that may be on the maximum end, and with claims of cleaner cuts, people wanting to drive a rolls royce will certainly appreciate it. But people looking for "chevy" performance may not appreciate the nuance in performance. In the normal working range of rating a cutter, performance is similar. Yes, yes, the dross thing. Its a relatively insignificant issue, particularly for those used to using oxy acetylene. Clean up time is still required for both cutters. The last statement of Kilowatts is definitely true. The Hypertherm unit is a 45 amp cutter, but it produces more working (load) volts @132 vs. about 105 on the PowerPlasma 50 and more than other cutters in the industry. Total wattage is nearly 6000 watts which is nearly the same as our PowerPlasma 60. Amps are amps, and volts are volts, combine them and you get watts. Its definitely a misnomer to give any plasma cutter an amp rating, instead it should have a watt or kilowatt rating for apples to apples comparison. The same can be said of welders. Each welder has a different voltage output, and that affects somewhat the amps needed to burn the same rod. It's not that one is necessarily inferior to the other, but the "rating" system is skewed.
 
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   / What to look on a Plasma Cutter? #34  
Mark,

Again, I was not pointing at your products specifically, rather...just trying to point out that plasma cutters are not a commodity, and that often (not always) the higher price of some systems gets you some value added capability. When shopping for a plasma....don't just shop for amps and price!

Jim
 
   / What to look on a Plasma Cutter?
  • Thread Starter
#35  
There are lots of good info given here... and thanks :thumbsup:. Now I just really need to re think what are my uses for it but basically I am using it for anything backyard project, so price will come into play (still need to buy the steel...:D) but just like anything I bought in the past I usually go over board ;). And to stir the pot, my neighbor who's a welder suggested that I will have more use on Oxy/Acetylene set up that of Plasma cutter (Shield, also suggested it :thumbsup:). I might just flip a coin....:D
 
   / What to look on a Plasma Cutter? #36  
There are lots of good info given here... and thanks :thumbsup:. Now I just really need to re think what are my uses for it but basically I am using it for anything backyard project, so price will come into play (still need to buy the steel...:D) but just like anything I bought in the past I usually go over board ;). And to stir the pot, my neighbor who's a welder suggested that I will have more use on Oxy/Acetylene set up that of Plasma cutter (Shield, also suggested it :thumbsup:). I might just flip a coin....:D

I thought about that too.... but to be honest I'm kinda scared of the OxAcet!!! I'm sure it would be OK if I had some training, but still, the worry of having the canisters in the shop or garage if there's fire, etc. The have been times when I wanted to heat up a seized nut however.....

-Jer.
 
   / What to look on a Plasma Cutter? #37  
I have cut my Oxy Acetylene use by 90% since I got my first plasma.

Though there are times that I can't get by without it, when brazing or heating. But there are more times when I can't get by without my plasma.

I'd go for the plasma, and look around pawn shops and ebay for a good used torch set. Torches such as SMITH carry a lifetime warranty. I have one. At first I wasn't crazy about the underhand adjustment, and would have liked to have a Harris instead, but the price sucked me in. Now, I see what people like about it and wouldn't trade it. Simple changeover to propane is a cinch for the torch with only a need to buy a new nozzle (and possibly hose) and is cheaper to operate for cutting.

I'd recommend looking for the journeyman size, not big, but competent. I've cut over 4 inch material with mine. Don't be afraid of the acetylene and oxygen tanks, as long as you respect them,safety is followed and common sense is used, you'll never have a problem. IF the unit comes attached to two small bottles, then it is probably too small. But the next size up and it will handle everything you'll ever need it for. Tank lease is not too bad, maybe 100.00 year. Refills are sometimes cheaper on leased tanks. Before I bought a plasma, I'd go through a two or three tanks every month (large 330 cuft oxy and 80 cu ft) Now it takes me a year, (use it exclusively for brazing and some heating...and the occasional gas weld when I don't feel like pulling out the tig or just want to keep my skills sharp).
 
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   / What to look on a Plasma Cutter? #38  
There are lots of good info given here... and thanks :thumbsup:. Now I just really need to re think what are my uses for it but basically I am using it for anything backyard project, so price will come into play (still need to buy the steel...:D) but just like anything I bought in the past I usually go over board ;). And to stir the pot, my neighbor who's a welder suggested that I will have more use on Oxy/Acetylene set up that of Plasma cutter (Shield, also suggested it :thumbsup:). I might just flip a coin....:D
You will eventually get both a oxy fuel torch and a plasma, there is no clear
cut reason to get one before the other. Depends on your needs. I purchased
my plasma as I was getting into more and more aluminum and stainless work
and oxy-fuel was not cutting it, pun intended...

In evaluating a unit I would look at availability and cost of consumables.
Air requirements of each unit.
What material thicknesses are you cutting.
Most units have a rated thickness at a cutting speed of 10 inches per minute. 10 IPM is pretty darn slow.
I wanted to cut 1/2" are reasonable rates so I purchased a Miller 2050 its rated cut was 7/8" at 1/2" is cut speed was ~30 IPM much more reasonable.
Also dry air will extend the life of your consumable considerably. Get a Motor Guard air dryer filter for your machine.



I have cut my Oxy Acetylene use by 90% since I got my first plasma.

Though there are times that I can't get by without it, when brazing or heating. But there are more times when I can't get by without my plasma.

I'd go for the plasma, and look around pawn shops and ebay for a good used torch set. Torches such as SMITH carry a lifetime warranty. I have one. At first I wasn't crazy about the underhand adjustment, and would have liked to have a Harris instead, but the price sucked me in. Now, I see what people like about it and wouldn't trade it. Simple changeover to propane is a cinch for the torch with only a need to buy a new nozzle (and possibly hose) and is cheaper to operate for cutting.
I would recommend Smith also, but you might want to look at propylene or other fuel gases other than acetylene, there are a lot of good alternatives.
Also if you can purchase your cylinders vs. renting or leasing them you will be $$$ ahead in the long run.
 
   / What to look on a Plasma Cutter? #39  
There was a jump up in insurance prices for me if I have a set of torches in the garage.
 
   / What to look on a Plasma Cutter? #40  
I have a small oxy-fuel set as well, and 3 plasma systems (Powermax30, Powermax45, Powermax85, and....make that 4, a Powermax1000! And, yes....even though I work for Hypertherm I had to pay for them.

The oxyfuel is absolutely necessary in my opinion. It is used rarely for cutting (in my shop), but often for heating up a stubborn nut for easier removal.....or for heating something to make it easier to straighten or bend.

Remember, plasma is much cheaper to cut with, much faster on most materials, and can cut aluminum, stainless......which cannot be cut with an oxy-fuel torch. Just yesterday I used the oxy-fuel for heating...and discovered a leak in the accetylene hose...the set is about 20 years old. Just ordered some new hoses today.

Jim
 

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