Snow I broke my new snowblower!

[5030]

I can almost garantee that the PTO shaft was too too long and the stress crack picture from the right side of the gear box shows how it happended from the repeated binding and release pressure from the rotation of the shaft.

Even with the turn buckles tightened this would not happen with the properly sized propeller shaft.


A mounted implement with a PTO driveline atached should be able to raise fully within the full arc without binding the propeller shaft when the P.T.O., shaft is engaged by the operator.

The break in the gearbox case at the neck shows a lot of thrust damage with the way the metal was fractured due to the presssure of the stress agains the locking collar of the gear box which holds the seal, shaft and drive gear.

The shear pins would npt have helped you in this case as the streses were in the very beginning of the drive train for the snow caster and the tarp simply became huge balled up mass that kept getting larger eventually causing the auger to be moved.


Once they open the gearbox they fill find a very large amount of thrust damage to the other gear and bearing.

Let me distill your post a bit....

What you are saying is that he's screwed unless he can substantiate the fact that the dealer set up the blower and PTO and it was the dealers fault that they didn't shorten the shaft properly???

Right??

The dealer is not going to admit to that. He's screwed....

In actuality, the gearbox should be relatively inexpensive and he didn't blow the back PTO seal or euchre the output bearing on the back cover (of the tractor), both expensive to replace. The seal ain't much but most require the removal of the back cover to install.....

Usually, when it becomes an interference fit (binds), you can hear and feel it. Deaf and numb butt maybe??:laughing:

I always check the lift arc as it pertains to the PTO shaft personally, on every implement I mount, but then, that's just me....

 

[taborekle]

Honesty isn't worth anything until you have to pay for it.

While I don't think that this is a warranty situation, it probably is a insurance situation.

Larry

 

[149owner]

In regards to all the posts about the PTO length, with the snowblower fully raised I still have about 1/2" of travel on the input shaft so it wasn't binding on the shaft. The blower was on the ground when this happened and I never ran it in the full up position. The reason the shaft looks like it is on an angle is because it broke inside the gearbox and the PTO whipped it around and broke the case. It's a Puma 54, which isn't a cheap bargain brand unit, that is mounted on a BX 2200.

I talked to the dealer today and told him exactly what happened and he asked me to send him the pictures, which I did. I'll call him tomorrow to see what he says. I'm hoping they will send me a new gear box under warranty and I'll install it.

Deerslayer- My book shows the same gear box part number for the Puma 48, 54 and 64

 

[5030]

In regards to all the posts about the PTO length, with the snowblower fully raised I still have about 1/2" of travel on the input shaft so it wasn't binding on the shaft. The blower was on the ground when this happened and I never ran it in the full up position. The reason the shaft looks like it is on an angle is because it broke inside the gearbox and the PTO whipped it around and broke the case. It's a Puma 54, which isn't a cheap bargain brand unit, that is mounted on a BX 2200.

I talked to the dealer today and told him exactly what happened and he asked me to send him the pictures, which I did. I'll call him tomorrow to see what he says. I'm hoping they will send me a new gear box under warranty and I'll install it.

Deerslayer- My book shows the same gear box part number for the Puma 48, 54 and 64

It's not the fully raised position that causes the takeup in the shaft, it's the fully LOWERED position. Thats where the bind occurs. You loose all the shaft overlap in the lowered position. Thats why, when sizing companion shaft length on PTO implements. you always determine the length and allow for at least 1/2" or better, depending on PTO Shaft length, in the run position, NEVER IN THE RAISED POSITION....:confused2:

Scribe an arc using the lift arm balls and the end of the PTO output shaft. You'll see that when the implement is on the ground, the (PTO) shaft length is appreciably shorter than when raised.

Keep your fingers crossed......

 

[yelbike]

It's not the fully raised position that causes the takeup in the shaft, it's the fully LOWERED position. Thats where the bind occurs. You loose all the shaft overlap in the lowered position. Thats why, when sizing companion shaft length on PTO implements. you always determine the length and allow for at least 1/2" or better, depending on PTO Shaft length, in the run position, NEVER IN THE RAISED POSITION....:confused2:

Scribe an arc using the lift arm balls and the end of the PTO output shaft. You'll see that when the implement is on the ground, the (PTO) shaft length is appreciably shorter than when raised.

Keep your fingers crossed......

If Ted at everything attachments wrote the bible on everything attachments( I think he did), then I believe for the proper shaft length you should be able to remove the pto from the tractor at all positions. I also believe in he's youtube video he says there should at least 2" of play.

I'm not saying the failure is from a length issue. I wasn't there plus the wrapped up tarp must have done something. I would inspected shear pins. Check to make sure nothing else is seized up. Something may be rusted from sitting presale or during the summer.

You'd hate to fix it the the same thing happens at the other end of the pto shaft. That really sucks and expensie.

 

[4shorts]

It's not the fully raised position that causes the takeup in the shaft, it's the fully LOWERED position. Thats where the bind occurs. NEVER IN THE RAISED POSITION....:confused2:

Nope. Not true and very wrong.

The binding will occur when the implement is lifted to the mid point and that's where the shortest part of the drive-shaft is causing the drive shaft to wedge between the PTO and the implement.

Back in 2008 when I got my 4240 the dealer didn't cut the shaft to the proper length and when I would lift my blower the drive shaft would start to push the blowers gear box to the point where the paint around the bolts was cracking. The blowers impeller would bind in the tub and as I lowered it the binding would stop. The farther up I would raise the blower the worst the binding would get. I removed the drive shaft, cut it and re-installed and never had an issue after.

 

[Redneck in training]

The distance between the tractor and the implement is the shortest when the shaft and the drive and driven ends are in one line. It can be different for each implement and tractor combination. The best way to check it is to shorten the top link to some reasonable length, rise the implement to such a level so the gearbox and the PTO of the tractor are in the same level and then try to connect the shaft. If you are able to connect it it can't bind.

 

[CHDinCT]

If he only had 1/2" of play when fully raised, I'm betting it was binding as he lowered it and perhaps in the fully down position. Probably not enough to break the gearbox right away, but definitely when he snagged the tarp. The gearbox may have been stressed enough it gave way before the shear bolts did. Hopefully the dealer helps him out, but I would not bet on it.

 

[mjncad]

I'd look at shear pins and PTO shaft length. Did somebody put Grade 5 or 8 bolts in there instead of Grade 2 or whatever the manufacturer specifies.

It also looks like the PTO shaft was shoved into the blower's gearbox as it was too long. 4Shorts is right about the PTO shaft length. The only way I could see PTO shaft binding at full extension is if there isn't enough of the inner shaft engaged with the outer shaft causing a wobble at the hinge point and wallowing out the outer shaft before it fails.

I hope you can get it fixed on someone else's dime.

 

[slowzuki]

To all of those commenting on the pto binding, it depends on the tractor and the ratio of pto shaft to 3 point arm length and the location of the pins on the blower, not a universal thing, which is why you check it when setting up.

On a blower, they often are such that raised to transport the pto is as short as it will get on a compact tractor. My Kubota pumps the Lucknow blowers shaft 6" shorter when raised. The same blower on my big MF only makes the shaft move about 3" in the arc of travel.

The new Normand I picked up only moves the shaft about 4" on the Kubota as it has a bigger fan so the pto shaft isn't at such a steep angle.