Screws vs. Nails - Prepping to build a Shed/Garage for my Harleys

[MossflowerWoods]

TBNers,

As of this Thursday at the latest, our Harleys will have lost their garage in town due to that house has tenants moving in (Yahoo!). Now they will be parked in the carport.

I am planning to build a shed/garage just inside the gate where the drive way swings around a bend to make a 90 degree turn down to the house. There will be a projects thread (with pictures of course) for that project.

I actually have a series of questions but the one I'm obssessing on now is this.

Screws or Nails.

Personally I'm a screw gun guy. I have issues hitting the nails straight, plus I now have carpal tunnel in both hands bad enough the DR is insisting I get surgery in the right hand ASAP, and the left 6 weeks later. I keep telling him I have too much work to do. He does not care & tried to get me in this Friday.

I'm really talking about the floor and frame etc. The siding panels I will nail easymost. Same with the trim, shingles etc.

But what kept me up last night was a concern that the floor joist hangers worrying that screws might not have the same load bearing capacity as Nails, thereby defeating the planned strength of the joist.

I'm hoping this is not quite as polarized as Ag vs R4 tires , and at least as informative as Stick vs. Oxy/Acetylene:thumbsup:.

Gentlemen, START YOUR ENGINES!

Thanks in advance!
Be well,
David

 

[bp fick]

I like driving screws, but honestly, give some thought to a nail gun. It is easier on your wrists, I believe, as I too suffer with these same, painful maladies.

You can shoot ring shank, galvanized, coated or nails that combine all these features for great holding power. Once you shoot, I believe you'd find it far less hurtful for your wrists, arms and hands than screwing.

 

[Fixemall]

Use nails (ring shank) for framing and staples for the sheathing. If you are uncomfortable with an air gun get a Paslode cordless nailer, they work great and are a bit safer.

 

[jimmysisson]

Bostitch and others make a positive-placement nail gun for hangers. You might can rent one just for the hangers. Other fasteners, agree with other posters - screws are just too slow. Nail gun is the answer.
For the carpal, keep your thumb wrapped, not up the handle - might help short term. Sometimes the urge (or need) to beat something into place is unstoppable!
Jim

 

[MossflowerWoods]

Use nails (ring shank) for framing and staples for the sheathing. If you are uncomfortable with an air gun get a Paslode cordless nailer, they work great and are a bit safer.

Fixemall,

What's a ring shank nail?

I'm fine with an air gun. My next build is I need to finish the attic.

BUt an air gun means I need a compressor and a generator because there is no power at the garage location. Unless there is something I don't kow about (of which there are many, just read my posts and that is obvious).

Thanks,

David

 

[srossman]

Fixemall,

What's a ring shank nail?

I'm fine with an air gun. My next build is I need to finish the attic.

BUt an air gun means I need a compressor and a generator because there is no power at the garage location. Unless there is something I don't kow about (of which there are many, just read my posts and that is obvious).

Thanks,

David

Check out paslode.com They make a cordless nail gun that runs on a battery and gas cartridge. No compressor needed.

 

[LD1]

I agree with the "get the nail gun". It is the best $200 or so you will spend.

But in a nut shell, screws have superior pull-out strength compaired to nails.

Nut nails have superior sheer stength.

So you have to look at what forces are going to be applied and decide accordingly.

For example, things like headers, joists, beams, etc need the sheer strength of nails.

Things that need good pull out strength you can use screws. Like metal siding/roofing, wall studs, purlins, sheeting, etc.

And for the most critical connections, the use of carriage/thru bolts is reccomended. Like post to header connections.

But I would also advise that you check the code where you live. It may or may not apply, but do what they advise. Where I live, there is no code for NON-residential structures. So we can do what we want. But double check your area.

Also, most of them joist hangers, strong-ties, etc have stamped on them what they reccomend for fasteners and how to install the correctly. I suggest following that as well.:thumbsup:

 

[MossflowerWoods]

I agree with the "get the nail gun". It is the best $200 or so you will spend.

But in a nut shell, screws have superior pull-out strength compaired to nails.

Nut nails have superior sheer stength.

So you have to look at what forces are going to be applied and decide accordingly.

For example, things like headers, joists, beams, etc need the sheer strength of nails.

Things that need good pull out strength you can use screws. Like metal siding/roofing, wall studs, purlins, sheeting, etc.

And for the most critical connections, the use of carriage/thru bolts is reccomended. Like post to header connections.

But I would also advise that you check the code where you live. It may or may not apply, but do what they advise. Where I live, there is no code for NON-residential structures. So we can do what we want. But double check your area.

Also, most of them joist hangers, strong-ties, etc have stamped on them what they reccomend for fasteners and how to install the correctly. I suggest following that as well.:thumbsup:

LD1,

This is EXACTLY what I wanted to know.

Thank you.

My basic plan is to build the base with pressure treated lumber, prob 2x6 mounted on 4x4 posts set in concrete but I might need to re consider concrete footers - my concern is my ability to level the structure & to keep the ramp into the doorway manageable.

I'm also going to add a solar 12v system to charge the batteries and provide 1 or 2 lights as needed.

Thanks,
David

 

[smstonypoint]

LD1,



My basic plan is to build the base with pressure treated lumber,

David,

Some fasteners deteriorate when used with pressure treated lumber. Stainless steel is supposedly impervious to the chemicals used in treating the lumber, but stainless steel fasteners are pricey.

Another poster mentioned Paslode nail guns. I have Paslode cordless framing and trim guns and have no complaints. Paslode has a hot-dipped galvanized framing nail that is approved for use with ACQ and MCQ lumber.Hot Dipped Galvanized Plus 30ｺ Framing Nails - Paslode

Steve

 

[Fixemall]

Fixemall,

What's a ring shank nail?

I'm fine with an air gun. My next build is I need to finish the attic.

BUt an air gun means I need a compressor and a generator because there is no power at the garage location. Unless there is something I don't kow about (of which there are many, just read my posts and that is obvious).

Thanks,

David

A ring shank is a nail with tiny rings running the entire length of it, makes them harder to pull out in most lumber. As others have pointed out, take a look at Paslode, they run on a rechargeable battery and Butane, are reliable and eliminate the need for air and onsite power.

 

[MossflowerWoods]

A ring shank is a nail with tiny rings running the entire length of it, makes them harder to pull out in most lumber. As others have pointed out, take a look at Paslode, they run on a rechargeable battery and Butane, are reliable and eliminate the need for air and onsite power.

I'm sold on the Paslode - Which model do I get? Will Lowes have the best price or any suggestions?

How many butane cans do I need etc?

Thanks guys! Amazingly educational information.

Be well,
David

 

[DAY]

Stop at a construction site- if you can still find one:laughing:, and watch/ask what they are using for siding, joists, etc.

"Airless" nail guns are great for electricity free zones, and much quieter than the ones run by an air compressor- but also much more expensive.

As an alternative, you could buy one of the many ready made sheds available. But where's the fun in THAT?

 

[Fixemall]

Get the framing nailer, four tubes of Butane and two large boxes of ringshanks, check prices at HD, Lowes and online...they vary by day. BE SURE to charge the battery fully before first use, mine is six years old and still going strong.

 

[sweep]

Have you checked into a prebuilt building that is hauled to your location?

Get one from the right place and they are generaly cheaper or near the same cost than what you can build for yourself. Our local dealers has hundreds of different storage barns, garages etc

My wife and I just bought a prebuilt run in shed for the horses and it was cheaper that us building one. $1700 delivered/installed . 2 stall, one storage room with a door(schlage lock included) and a window and treated plank wood floor and metal roof and sides. Very well built. All the post and lower pieces were treated lumber. 14' x 30' . Corner post were 6x6", prebuilt trusses on top even had a ridge vent on top.

Time you start going out and buying all you nail hammers etc and your time it's just not worth it.

 

[bp fick]

I have an air driven nail gun, but my compressor is big, heavy and makes the devil's own noise.

When I go out on jobs, I always take my Paslodes. One finish, one framing.
Just picked up another used Paslode framing gun off Ebay last week for $128. The pawn shops are selling them on Ebay, due to the housing market crash.

The famous Vegas pawn shop, home of the "Pawn Stars" TV show remarked that he can no longer take construction tools on pawn. They are glutted. Sad, but it makes an opportunity for others.

 

[LD1]

I personally am not much of a fan of cordless tools (IE: battery).

Batterys fail. And setting is bad on batteries too. You may spend the money and thing the cordless nail gun is great this time, but 5 years down the road when you go to use it a second time, are the batterys going to be worth a crap???? It seems daily use is the best way to get the most life out of the battery IMO.

But even that, I started my pole building with cordless tools. Drill and saw and all. It seems I was always waiting on a battery to charge:confused2: And then you get impatient an grab the battery before it is 100% charged and that is bad on them too.

IMO, I know the cords are a PITA, but you just cant beat the realibility and power of corded tools. That goes for nail guns, saws, drills, etc. And you can probabally buy a good bostich air nail gun, and a cheap 110V compressor for less than the cost of a cordless one. And then never have to worry about batteries EVER. Or tanks of butane. Just plug the compressor in and go.

 

[EddieWalker]

Screws and nails are fasteners that are designed to hold the wood in place. They are not structural supports and have no load bearing capabilities. When a house is framed properly, everything is resting on something else. The nails just hold it in place. Unlike decks and fences and other outdoor structures, properly sized nails do not come out of the framing members of a wall.

Either will work, but the cost for screws will be extremly high compared to nails. You could buy a compressor and framing gun and still have money left over in what you would pay for screws to get it done.

Simpson has both screws and nails to chose from that they "REQUIRE" when using their fasteners. Many will use regular framing nails, but a good inspector will not pass a house that has done this. Screws have to be rated as structural to use in a bracket.

Keep it simple, build to code and don't try to overthing or invent anything. Do this, and it will outlive you and be something that you will be proud of.

Eddie

 

[bp fick]

Paslode guns and my Bostich gun driven with air compressor both have their place and both do have a place in my arsenal of tools.

Cordless saws, drills and such are invaluable to me. Just as my conventional, corded drills/saws, etc, are.

Each have their place and I wouldn't ever go back to not having the choice of which better fits the job at hand.

My cordless saws and drills EAT batteries (PITA), whereas my Paslode stuff has lasted almost 10 years on a battery. Much different use of battery power in igniting a charge or actually spinning a saw blade. Just sayin'

 

[smstonypoint]

Get the framing nailer, four tubes of Butane and two large boxes of ringshanks, check prices at HD, Lowes and online...they vary by day. BE SURE to charge the battery fully before first use, mine is six years old and still going strong.

The Paslode fuel cells have a finite shelf life and a date code. Depending on how much you are framing and your construction schedule, you may want to purchase a two-pack of the fuel cells to determine how far they will get you.

I would also advise buying an extra battery -- the batteries hold a charge for a long time, but take a while to charge. Two batteries will allow you to maintain productivity.

Steve

 

[flusher]

TBNers,

As of this Thursday at the latest, our Harleys will have lost their garage in town due to that house has tenants moving in (Yahoo!). Now they will be parked in the carport.

I am planning to build a shed/garage just inside the gate where the drive way swings around a bend to make a 90 degree turn down to the house. There will be a projects thread (with pictures of course) for that project.

I actually have a series of questions but the one I'm obssessing on now is this.

Screws or Nails.

Personally I'm a screw gun guy. I have issues hitting the nails straight, plus I now have carpal tunnel in both hands bad enough the DR is insisting I get surgery in the right hand ASAP, and the left 6 weeks later. I keep telling him I have too much work to do. He does not care & tried to get me in this Friday.

I'm really talking about the floor and frame etc. The siding panels I will nail easymost. Same with the trim, shingles etc.

But what kept me up last night was a concern that the floor joist hangers worrying that screws might not have the same load bearing capacity as Nails, thereby defeating the planned strength of the joist.

I'm hoping this is not quite as polarized as Ag vs R4 tires , and at least as informative as Stick vs. Oxy/Acetylene:thumbsup:.

Gentlemen, START YOUR ENGINES!

Thanks in advance!
Be well,
David

Nails--hold better than screws.
I've built 5 sheds using a 6-in-1 nailgun from Harbor Freight $89. I probably shot 10,000 nails, mostly 16p 3-1/2" framing nails, through that thing with no problem. Started with an $89 pancake compressor also from HF and when that wore out, switched to a $250 Porter Cable oil less compressor.