Mahindra 4110 PTO wont work

[rustyiron55]

Thanks! My buddie would appreciate it. it is a 10 year old tractor with only I think 400 hours.Its like brand new other than the pump is shot. :thumbsup:

 

[DiskDoctr]

I'm wondering if the relief in the filter blew out? It could go into permanent bypass, the filter would be clean, and it's possible (?) the plastic plug and spring is out of that filter bypass.

At least that's the way it is in oil filters. I'm assuming the hydraulic filter would be of similar construction?

Just a guess, but it looks like a few guesses may help at this point.

Good luck.

- JC

 

[rustyiron55]

finally got the new pump for south korea. Dealer installed it but the PTO still wont work. The electric solinoid works, I checked that. The filters are all clean, new oil,If the loader is raised high then suddlenly lowered then stopped suddely the PTO will kick in. soon as the loader is raised it will stop.

 

[DiskDoctr]

Try another filter, and make sure your pto selector switch is in the "on" (Live) position, not the clutch-activated or off position.

I won't try to go into mechanical parts inside the rear end, since there are already some involve who know much more about this than I do. Maybe give JJ a shout, too, with his hydraulic knowledge to add to the mix

Do you have anything hooked to your remotes? Do you have something you can try on them?

I'm thinking if the hydraulic flow is the problem (regardless of cause), the remotes should be weak, too. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

Also check below your seat, near your feet. Make sure the pto speed adjust knob is all the way open.

And- I know this sounds odd- check your FEL relief valve. Put your bucket on the ground and screw the cap on it loose until it is almost out and see if you hear a click. They get stuck sometimes. I am thinking about troubleshooting the hydraulic flow.

You can make up a QD pressure gauge that you can use in a couple places to troubleshoot, too. I don't have the links ATM, but this was under Hydraulics section...I think JJ was helping someone troubleshoot.

A low pressure at the FEL or Remotes can be diagnostic.

If the solenoid is leaking or not engaging completely, the flow would be directed partially to the FEL control (see diagram below), causing a weak PTO. Definitely have the solenoid checked for complete operation and leaks.

Unless there is a defect internally in the PTO, I am thinking the solenoid would be the likely problem.

Here is the logic.

1. Pump has proper flow and pressure
a. You had a new pump put on
b. Confirm proper pressure at the FEL control (QD Gauge mentioned earlier)

2. Solenoid "works"
a. Confirm solenoid is engaging fully
b. Have solenoid tested for leaks
c. With tractor off and all hydraulics at rest (work all levers to relieve line pressures), pull the cap off the rear of the solenoid and lube it with hydraulic fluid. It gets dry and sticks

If the pump is pumping and getting proper flow and pressure (check it with a gauge), the pump, tank, return lines and filtering systems are all working properly. The solenoid is simply a diverter from the FEL to the PTO.

If the fluid level, condition, and type are okay, then sorry to say it would have to be in the internals of the PTO. FWIW, I think it is the solenoid- plugged/contaminated port or stroke, or leaking, or not fully engaging.

Here is a diagram I made when I was planning for a second set of remotes. I haven't added them yet, but I think the diagram is correct for my 2004 3510, which should be the same as your 4110, I believe.

http://www.diskdoctor.us/tractor/Mahindra hydraulics-tentative.jpg

So there is my formal, uneducated, no-hands-on, not tested, and not even tasted D) diagnostic of your problem

Hope this helps.

- JC

 

[coffeeman]

Its been months. the tractor has been at the dealer in Slippery Rock Pa all summer till now and is still there. He narrowed it down ( he thinks not sure)to a bad hydraulic pump. He finally located the proper pump in South Korea. That was 2 months ago. Give me a brake, They sell these tractors in the United States but can get any parts! . Whats wrong hereOnly a few hundred hours on this tractor and the pump is shot and so far not avalible! What a piece of junk:confused2:

Yrs ago folks bought cheap Korean etc. and they "beat the system". Today the only thing we can buy is cheap stuff sold at prices more expensive than should be. We shot ourselves in the foot. I cry everytime I need to buy a whole new spigot because Big Box store doesn't carry parts. Remember when you could fix your chevy on the road. Any gas station would have a new or used part that would get you going. I don't think that's the case today. Of course your Deer is same old tractor. You see, it's built to our "specs".

I have a Mahindra and I like it. No trouble. Knock on wood.

Cheers

 

[rustyiron55]

Well today Me and Charlie ( owner of tractor ) went to pick the thing up. The owner of the place I found out is not a mahindra dealer just a country repair shop. He stated the new pump helped the loader cycle faster but did not help the PTO problem. He then replaced the solenoid. but I was unable to confirm that yet. He did state that he checked pressures. at the remotes on the back. 1500 lbs and 45 GPM flow. I have no idea what these are supposed to be. the pressure seem a little low to me and the flow seems high for such a small pump.. I think he may be a B.Ser. now the interesting thing is the squaking of a hyd pressure releif valve is still there somewhere . soon as the loader is raised it quits.the guy said he beleives it is the internal clutch pack for the PTO is shot.I asked him how he knows this. He said that he talked to mahindra (somewhere). they said to put air pressure into the hyd pressure port by removing the solenoid valve assembly. listen for air leaking inside the tractor. he said he could hear air leaking. But then i asked him if air was leaking then hows come the remote pressure was good. He had no answere. I stated that if there is a leak internally then how the system is all tied in, then the remote pressure should be low too. Or am I wrong>?? so far it cost $1375 for this guy to do what he says he did. he wanted another $2500 + to split the tractor and he said it may not be the clutch pack.
Is there anyplace I can find a parts & repair manuel for this tractor that is in english? So far all I can find is drawings and foreign writing.I have been repairing / rebuilding heavy equipment for 35 years so its nothing new to me but I want to know whats in there before I get into it.I appreciate all you folks help this far. If anyone has a parts break down on this PTO system I would appreciate if if you could send me some copies to tractorman453657@aol.com
BUY U.S.A Made and Built :thumbsup:

 

[LAWALLSTRACTOR]

The PSI should be arround 2250 and GPM arround 8.5 to 10.

 

[DiskDoctr]

Rusty,

This situation doesn't seem to be getting any better. You need to check the "new" pump that was put on. If it is the same as my 3510, it's a two section pump (front for power steering), and as mentioned above the main hydraulics should be in the 8-12 range.

I'd be curious to know how this dealer checked the hydraulics? I can understand low pressure on the remotes, seems consistent with the weak pto.

But 45gpm???

If you follow my diagram above, it seems very likely you will not be getting proper flow and pressure into rear section of the tractor (from the solenoid).

I wouldn't proceed until you confirm the pump is proper, has the proper output and you have tested the output from the FEL valves (QD gauge) and remotes (QD gauge).

Until then, you can only guess with your buddy's wallet

We're doing the hospital thing right now, which will likely tie us up into the Christmas holiday. If you are still having trouble after then, maybe we should get together. I'm a little over 2 hrs from you, but this problem is getting out of control.

You should do some of the tests I mentioned, but don't dump a bunch more money into it until you get the results. It could end up being the PTO, but without good info to work with, it's (an expensive) shot in the dark.

PM me if you want to chat about it in detail. I could do a phone call if you like, after Sat.

- JC

 

[skipmarcy]

You can review schematics here:

http://www.mahindrapartsonline.com/pages/OemParts#

Do you see any deflection in the shaft when you sideload it with the 2x4?

The solenoid activates a clutch on the pto drive shaft the same way the foot pedal activates a clutch on the main drive shaft.

This last statement is true, in order to access the PTO clutch assy you make a split at the engine/front trans - I've had mine out of my 4110 about 7 years ago, not for PTO problem but for a main clutch problem. From this PTO clutch assy back is all solid mechanical connection/drive so if the PTO was "slipping" as stated in an early post by the OP, there's either a problem with this clutch pack or the hydraulic feed to it. Since it was mentioned earlier about plastic trash found in the system, I might suspect a partial clog in the hydraulic feed to this clutch pack that is limiting full pressure/engagement of the clutch pack, whether it be in the valving at the solenoid or in the passage to the clutch pack or in the clutch pack itself. Diagnosis is a process of elimination and I would start with the easiest. By the way, my hydraulic pump now has just shy of 2150 hours on it and is still humming along ...

 

[LAWALLSTRACTOR]

I sent him an email with parts breakdown pictures and pointed out the unit that regulates the pressure to the PTO clutch. Trash in the pressure regulator could be his problem.