2000 F150 Triton 5.4L #&*@!! = $$$$$$$

[Egon]

Consumer complaints about Ford Engines - Spark Plug Defect

Seems these fellows may have some comments!

Uh-I didn't scroll to the bottom of the page. Got tired!

 

[Dmace]

Do yourself a favor and change every plug with a Champion 7989 one-piece spark plug which will not come apart like that.

I am shocked this happened, DiamondPilot knows 50 trucks that it didn't happen to so the other 3 million trucks on the road should be good too...

Seriously though, it probably was a bad plug or broken on install. The common problem is the entire plug blowing out of the head taking the threads with it, you got lucky.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Do yourself a favor and change every plug with a Champion 7989 one-piece spark plug which will not come apart like that.

I am shocked this happened, DiamondPilot knows 50 trucks that it didn't happen to so the other 3 million trucks on the road should be good too...

Seriously though, it probably was a bad plug or broken on install. The common problem is the entire plug blowing out of the head taking the threads with it, you got lucky.

I have no reason to lie. I know it can happen but only know of it happening from all the people I know and deal with to 1 single truck and the day it happened it blew 2 plugs out. He was pulling his boat with a 99 V-10 F-250 and the mechanic said it usually happens with poor fuel. This was in 2010, so the truck was 11 years old and well used. Guy is a construction worker.

I have seen many stuck plugs in these motors but only the one blown out.

Me and you are in agreement though that it was either defective or installer error that cause this plug to fail since it stayed threaded in. He got lucky.


Chris

 

[PoorMansCat]

I know where 5 different trucks are right now that have attempted plug changes and failed... Its a really bad design... no doubt...

Well, 3 of them have been patched up right quick and traded in due to the issues.. The other two are just driving them unitl the opportunity presents itself to get rid of them.

 

[Diamondpilot]

We went though this back in Nov with my BIL's truck. He has a 2006 F-150 that had about 120,000 miles on it then and the original plugs. Its not a DIY job for the average Joe.

We found a good local guy that does them all the time. He charged $40 per plug to change them. He supplied the plugs. Had it done by noon. Not a big deal.

Yes, it cost a few $$$$ but other than a idler pulley, 1 COP pack, and front brakes that is all his truck has needed. He works construction so it gets used. His out of pocket expense for his truck year to date $600. $150 of that fluid changes and filters that we did last November at the same time the plugs were done. (front axle, rear axle, tranny, transfer case, coolant, fuel filter, and air filter).

Chris

 

[slowzuki]

Lots of stripped plugs on the first gen of that motor, I'm leaving my old plug in until they are really bad. Not worth the hassle. A lot of them stripped but unaware mechanics cranking the new ones in too. I'd never take a 5.4 to a quicklube shop for a repair.

The local tire shop did the plugs on theirs themselves, stripped them out, then helicoiled themselves, did it wrong and blew the repair out too.

 

[Scooby074]

Lots of stripped plugs on the first gen of that motor, I'm leaving my old plug in until they are really bad. Not worth the hassle. A lot of them stripped but unaware mechanics cranking the new ones in too. I'd never take a 5.4 to a quicklube shop for a repair.

The local tire shop did the plugs on theirs themselves, stripped them out, then helicoiled themselves, did it wrong and blew the repair out too.

Leaving them in might not be the best idea. Many problems with broken plugs can be traced back to corrosion issues from going past the recommended service interval. Actually the current practice is for more frequent changes than recommended to prevent this issue.

Ford's preferred procedure is to spray penetrant down the plug holes after slightly cracking the plugs to try and loosen the electrode shroud in its bore to try and reduce breakage. Best to do this over a period of time.

Im going to look into those one piece champions next time i change the plugs in a ford.

Blowouts are related to a different issue. Ford cut very shallow threads in the heads. The torque spec is super low for those plugs (i cant remember exactly). Its been said that a single overtorque can ruin the threads and lead to blowout. Not a great design. I always torque the plugs to spec when changing.

 

[jonyyuma]

My son is giving up on his Ford, he has paid out a lot for the Ford adaptors to be reinstalled. He cannot tell when the next plug will be Hurled? Jy.

 

[jonyyuma]

BTW--the replacement helicoils from Ford are not a guaranteed fix..Even when installed by Ford..

 

[deerefan]

BTW--the replacement helicoils from Ford are not a guaranteed fix..Even when installed by Ford..

Besides this issue, just getting to the plugs is a major pain. Ford has done a great job of making their motors a bear to work on. Hopefully this new batch of engines will prove to be better in this department. I have a 97 F150 with the 4.6 and other than oil and filter changes, it goes to the shop. I simply got tired of contorting my hands in 10 different directions just to do basic maintenance (plugs, belt etc). I can tune up (change plugs and fuel filter, air filter) in my 1/2 ton Chevy with the 5.3 in an hour. It was one of the deciding factors when looking at new trucks.

 

[slowzuki]

They've been in for as much as 10 years now, I just bought the truck last year, I only put 3000 miles a year on a truck so if they go 5 more years thats great. If I ever get around to doing the pile of broken exhaust studs maybe I'll try the plugs too. I paid about the same for the truck as it costs to have ford do the repair so I'm not too interested in risking it.

Leaving them in might not be the best idea. Many problems with broken plugs can be traced back to corrosion issues from going past the recommended service interval. Actually the current practice is for more frequent changes than recommended to prevent this issue.

Ford's preferred procedure is to spray penetrant down the plug holes after slightly cracking the plugs to try and loosen the electrode shroud in its bore to try and reduce breakage. Best to do this over a period of time.

Im going to look into those one piece champions next time i change the plugs in a ford.

Blowouts are related to a different issue. Ford cut very shallow threads in the heads. The torque spec is super low for those plugs (i cant remember exactly). Its been said that a single overtorque can ruin the threads and lead to blowout. Not a great design. I always torque the plugs to spec when changing.

 

[Scooby074]

They've been in for as much as 10 years now, I just bought the truck last year, I only put 3000 miles a year on a truck so if they go 5 more years thats great. If I ever get around to doing the pile of broken exhaust studs maybe I'll try the plugs too. I paid about the same for the truck as it costs to have ford do the repair so I'm not too interested in risking it.

10 years... eek. Id probably leave them too.:laughing:

Studs are bad mojo too. done a bunch of them. right angle drill does wonders. Right angle die grinder with 1/8 collet works good for pilot hole. Use good bits. Worth the money to invest in at least a 1/8 cobalt for this. The drill bit wants to head to that soft aluminum like a beaver heading for some nice knotty pine.

There was a guy selling a bushing kit to center the pilot on the broken stud (not just for fords but bolts in general) was a good looking kit and i was considering getting it for the ford and other uses. The studs are usually broke right at or just below the face of the heads. if i can find the link ill post it. Called the Quickcenter http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RbDF9P1uDyk I never looked real close to see if there was enough clearance for both the bushing and the drill. Its pretty tight there on some of the studs.

 

[BeeferMan]

Ford really screwed up the heads on these motors, IMO. The first gen had the problem where some of the castings had just a couple threads for the plugs, these heads lost plugs. Certainly didn't happen to them all, but enough to make it a known issue.

Then the redesign came with the three valve heads. These heads used those bizarre looking plugs, and they had the opposite problem - if they carboned up, they could be really hard to get out in one piece.

So from one extreme to the other...

The access to the rear plugs (and engine in general) on the super duty's is horrid. This cab design was originally meant for the mid sized trucks, not pickups, so jacking the cab for service wasn't that big a deal. But it turned out to be popular for the 3/4 ton and up pickups, so they went with it. The shops that work on the diesels say that it isn't that big a deal to lift the cab, but it certainly puts it out of the range of the average backyard mechanic.

And all this is from a Ford guy...

 

[BillP603]

I also have a 2000 F-150 w/5.4 and have been lucky to avoid any plug blowout issues. Myself and a friend were able to change them ourselves at 104K and then I did them again myself at 202K along with a bad coil pack. The truck now has 215K and just keeps running. I'm drooling over a new '11 w/5.0 but driving something that's been paid off for 7 years is an awfully nice feeling as well...

 

[Stimw]

If you google Ford spark plugs blowing out you will find hours of reading.
IIRC it is a problem with 4-6-8 and 10 cylinder Ford engines since 1992 through 2004.
There are at least 3 different designed heads on the 10 cylinder trying to fix the problem.

 

[Dmace]

Well, add one more Ford to the blown spark plug list... :mur:

My good friend has a 2001 F350 4x4 SRW reg cab with the 5.4l and while changing the plugs today, he found one was very loose and came out by hand. Upon closer examination, you could see the threads were mostly gone and the new plug wouldn't thread in. It had been making a little more noise than normal but sounded exactly like an exhaust manifold leak and with no engine troubles, we figured that was it. Now I believe the noise was the loose plug allowing air out the plug hole.

I read through the posts again and am thinking he will need to purchase something like the special tool from TimeSert which appears to go for around $375 but doesn't require removing the head. Luckily with some PB Blaster and patience, the rest of the plugs on that side came out OK but there were some tense moments. Now I'm worried about the four plugs on the passenger side. The truck has 148k miles and the plugs were replaced at around 100k according to the previous owner.

Wish me luck...

 

[Dargo]

Well, add one more Ford to the blown spark plug list... :mur:

My good friend has a 2001 F350 4x4 SRW reg cab with the 5.4l and while changing the plugs today, he found one was very loose and came out by hand. Upon closer examination, you could see the threads were mostly gone and the new plug wouldn't thread in. It had been making a little more noise than normal but sounded exactly like an exhaust manifold leak and with no engine troubles, we figured that was it. Now I believe the noise was the loose plug allowing air out the plug hole.

I read through the posts again and am thinking he will need to purchase something like the special tool from TimeSert which appears to go for around $375 but doesn't require removing the head. Luckily with some PB Blaster and patience, the rest of the plugs on that side came out OK but there were some tense moments. Now I'm worried about the four plugs on the passenger side. The truck has 148k miles and the plugs were replaced at around 100k according to the previous owner.

Wish me luck...

Hopefully it works for you. The "fix it" kits have gotten much better from what I've heard. I do know for a fact, since it hit me in the bank account because I own part of a service contract company, that some of the Ford 4.6 and 5.4 heads were brought to court and they only had 3 rounds of threads for the spark plugs to screw into. This is in an aluminum head as well. I don't see how 3 rounds of threads could ever hold a spark plug in place. At some point Ford quietly made a change and mostly corrected that issue, but I honestly can't tell you when off the top of my head. Otherwise, those "modular" engines have a reputation for being good engines. If it's any consolation, there's a 2000 V10 powered Excursion on flea bay right now with 290k miles on it and they claim it runs great and has no leaks. Heck, they still want a pretty penny for it too for that many miles and being a basic model.

 

[Dmace]

From various sites I've read online while doing research on fixes, it seems the early 5.4l 2-valve engines had 5 threads in the aluminum heads which lead to the blow-outs. They "fixed" that problem in 2002 with the 3-valve engine and 8 threads. The problem is they didn't redesign the head and instead went to a 2-piece spark plug design which was not fully threaded and that lead to the next round of problems for the Triton which was plugs seizing and breaking off in the heads...

I found this kit from CalVan tools which is similar to the TimeSert kit and only $230 so I may have him buy this one instead. Either way, it will be a long weekend if we can get the tool in time.

 

[westcliffe01]

A recent discovery on my part is Tungsten Di sulphide grease (W2S). It is more temperature stable and does not contain nickel, which is in most current anti seize compounds.

W2s is used by bench rest shooters (it is better than Molybdenum Disulphide grease or coatings) for getting reduced fouling, more consistent first shot vs second / third shot performance and easier bore cleaning.

The smallest package I found being sold is here Don't laugh, it is the real thing and $5 is enough to treat all of your own plugs and anyone else you know of.

Just be sure to apply it only from the conical sealing surface of the pug to the top of the threads. It is conductive and is very temperature resistant, so if it gets on the center insulator it will be a problem (misfire). Reduce the torque to about 2/3 of the dry value.

 

[Dargo]

From various sites I've read online while doing research on fixes, it seems the early 5.4l 2-valve engines had 5 threads in the aluminum heads which lead to the blow-outs. They "fixed" that problem in 2002 with the 3-valve engine and 8 threads. The problem is they didn't redesign the head and instead went to a 2-piece spark plug design which was not fully threaded and that lead to the next round of problems for the Triton which was plugs seizing and breaking off in the heads...

I found this kit from CalVan tools which is similar to the TimeSert kit and only $230 so I may have him buy this one instead. Either way, it will be a long weekend if we can get the tool in time.

Just trying to give you some correct info. Someone fed you some bad information. I'm in the business. If you don't believe me, look it up. You don't have any 2002 with 3 valves. If you're talking about the 6.8 L (6760 cc, 413 CID), V10 is another variation of the Modular family created for use in large trucks. Bore size is 90.2 mm (3.552 in) and stroke is 105.8 mm (4.165 in), identical to the 5.4 L V8. Both 2-valve and 3-valve versions are currently produced. The 6.8 L uses a split-pin crank with 72ｰ firing intervals and a balance shaft to quell vibrations inherent to a 90ｰ bank angle V10 engine. The engine's firing order is 1-6-5-10-2-7-3-8-4-9. The 2-valve version was first introduced in 1997, with a 3-valve non-VCT version to follow in 2005. The 3-valve engine is built alongside the 2-valve engine at Ford's Windsor, Ontario LVL engine line. If you're talking about the 5.4,the 3-valve 5.4 L was introduced to the North American market in the redesigned 2004 Ford F-150. Again, no 3 valve 2002 engines, sorry. You're in my field of work now. You can go straighten out whoever blew that smoke up your rear.