New 5075M is at the dealer's!

[Island Farmer]

Island Farmer;

Have you finalized your "purchase package" with your dealer? Besides the optional, and more optional tires - what other implements, attachments have you decided on?

Thanks,

AKfish

Hello AKfish,

I made my last post and then saw yours. The tractor purchase had to be completed by the end of the year, and it was. The dealer is going to let me swap the Goodyear Dyna Torque's for something else. Along with what I have said in my last couple of posts, I found that the Goodyears that came on my machine, regardless of flotation issues, really didn't have the load handling capabilities that I feel I need. I believe that in your case, you are better off with your bias tires. I think they have a little better capacity than the radials that came on my machine.

With regard to the implements, here is the list that I am just finalizing:

Rears Flail OMF 750 series 7' with 24" hydraulic offset pantograph and OM750 hammers.

Woods 92" Gannon Industrial box scraper 4x4 series. (My tractor will be 7' wide with the new tires, I can go with 84", 88" or 92". Caledon said to go with the 92", do you concur?)

Woods LR800 8' landscape rake with dual gauge wheels and hydraulic angle.

Rankin 5/8" by 9' chain harrow. (Do you think I should go wider, or with a different brand? I was thinking that this width would be easier for me to store and deal with.)

And I am at least going to add the hydraulic top link. You already told me that you don't use the tilt that much. Possibly with the boxblade it could come in handy?

Finally, the dealer is going to bring out a heavy duty landplane he has for me to try out. If I like it I might go for one of those.

As usual, any thoughts are greatly appreciated.

Thank you,

Island Farmer

 

[pclausen]

Appreciate the additional data on the tires Island.

I took your pricing and put in into a spreadsheet as follows:

We know that the 5085M comes standard with 16.9R30 / 11.2R24 and that the 420/85 R34 / 13.6R24 is a $3,543 option.

So it seems to me that if it was possible to order a 5085M with no tires/wheels, one would get a credit for not getting the 16.9R30 / 11.2R24 and rims, let's say $2000. Add that to the $3,543 it would have cost for the 420/85 R34 / 13.6R24 set, and we got about $5,500 to go buy our own wheels and tires.

The 540/65R34 440/65R24 combo runs $3,279 plus shipping (assuming the pricing Island provided is per pair). Surely a set of 34x16 rear rims and 24x14 front rims can be had for less than $2000?

So for someone that has not yet purchased the tractor, I wonder if Deere will let you order it without wheels/tires and delivery it on a big pallet and you then mount the wheels/tires of your choice? If that is too cumbersome, perhaps they can round up some junk wheels/tires just to make the tractor drivable for transport?

I'm going to call my dealer tomorrow and see what progress he has made and when that darn Deluxe Cab will be in the system for him to place the order.

Btw Island, according to my dealer, the H260 loader is in the system for ordering now.

 

[Island Farmer]

pclausen,

I am sorry to say, the prices that I got, unless I am mistaken are not per pair, they are per tire.

Today when my dealer said that it would be about $4000 more to go with the Agribibs, he followed that by saying that he would be giving me a $5000 credit for my Goodyears plus the wheels. So, he was saying that the price for the new Agribibs and the new wheels combined would be about $9000. I am pretty confident that, at least, $1000 can be shaved off of that price, maybe more. This is still an expensive upgrade, that is why I am all for doing as much research as possible.

If my memory serves, Caledon told us that the upgrade to his Firestones cost him about $3000. My dealer said that the Firestones would definitely be less expensive than the Michelins.

It seems like you are leaning toward the Multibibs. Have you learned anything more about them? One thing I really would like to know is will the fronts clear the frame without changing the steering stops and reducing turning radius? Caledon said that surprisingly his new 14.9R24 fronts just cleared. Those Multibibs are not as tall, but they are significantly wider than Caledon's fronts, they could necesitate adjusting the stops, or buying the MFWD wheel spacer kit that AKfish has on his tractor (a $575 MSRP option).

As I've said all along, I really like the idea of those Mulitbibs because they provide more load carrying capacity, more flotation, and do those good things without elevating the machine. I have to admit now though, because the Agribibs are less expensive, may not necessitate the wheel spacer kit, and are more common in my neck of the woods, I am becoming more amenable to them. I am even going to look into the price differential between the Agribibs and the equivalent Firestones. I am kind of wishing that Caledon rejoins us, and will be so kind as to provide more thoughts about his Firestones and the model that he has. As I mentioned in my previous post, Firestone makes several with his tread pattern, which makes it more difficult to deduce with precision which model he actually has. Furthermore, Firestone has two primary tread pattern options, one with the more standard 45 degree tread pattern (that Caledon has) which is similar to both the Agribibs and Mulitbibs. The other is, as far as I know, unique to Firstone, it is their 23 degree tread pattern. If you go to the Firestone website you can watch an interesting video where they pit there 23 degree tread pattern against the Agribibs, and demonstrate the traction superiority of their tire.

In my case, and maybe yours, the absolute traction potential of the tire is less important than flotation to reduce rutting in the winter. I am confident that any good R1 or R1W style tire will have adequate traction for my needs.

Very sorry to be so long winded, but, for me this is another big investment, and I need to get it right.

Thanks All,

Island Farmer

 

[Island Farmer]

pclausen,

One more thought before I am finished for the evening. My biggest concern with the Mulitbibs is that the fronts (440/65R24) will present problems because of their exceptional width 17.3". There is yet another possibility: stay with the Multibib (540/65R34) on the rears, but switch to the Michelin XM108 (420/65R24) on the fronts, which is only 15.6" wide. Based on Caledon's experience with the 14.9R24 on his fronts (16.1" wide) I believe there should be no problem with the 15.6" width of the XM108. This combination would be just slightly more combined flat plate for all of the four tires than Caledon has with his combo -- and the machine would be 4" shorter.


XM108 420/65R24 15.6(width) 45.7(diam.) 134.8(circ.) 214.2(flat plt.)


At this point it's too late, I'm growing weary and cannot think with any degree of clarity. If it doesn't sound like a good plan, there's always tomorrow.

Island Farmer

 

[AKfish]

Rears Flail OMF 750 series 7' with 24" hydraulic offset pantograph and OM750 hammers.

Woods 92" Gannon Industrial box scraper 4x4 series. (My tractor will be 7' wide with the new tires, I can go with 84", 88" or 92". Caledon said to go with the 92", do you concur?)

Woods LR800 8' landscape rake with dual gauge wheels and hydraulic angle.

Rankin 5/8" by 9' chain harrow. (Do you think I should go wider, or with a different brand? I was thinking that this width would be easier for me to store and deal with.)

And I am at least going to add the hydraulic top link. You already told me that you don't use the tilt that much. Possibly with the boxblade it could come in handy?

Finally, the dealer is going to bring out a heavy duty landplane he has for me to try out. If I like it I might go for one of those.

That's quite a shopping list you've compiled! Nearly everything needed for a commercial landscaper! :thumbsup:

With the wider tires and the additional weight you should have no problem with a 92" box blade. Given that configuration and the hyd top link - on the fly adjustments should be a thing of beauty!

Is that model of chain harrow one that can be re-configured or expanded by adding sections? If so, sounds good to me... My only reservations would be sufficient width to do the work efficiently. You should have more than enough tractor to pull a larger unit. Storage could be a simpler problem to address than an implement that doesn't do the job!

Like the addition of the offset feature with the flail. And the hydralic angle on the landscape rake should be a sweet feature as well. You'll be able to "windrow" sticks and debris similar to what a harley rake would do.

Gonna need a higher resolution digital camera for all those pics now!

AKfish

 

[pclausen]

Appreciate all the additional thoughts Island!

My primary reason for wanting to go wide/flotation is that I got about 10 acres of turf that I'll be cutting on a weekly basis. Depending on how wet the summers are, some areas can get pretty soft (entire area is in a 100 year floodplane along a river). Today it takes me about 5 hours to cut with my 4700 w/ 17.5" wide R4 tires. If I'm very carefull, I can cut it when the ground is soft without leaving marks. The 5085M will be almost twice the weight, hence the quest for some wide floaters. Today I'm cutting with a 90" Woods RM-990, and I'm looking to trade that in on a 15' turf batwing to cut the moving down to 1 hour or so (I hope).

I too am on the fence about filling the rears as I like the flexibility of being as light as I can be when moving turf. For cutting brush on the hills, filled tires would be great, but weights and a wide stance would get pretty close I would think. I wonder how big a pain it is to take wheel weights on and off. I got air tools so maybe only a minute or two per side?

Given the cost, I might just stick with the 420/85 R34 / 13.6R24 $3500 option unless my dealer can get me into what Caledon is running for close to the same cost.

Thanks

Peter

 

[Zebrafive]

Been following this. Newbie question, what is flat plt?

Have you considered the ratio of front to rear for the different combinations you are considering to keep the front leading 1.5-4%? My manual lists 18 different ratios for the transmission gear pairs for the front axle output. Not sure how many combos are availbe for yours.

I think the newer wheel weights hook on the previous weight and use one bolt to hold it in place with the combination turned 180 degrees for each additional weight, so taking off all but the starter weight should not be too bad.

Would duals be an option for floatation use and off the majority of the time?

 

[pclausen]

Have you considered the ratio of front to rear for the different combinations you are considering to keep the front leading 1.5-4%?

Yep. All the combos we have been listing fall in this range. From the technical specs from the 5085M:

The transmission front/rear ratio for standard-width 5000 Series Tractors is 1.3495. The inverse, used for 4WD matching calculations, equals 0.741. The 0.741 factor determines the front tire with 0 percent overrun. A 0.778 factor, 0.741 x 1.05, determines the front tire with 5 percent overrun.\

Determine the rear tire desired.
Obtain the rolling circumference (RC) of that tire from the tire manufacturer's handbook.
Calculate the RC of the smallest and largest compatible front tire by using the following formula:
RC (rear tire) x 0.741 = RC (front tire - smallest)
RC (rear tire) x 0.778 = RC (front tire - largest)
Choose a satisfactory matching front tire by scanning the RC column of a tire manufacturer's handbook. A tire is a satisfactory match if the RC falls between the smallest and largest RCs determined above.

 

[pclausen]

I think the newer wheel weights hook on the previous weight and use one bolt to hold it in place with the combination turned 180 degrees for each additional weight, so taking off all but the starter weight should not be too bad.

Sounds good. Might be a good option for me. Might even be cheaper than filling the tires.

 

[Island Farmer]

Appreciate all the additional thoughts Island!

My primary reason for wanting to go wide/flotation is that I got about 10 acres of turf that I'll be cutting on a weekly basis. Depending on how wet the summers are, some areas can get pretty soft (entire area is in a 100 year floodplane along a river). Today it takes me about 5 hours to cut with my 4700 w/ 17.5" wide R4 tires. If I'm very carefull, I can cut it when the ground is soft without leaving marks. The 5085M will be almost twice the weight, hence the quest for some wide floaters. Today I'm cutting with a 90" Woods RM-990, and I'm looking to trade that in on a 15' turf batwing to cut the moving down to 1 hour or so (I hope).

I too am seriously concerned about ground compaction and rutting. I am going to find out more today about the combination of XM108 (420/65R24) front and Multibib (540/65R34) rears, that I mentioned last night. This combination would actually be slightly more flat plate than Caledon has with his taller tires.

I too am on the fence about filling the rears as I like the flexibility of being as light as I can be when moving turf. For cutting brush on the hills, filled tires would be great, but weights and a wide stance would get pretty close I would think. I wonder how big a pain it is to take wheel weights on and off. I got air tools so maybe only a minute or two per side?

Given the cost, I might just stick with the 420/85 R34 / 13.6R24 $3500 option unless my dealer can get me into what Caledon is running for close to the same cost.

The tire manufacturers do say that it is acceptable to put up to 40% liquid in the radials. I am thinking about doing this and adding wheel weights. I don't feel it is necessary to permanently weight the tractor for maximum lifting. The only time I am seriously concerned about the back of the tractor being too light is when I am using my grapple. I will simple put on a 3pt weight box or other heavy implement, boxblade etc.

My plan for liquid and iron ballast would be as follows. Multibib has a capacity of 128 gals., so 40% is 51 gals. Rimguard is approx. 11 lbs. per gal. So, I would be adding a total of 561 lbs per tire of Rimguard, and either one or two 95 lb wheel weights per tire. Also, I believe the Multibibs are significantly heavier than the stock tires.

On a completely different topic, is the Aux work light kit (LVB25720 @ $134) per corner for a single unit, or as that for a pair? If a pair, I would need 2 pairs to do both the front and back, right? Finally, I saw somewhere that there was a halogen work light option, but I don't recall where. It that the case, and if so, does anyone know the code for those?

The auxiliary light kit is comprised of two lights for a MSRP of $134.

My tractor came from the factory with two auxiliary lights in the front and two in the rear. I am having two more front and two more rear added, so that I can have a wider lighted area.

I will let you know what additional information I learn.

Island Farmer