Over engineering

[slowzuki]

As an engineer, this strikes close to home. Many engineers are told to solve a problem and given constraints, usually time and money. I had a contractor complain about a design I did, I had 5 days on site, then 4 weeks to prepare the design, calculations, drawings, tender docs etc, and I couldn't access the equipment, only look from 60+ ft away. The drawings I had to work from were not as-built and were really bad to non-existing.

They had hanging scaffolding, manlifts and over 3 years to do the install, but complained to me when the dimensions caused minor pipe interferences (despite the note to co-ordinate with existing services.)

 

[dynasim]

Mace,

I am going to make 4 points.

1) Identifying small numbers of circumstances of engineers making poor judgment, and using that to justify derision on the whole group is not reasonable.

2) Maintainabilty and accessiblity are not the only inputs into a engineering judgment, and engineers rarely set the constraints. If you are going to stuff a 3 ft3 device into a 3.5 ft3 volume, the end user is not going to be happy with maintainability of that device.

3) What is the "common sense" judgement that would have allowed the engineers to know that a 3 thread spark plug is not reasonable(and is it really not reasonable or just poorly executed). The maximum of 3 threads may very will have been imposed by weight constraints(head thickness).

4) A successful business is unlikely to reinvent the wheel for the fun of it. If the wheel had not be reinvented several times, I am quite sure that my car would not ride as well as it does(stone wheels would likely lead to a rough ride).


Chris

 

[mad_planter]

mad_planter

The story about the blow hard was meant to insult engineers. The ball point pen story was meant to insult engineers. What you are saying is that when someone insults me, I should just take it.

You say you are an atypical(and good) engineer because you take surveys of what the technicians want, and do that(I am paraphrasing for effect).

I say a good engineer utilizes clear objectives and knowledge of all the available useful data(including the effected parties limitations/strengths/knowledge) to develop safe, robust, maintainable, buildable, cost effective designs.

Your statement



is so far off the mark, as to not need any rebuttal. Are you saying automotive engineers don't take replacement of oil filters into account? Perhaps the oil filter should be mounted on the console for ease of access (I am being sarcastic.)

There are good engineers and bad engineers.
There are good operators and bad operators.
There are producers and there are leaches.

This is true in every walk of life.

Chris

I coped and pasted the story about the conveyor belt and sent it to the other engineers I work with on a regular basis. Not one of them called me on the carpet for sending something that was insulting. Several of them (that I know of) actually sent it on to others. I and they didn't take it as a insult but rather keep a open mind to suggestions by others.

Certainly many of these types of things are meant as insults delivered out jealousy or bitterness, bit I don't think that those two have to be taken that way

 

[dynasim]

Roy,

The petrochemical industry has whole departments focused on maintainability and reliablity. The consequences of equipment failure is significant, and they can have normal run times(with no shutdowns) of 2-4 years.

Chris

 

[dynasim]

Mad_planter

I suggest you read the intent of the OP's original post.

Blond jokes are funny and illustrative, too. They are just no more true than the parable of the blow hard. There are stupid blondes, but, because a joke is funny, it wouldn't be reasonable to assume that blondes are stupid.

You took a clever, illustrative parable, and said it was true for "Most" engineers(but not to yourself, because you are better than that). The quote is shown below.

The same thing goes for designing a machine. Most engineers are not going to look at their design of engine and say "what if I had to change the oil filter" What if I have to change the heater hose, etc, etc. But if you bring in a mechanic who doesn't design engines, just works on them. He's going to see things from his perspective; Namely that getting to the oil filter is a pain in the butt and how on earth am I going to change that heater hose if it breaks?

You and your buddies can choose to accept derision. I don't have to. Mockery(which was my choice for a civilized reply), is an effective tool to stop this sort of thing.

Chris

 

[mad_planter]

So be it. I said I was as guilty of it as anyone. I simply offered up a different point of view.

have fun with the chip on your shoulder. I'm sure it will bring you happiness.

I can't contribute anymore to the conversation.

 

[Cat_Driver]

On the same vein, often times I will delay a project because I over think it. Then I get to the point that's it's too complicated. I will hire someone to do the work, they show up with the minimum of tools and just tackle the project. After watching them I think - " I could have done that"

I think some people ( me ) want things done perfectly, and the people you hire to do the work could care less about "perfection".

I see all the problems that may arise and try to figure those in. A service person just doesn't think of the "problems" that may arise, or doesn't care and jump in with both feet.

After all it's not their house, their vehicle, their anything, so if they leave a scratch, a gouge, a hole in something, they just move on. Me, I have to look at and life with those mistakes, thereby my over thinking everything to not make those mistakes.

Same with employees, they could care less if they don't secure something to a truck and it works lose and break, or if they forget any supplies of tools for a job, after all it's not their problem.

 

[Mace Canute]

dynasim, I made a few points as to why some people have a poor opinion of some engineers. Your response was "interesting" and informative in a way...but probably not in the way you think it was.

 

[dynasim]

Mace Canute,

I am simply resisting the destructive perpetuation of a stereotype.

Now I am an egotistical jerk with a chip on my shoulder(you didn't call me that but others did). Not really.

Perhaps you could tell me how it was "interesting" and informative in a way.
If you don't want to put it on this thread, pm me. I'd appreciate it.

Seriously. I enjoy reading your contributions.

Chris

 

[murphy1244]

I remember a Chevy Monza V-8 that you had to pull the engine to change spark plugs. :laughing: