Tractor weights

[LD1]

What is wrong with using the 3ph to skid logs, I've done it before and did'nt know I was doing anything wrong:confused3:

The probability of flipping the tractor backwards increases exponentially when pulling from the 3PH when raised.

It is NEAR impossible to flip a tractor using the actual drawbar. Even if you hook to an imovable object. You can raise the front tires into the air though. But because the actual drawbar is located behind and below the axle line and mounted rigid, once a certain point is reached, if the object doesn't begin to move, the chain and drawbar are on an angle that is actually applying force resisting the front end from raising beyond that point.

Hooking to a 3PH is more dangerous. The 3PH isnt limited on upward travel. So if you start to flip, the 3PH just raises up unrestricted. and once the 3PH reaches its highest point of travel, your hitch point is now above the centerline of the axle. In which physics will allow to tractor to flip back ont you if the conditions are right.

I feel fairly safe doing it on my tractor for several reasons. I have done it enough to know that I will run out of traction before I am in danger. And mainly because I have the extra 1000lbs or so of loader hanging off the front.

The few times we do pull from the 3PH with the 8n, It is with extreme caution. The left foot hovers over the clutch, no dumping of the clutch or jerking, and it is never with the hitch raised all the way. Only just enough to take a little weight off the log and add some to the rears.

 

[Toffy]

Having worked around very heavy machinery all my life and being 60years old. I would say the following, If you use common sense than there is nothing wrong with using a three point hitch to skid logs.
The people that find a problem with this are those that have a want but no clue about the right way to do this very simple task safely.
I have worked in the logging industry for years and have never heard of a log arch used to move logs.
A tractor can be used as a skidder. After all a skidder is designed to skid logs a tractor is more versatile because it is used for a various jobs.
I say good for you!:thumbsup:

 

[LD1]

Having worked around very heavy machinery all my life and being 60years old. I would say the following, If you use common sense than there is nothing wrong with using a three point hitch to skid logs.
The people that find a problem with this are those that have a want but no clue about the right way to do this very simple task safely.
I have worked in the logging industry for years and have never heard of a log arch used to move logs.
A tractor can be used as a skidder. After all a skidder is designed to skid logs a tractor is more versatile because it is used for a various jobs.
I say good for you!:thumbsup:

I agree. I often get a little upset, or take offense as you will, to people on this forum that say I should never do it that I am putting my life in danger, its stupid, think about your family, never chain to anything but the drawbar, etc. Especially people who have never met me, cut wood with me, or been around when I am doing this so-called dangerous act. I have been around tractors my whole life. I know what I am doing. Can accidents happen? of course they can. But I could also be struck by lightning or hit by a drunk driver tomorrow as well.

Now I have no problem advising against it if someone is new to tractors or never operated machinery. ESPECIALLY if they dont have a FEL. And I personally advise newbies NOT to do it. But to someone who has been around tractors like I have been, we dont even think twice. It is just common practice.

 

[Toffy]

Sorry guys i forgot to mention one thing. The log arch's that i have seen on this site are works of art. I am thinking about making one that will carry more than one this would be kind of like an upside down pole trailer. If anybody has made one that is capable of carrying as many as 4 logs i would be happy to here from you.

 

[Toffy]

I agree. I often get a little upset, or take offense as you will, to people on this forum that say I should never do it that I am putting my life in danger, its stupid, think about your family, never chain to anything but the drawbar, etc. Especially people who have never met me, cut wood with me, or been around when I am doing this so-called dangerous act. I have been around tractors my whole life. I know what I am doing. Can accidents happen? of course they can. But I could also be struck by lightning or hit by a drunk driver tomorrow as well.

Now I have no problem advising against it if someone is new to tractors or never operated machinery. ESPECIALLY if they dont have a FEL. And I personally advise newbies NOT to do it. But to someone who has been around tractors like I have been, we dont even think twice. It is just common practice.

You are so right.:thumbsup: Practice makes perfect and we must think of our loved ones. Life is short and we must make the best of it.
You have opened my eyes to the fact that everybody on this site is not experienced. Oh by the way you asked where I'm from,Northern Canada. Mostly softwoods in our area. Much lighter but still to be treated with respect.

 

[45LC]

Having worked around very heavy machinery all my life and being 60years old. I would say the following, If you use common sense than there is nothing wrong with using a three point hitch to skid logs.
The people that find a problem with this are those that have a want but no clue about the right way to do this very simple task safely.
I have worked in the logging industry for years and have never heard of a log arch used to move logs.
A tractor can be used as a skidder. After all a skidder is designed to skid logs a tractor is more versatile because it is used for a various jobs.
I say good for you!:thumbsup:

I'm 47 years old and have been around heavy euipment & trucks all my life also, but only around a 3ph for a year or so. That being said I am confident enough in my operating abilities to realize when to get out of the thottle or when to thottle it out. So if thats all I'm doing wrong you can bet I will be doing it again.

 

[IslandTractor]

I agree. I often get a little upset, or take offense as you will, to people on this forum that say I should never do it that I am putting my life in danger, its stupid, think about your family, never chain to anything but the drawbar, etc. Especially people who have never met me, cut wood with me, or been around when I am doing this so-called dangerous act. I have been around tractors my whole life. I know what I am doing. Can accidents happen? of course they can. But I could also be struck by lightning or hit by a drunk driver tomorrow as well.

Now I have no problem advising against it if someone is new to tractors or never operated machinery. ESPECIALLY if they dont have a FEL. And I personally advise newbies NOT to do it. But to someone who has been around tractors like I have been, we dont even think twice. It is just common practice.

Well, I kinda agree with your point but also disagree. Yes, someone who knows what they are doing can minimize risks by understanding the principles involved. However, it is wrong to compare the 3PT skidding issue to being hit by lightning or a drunk driver. You don't have any realistic ability to minimize the risks of the two examples you gave but you can reduce the risk of flip over or at least the consequences of flip over.

You imply that it is newbies that get hurt while experienced operators would not yet that does not fit with the reports from OSHA which very frequently involve deaths of very experienced operators. You don't mention it but lots of "experienced" guys seem to think they can control a flip over by reacting quickly with the clutch. That has been shown in numerous demonstrations to be a very poor assumption as the point of no return for flip over is about half a second as I recall and very few of us have reaction times that fast. One can minimize risk by loading up the FEL, by going slowly and by insuring the dragged log doesn't snag but those are not surefire methods. Using the basic principles of physics and keeping the load down with a drawbar simply makes more sense from a scientific/engineering/safety perspective.

I think the "experienced" operator argument is kinda like the drinking driver argument: Just because you've gotten away with it so far it doesn't make it good idea.

Happy New Year

 

[oc3crwler]

No amount of snow has stopped me from skidding logs or breaking trail with the blade. I have skidded 20" logs 30 ft long with a log lifter i attach to the back of the tractor. I only do this in the winter with snow on the ground. No need for a log arch with snow.

Not bad for that little machine. I have trouble skidding 30 footers with my OC3 and D2. But then again most everything we cut here is 30 to 50" and oak or hickory and never de limbed. Was thinking about using my JD4100 to move smaller stuff, but I fear that there is not enough rear-end to get itself out of trouble. I'll stick with track tractors for pulling, and let the deere keeping eating (cutting) the grass.

 

[LD1]

Using the basic principles of physics and keeping the load down with a drawbar simply makes more sense from a scientific/engineering/safety perspective.

But in doesn't make sense in my case. On my light tractor with smaller tires, If I hooked to the drawbar I wouldnt be able to pull squat. No to mention the log digs into the ground adding resistance and gets MUCH more dirt all over it which dulls chains much quicker.

I can pull way more log with the 3PH method. If I only used the drawber, cutting wood would not be wort it as I could not be productive enough.

And sure their are thing you can do to minimize your chances of being struck by lightning. Dont go out in a thunder storm and If you must, stay away from tall objects. ANd you can even minimize you risk of being hit by a drunk. Dont go out on known bad nights like certain holiddays, and dont be out at 1:30 in the morning.

 

[mrcaptainbob]

Hey, Toffy. I have an old Bolens HT-20 with an over designed fel and carries about 900#'s in fluid filled tires, wheel weights, box blade and cement block on that. I've pulled 24" cherry 20' long from the woods on the side hill on the north end. It's a substantial hill. Won't call you a liar...been there/done that. These tractors can do it. Good job.