Pole Barn advice

AJE · Feb 25, 2011

Hello everybody.

I would like to add a barn to my property. I can do some of the work myself, however I have been looking at various local companies for some estimates.

I would like to get it as big as possible. I was originally looking for estimates on a 30x60x10 however I may have settled myself back to 30x48x10.

I have a firm estimate from one company detailing a 30x60x10 for about $35K, including the 4" concrete slab, sliding door on back, walk in and overhead door on front, with a frost free hydrant and pit, perma columns, excavating, estimated 100ton of gravel, and insulation.

I have a cheaper estimate for just the 30x48x10 for about $16K, not including the ground work or concrete floor.

I will do electrical and lighting myself.

I figured I would ask for advice on a couple of things.

Laminated posts? (detailed about $475 extra)
Bubble wrap insulation?
Insulation on roof only? (this is what I was thinking)

I'm sure I'll think of more but I'd like to hear opinions.

QRTRHRS · Feb 25, 2011

Laminating posts can be done two ways. Spline joints and glue cured with heat and pressure or stock cut to size and nailed together. I think the former would be stronger but have not heard of issues with the latter. Nailed should be cheaper.

My personal opinion on bubble wrap is don't build without it for the roof anyway. It will stop the dripping moisture issue and lessen the sound from heavy rainfall.

Go with the longer length if you can. Unless you are doing your own work, adding on is always more than going large enough to begin with.

Not sure of your intended usage but ten feet will limit your door height to about nine feet. Kind of limits larger vehicles like tall tractors or RV's.

boggen · Feb 25, 2011

it been 8 to 10 years ago. but when i went around looking.

i found out even places out of state even a few states away. were approx same price that is even with shipping and them coming out and building it.

do a search for "metal buildings" vs pole barn, tractor shed, farm shed, etc... most of the companies i found were large companies that build little barns like you and i want, and then the large 1000x10000 feet buildings. and the companies are setup to go were ever they need to.

=======================
you could wait for concrete floor and just put some gravel down. for temp doings and then later on. have some local company come in and do it. and if it were me, i would honestly skip having some other company do it for ya. and call local concrete companies directly. and see what they would charge.

double check on radiant heating. it doesn't cost that much for some hard board insulation to put down first then the rebar and wire mesh. and the hose for the radiant heating. then when you want to heat the shed say next year or 5 years form now, you could then invest in a boiler or hot water heater to heat the concrete floor.

insulation below the concrete is more of a way to help slow down the loss of heat through the ground.

=============
insulation. it completely depends on were you live. colder climates will need more insulation while warmer climates less insulation ((i should say R-value))

open ceilings or rather gabbel ceilings, require more insulation (higher R-value) vs ceilings like most homes have that are flat ceilings in there bed rooms, kitchens, living rooms etc...

ceilings require more R value than walls.

if ya heating and/or cooling the shed, you need insulation on walls and ceiling. and i haven't seen bubble wrap cut it. perhaps part of the over all insulation layers.

==================
there is a wide variety of ways to insulate the walls and ceiling, from spray on foam (professionally done), to hard board insulation, to rolled insulation, to blown in insulation.

to sprayed on ceiling with a fire retardant on it. to hard board insulation in the walls.

for me here in central Illinois. when i did the math. for basic insulation vs more insulation along with house wrap as i call it. it would take about 10 years for me to start breaking even on savings on heating and cooling bill for the shed.

basic for me would be, R 10 insulation value in walls, and R 20 value in ceiling. vs the recommend value at the time was i think R 17 in walls and R 35 value in ceiling. difference being paying up front for all the extra material.

if i had no insulation. but just used some spray foam (great stuff in a red can) to fill all the little holes in attempt to make everything air tight. it would never be worth to try and heat and cool it. perhaps a force air blower mounted some general work bench space to keep my rear warm as i worked on something. and to stick my hands up to, to warm them up.

AJE · Feb 25, 2011

I will insulate the roof but I don't really think it's necessary for the rest of it. It will not stay heated during the winter, and if I need to work on something, I'll fire up the kerosene heater. My dad has a bigger barn and it works pretty well.

I forgot that this forum does not display my geographical area (others I post on do). I live in western Ohio, so cold/chilly winters and hot summers.

It will be used for tool storage, toy storage, and to park my tractor and truck indoors.

glenn76 · Feb 25, 2011

Well, 've built a few pole barns...I actually built one and finished the inside like a trad, house and live in it right now...I welded up my shop...took a little longer, but i wanted it to be termite free. I wouldnt worry too much about the laminated posts unless you're planning on moving thru the build up real slow...generally they only use those to prevent a little twisting that occurs over a slow build, if you're having a co. do it, I wouldn't bother...they'll be done in 4-5 days. Definately use some form of insulation...metal sweats! I am installing styrofoam in my shop and it's acting as tho it's a large ice chest...very pleased...but def use something if you want a climate controlled enviroment for your man cave!!

theboman · Feb 26, 2011

Termite free? Wow, how with a pole barn? I'm no expert but from life experiences and selling house the past five years, termites are almost always a treat. Poles in the ground and there's a chance for termites. Concrete? ha, seem them come out of concrete floors.

The only things I've told works is 4 blocks high off the ground, or all metal from ground up, or termite cap ontop of blocks. I'm sure there's other stuff too. I HATE termites and ants.

Told by a local professional that termites won't find new construction for 6-8 years! Also, if you mulch beside house, use landscape timbers next to house, have scrap lumber/wood next to house those are welcome mats for termites. He said the mulch thing is a totally NO-NO! The mulch is a treat since it's older decaying wood and holds moisture, and then folks add more and leave the rotting mulch on the bottom! He opened my eyes.

Pole barns are like closest and gun safes, they are never big enough!

mjncad · Feb 26, 2011

Go taller! 10' really limits you.

Birdhunter1 · Feb 26, 2011

I just built a 30X48X10 6/12 pitch roof and I have some good advice for you.
1: insulate the whole thing. I did mine with 1/2" pink polystyrene for less that $700. It is worth it. The week it dropped off to 20 degrees highs and single digit lows at night around here and did not get above freezing I did a test. I took a 32 oz. stop-n-rob cup of water 1/2 full and it took 3 days before ice formed. No heat in the building yet it just absorbed that much during the day. Remember $700 did the whole thing and a few rolls of duct tape to seal the seams did wonders.
2: Have them put the hydrant inside, while you are at it plumb in a few flor drains and put the piping in to do a bathroom later (at least stub it outside of the building if you do not hook it up). My shop is 200' from the house, i put a bathroom out there, wouldn't have it any other way. Bathroom is a 9x9 and I also have all my hunting clothes in there, it is heated with a 500W electric baseboard heater. It has more insulation than the rest of the building (dad had a bunch of R 13 fiberglass left over from an addition on his house so I used it for him).
3: Have them do yor floor in a manner that has it above grade. I do not mean grade at the edge of the building but 10' away from it. Mine sits about 1' higher than the surrounding area 10' away from the building. Of course i also built mine with a 1' concrete wall around the perimeter (except door openings) and all of my posts are above the concrete not in the ground.
4: Puting metal up on the sides is not difficult, if you can handle wiring the shop yourself then you and a buddy can knock out sheathing it yourself. Roof is a bit different but still not hard unless you cannot handle climbing on trusswork and purlins.

Gizmo2 · Feb 26, 2011

mjncad said:
Go taller! 10' really limits you.

As we are having a 20' D x 32' W x 10' H pole build this spring. I have to ask why does 10' limit you?

AJE · Feb 26, 2011

Birdhunter1 said:
I just built a 30X48X10 6/12 pitch roof and I have some good advice for you.
1: insulate the whole thing. I did mine with 1/2" pink polystyrene for less that $700. It is worth it. The week it dropped off to 20 degrees highs and single digit lows at night around here and did not get above freezing I did a test. I took a 32 oz. stop-n-rob cup of water 1/2 full and it took 3 days before ice formed. No heat in the building yet it just absorbed that much during the day. Remember $700 did the whole thing and a few rolls of duct tape to seal the seams did wonders.
2: Have them put the hydrant inside, while you are at it plumb in a few flor drains and put the piping in to do a bathroom later (at least stub it outside of the building if you do not hook it up). My shop is 200' from the house, i put a bathroom out there, wouldn't have it any other way. Bathroom is a 9x9 and I also have all my hunting clothes in there, it is heated with a 500W electric baseboard heater. It has more insulation than the rest of the building (dad had a bunch of R 13 fiberglass left over from an addition on his house so I used it for him).
3: Have them do yor floor in a manner that has it above grade. I do not mean grade at the edge of the building but 10' away from it. Mine sits about 1' higher than the surrounding area 10' away from the building. Of course i also built mine with a 1' concrete wall around the perimeter (except door openings) and all of my posts are above the concrete not in the ground.
4: Puting metal up on the sides is not difficult, if you can handle wiring the shop yourself then you and a buddy can knock out sheathing it yourself. Roof is a bit different but still not hard unless you cannot handle climbing on trusswork and purlins.

1. Definitely will consider this.
2. The hydrant will be inside, however it isn't far at all from the house, and it is below the septic system. I don't think a bathroom would be worth the extra hassle.
3. This is part of the plan