Next door neighbor....fenced 3/4 Acre of my farm..Tenant

brin · Feb 5, 2012

So the Mrs. and I and our dog went out to our farm this morning...drove down our road , checked our lake and pastures and we were driving back down our road to leave when my wife said " What is that fence doing over there ? " I looked and there was some field fence installed coming from the road next door clear onto our property toward the front acreage and continuing in a zig zag fashion taking about 3/4 Acre and then tying back into a gate on the road next door....Somebody had fenced in part of our property...

The house and 6 Ac. next door has been for sale so I called the Real Estate agent and told her about it...and she said..." Oh no...that must have been the new tenant ...we just rented it..." I told her to get the new tenant to get the fence down today and all fence staples that were driven into our trees up , out and off my property or I would be calling the Sheriff and would bill the tenant for the cost of removal and they would be charged with trespassing and criminal damage to property..

Just hard to believe how stupid some people are....So anyone out there...be sure and drive your property often...there is just no telling what you will find.

Western · Feb 5, 2012

That would "catch" someone by surprise!!
I think I would have called the Sheriff, even though they will say it is a "civil" matter, you will have some documentation. A certified letter to the property management too maybe. Just in case it becomes "nasty"

Knowing me, I would have been right down on that guy's porch:laughing: I bet that 3/4 acre is worth ALLOT for a trespass fee

zzvyb6 · Feb 5, 2012

Get the police report now. The matter is not finished by any means. There probably has been a 'mis-communication' from the real estate agent to the tenant as to how much and where the property lines are.

Until this is settled face to face, maybe even in small claims court, your property definition is at risk. The tenant may blame the real estate office and they will come back with some counter-claims, maybe including a township record of what used to be your property ( ! ).

Be sure to post it real quick before the loggers show up.

brin · Feb 5, 2012

Western said:
That would "catch" someone by surprise!!
I think I would have called the Sheriff, even though they will say it is a "civil" matter, you will have some documentation. A certified letter to the property management too maybe. Just in case it becomes "nasty"

Knowing me, I would have been right down on that guy's porch:laughing: I bet that 3/4 acre is worth ALLOT for a trespass fee

Oh Western, you do not know how bad I wanted to drive back down the road next door and go right up on his front porch....but thankfully I had my wife with me ....ever notice when your wife is with you , you are automatically at a disadvantage because if something goes wrong you now have to defend her first, anyway...discretion is the better part of valor as they say...I followed up my phone call with an email to the realtor so I have papered the file...When I go to the farm tomorrow if the fence is not down I will call the sheriff and meet them out there ...I agree they will say it is a civil matter but I will disagree and ask to sign a complaint for trespass.

zzvyb6 said:
Get the police report now. The matter is not finished by any means. There probably has been a 'mis-communication' from the real estate agent to the tenant as to how much and where the property lines are.

Until this is settled face to face, maybe even in small claims court, your property definition is at risk. The tenant may blame the real estate office and they will come back with some counter-claims, maybe including a township record of what used to be your property ( ! ).

Be sure to post it real quick before the loggers show up.

ZZ , You are right...I will try the sheriff first ...if that fails I will use Small Claims court, take my survey and pictures and go for the damage to the hardwoods from the fence staples and possible flat tractor tires in the future. I am all over this...If we don't stand up immediately for our property rights we will lose them....give them an inch and they will take 3/4 of an acre and then all of it...

RDrancher · Feb 5, 2012

Yep, amazing what some people will do.

At my old place I had a neighbor that kept doing all sorts of things on my side of the fence. Against my nature I tried the "civil" thing and spoke to him about it a few times. At the urging of my wife I even had the sheriff come out and speak to him. But stuff kept happening.

So one day I was brush hogging and found that he had built a storage shed against his side of the fence but had dumped the leftover dirt from the holes, concrete and scrap wood on my side. I figured I'd turned the other cheek more than enough times, so I scooped up two bucket loads of what I considered to be his "misplaced property" and deposited it on the roof of the new shed. Never had a problem after that.

JamesHW · Feb 5, 2012

As an owner of a farm that is an 8 hour drive away, I can relate, and my first reaction might well have been angry.

Having said that, calling the sheriff or thinking about some sort of litigation would have been the furthest from my mind. From all appearances some sort of stupid mistake has been made and your property encroached on. The correction of the encroachment can easily be made by removing/moving the offending fence (and filling in the holes). Now if they had cut down trees, there is the question of stumpage.

The question now is where the actual property line is, and if the owner even knows accurately where it is. If the stakes can be found, it becomes a simple matter of doing a decent job of traversing between them. Maybe a survey is called for if they can't figure it out.

Your post reminded me that the nearest neighbor to me, a trailer on a small, 1/3 acre quadrilateral shaped plot, has I believe some claim on part of my property in the form of a easement for his leech field. Something to deal with at some point unless I can buy the place back one day.

brin · Feb 5, 2012

JamesHW said:
As an owner of a farm that is an 8 hour drive away, I can relate, and my first reaction might well have been angry.

Having said that, calling the sheriff or thinking about some sort of litigation would have been the furthest from my mind. From all appearances some sort of stupid mistake has been made and your property encroached on. The correction of the encroachment can easily be made by removing/moving the offending fence (and filling in the holes). Now if they had cut down trees, there is the question of stumpage.

The question now is where the actual property line is, and if the owner even knows accurately where it is. If the stakes can be found, it becomes a simple matter of doing a decent job of traversing between them. Maybe a survey is called for if they can't figure it out.

Your post reminded me that the nearest neighbor to me, a trailer on a small, 1/3 acre quadrilateral shaped plot, has I believe some claim on part of my property in the form of a easement for his leech field. Something to deal with at some point unless I can buy the place back one day.

No in this case the realtor that leased the property has a copy of the survey and it is current and it clearly shows the property line...so there is no excuse for the fence...It was a clear reach for a way to quickly fence in to the gate on their property without having to drive posts on the proper property line ...so instead they decided to drive 1 &1/2 inch fence staples into some very fine hardwood trees...I call that damage and I have never heard of filling in staple holes in trees...and I am sure not going to do it...No there is damage done...Heck, just the act of trespassing let alone having the Gaul to nail fence to my trees...Like I said, I play hardball when someone is this digressive in a trespass..

SPIKER · Feb 5, 2012

driving staples (large fencing nails into trees) at any age will cause damage to the trees and if left in saw damage too that you the tree owner will be held liable for if they are timber grade or if fire wood grade still cause chain damage when sawing them up.

while tree will heal and probably not die unless galvanized or brass / copper nails there fact remains it will be an issue some day.

mark

Fixemall · Feb 5, 2012

I had some vacant land resurveyed and it was determined that one of the neighbors was parking their junk camper trailer on the property, I let them know by certified letter that it must be moved in thirty days, after 60 or so days it was still there and I came with my trailer and winched it off to the scrap yard, figure I was owed the weight as lot rent. Still never heard a peep out of those folks.

Jstpssng · Feb 5, 2012

SPIKER said:
driving staples (large fencing nails into trees) at any age will cause damage to the trees and if left in saw damage too that you the tree owner will be held liable for if they are timber grade or if fire wood grade still cause chain damage when sawing them up.

while tree will heal and probably not die unless galvanized or brass / copper nails there fact remains it will be an issue some day.

mark

If there was any possibility of sawlog or especially veneer quality in those logs it has been greatly compromised. In Maine it's against the law to drive nails into another's trees.

Tread carefully though; there was a very infamous thread a few years ago where a TBN member lost his shirt in a dispute with a neighbor.

forgeblast · Feb 5, 2012

I find it interesting (odd) that someone renting a property would be putting up fencing.

brin · Feb 5, 2012

forgeblast said:
I find it interesting (odd) that someone renting a property would be putting up fencing.

It is a real low gauge field type fence, not even suitable to hold any animals it , only about 4 ft. high but he put in about 300 ft. of it , all nailed to my trees. I think he did it to tie it into a chain link gate that gates his driveway in...like it would stop somebody form walking down his road...He did not run the fence down the edge of his driveway where the property line is because he would have had to install fence posts to do it right...instead he used my trees and just installed his fence where the trees were ...ending back at his gate.

jpm1 · Feb 5, 2012

RDrancher, your my kinda guy! In reading i was expecting you to say "while turning the tractor the loader hit the shed and knocked it down" but putting stuff on the roof is even better! Like to have you for a neighbor but your quite a distance away! .. . John

Brin, why do you feel you are you at a disadvantage when your wife is along? I have been in a number of disagreements such as this one, and if your right and can prove it! Let it HAPPEN! Years ago we came home one day to find a mobile home hauler stuck in my hay lot with a HUGE mobile home and hauler truck He'd knocked down about 5 acres of Alafalfa hay and put it into a big mud pit. When i saw this all my wife said was "Holy sh*t as i jumped out of the truck and went after the guy. The hauler said he didn't need permission and to get out of his ******way! Needless to say a fist fight broke out, the man was arrested after an emergency room visit for stitches ect. . . When our case came before the judge it was funny to hear the mobile home hauler talk his way out of the ordeal especially being a town justice an a near by town. Well He lost! Judge ordered I hold his truck, New 72' mobile home and moving equipment until i was financially compensated for the damage and the ground was repaired, another fight broke out in the court room and a simple tresspass, property damage issue went big! The hauler lost his privelidge to be town Justice and i was compensated quite a large sum of money.Guess i was lucky, bring the law with you first! Good luck. .. John

brin · Feb 5, 2012

jpm1 said:
RDrancher, your my kinda guy! In reading i was expecting you to say "while turning the tractor the loader hit the shed and knocked it down" but putting stuff on the roof is even better! Like to have you for a neighbor but your quite a distance away! .. . John

Brin, why do you feel you are you at a disadvantage when your wife is along? I have been in a number of disagreements such as this one, and if your right and can prove it! Let it HAPPEN! Years ago we came home one day to find a mobile home hauler stuck in my hay lot with a HUGE mobile home and hauler truck He'd knocked down about 5 acres of Alafalfa hay and put it into a big mud pit. When i saw this all my wife said was "Holy sh*t as i jumped out of the truck and went after the guy. The hauler said he didn't need permission and to get out of his ******way! Needless to say a fist fight broke out, the man was arrested after an emergency room visit for stitches ect. . . When our case came before the judge it was funny to hear the mobile home hauler talk his way out of the ordeal especially being a town justice an a near by town. Well He lost! Judge ordered I hold his truck, New 72' mobile home and moving equipment until i was financially compensated for the damage and the ground was repaired, another fight broke out in the court room and a simple tresspass, property damage issue went big! The hauler lost his privelidge to be town Justice and i was compensated quite a large sum of money.Guess i was lucky, bring the law with you first! Good luck. .. John

JP --- That is a great story ...it worked out great for you...but what would have happened if the guy had been armed and would have shot you..what would have happened to your wife if he went after her next ? What I do when I am alone is one thing but when I have my wife with me I temper my actions with her safety in mind....I mean who knows what can happen ?

The other reason is , it is never a good idea to go on someones property when there is a chance of an argument taking place...they can then say anything...they can accuse you of things you did not do...just by being on their property you are at a disadvantage.. Now had I caught him in the act, on my property then that would have been different...I would have driven my wife to the front of the property and walked back and taken care of business...See my point..? when are wives are with us we owe it to them to be absolutely certain we keep them out of harms way.

brin · Feb 5, 2012

RDrancher said:
Yep, amazing what some people will do.

At my old place I had a neighbor that kept doing all sorts of things on my side of the fence. Against my nature I tried the "civil" thing and spoke to him about it a few times. At the urging of my wife I even had the sheriff come out and speak to him. But stuff kept happening.

So one day I was brush hogging and found that he had built a storage shed against his side of the fence but had dumped the leftover dirt from the holes, concrete and scrap wood on my side. I figured I'd turned the other cheek more than enough times, so I scooped up two bucket loads of what I considered to be his "misplaced property" and deposited it on the roof of the new shed. Never had a problem after that.

Now that is sweet justice...I think he got the message...

Catfish Man · Feb 5, 2012

The average person has no clue how much an acre is (They think an acre is HUGE). Most likely the real estate agent told the renter he has six acres and the renter has no clue that he is off the land.

scott_vt · Feb 5, 2012

Good Afternoon Bob,
Sorry to hear that you had to go throuh all of that baloney... I can relate though

This past year the neighbor down below me was having a graduation party, and decided that the lower part of my field was an ideal place for their " slip and slide"...

My feeling has allways been, just ask me and permission will be granted, for anything resonable. I didnt want to spoil the party so I didnt say anything at the time. A couple of days go by, and this long strip of plastic is still in my field.

I went down and told them that I wanted removed right away before it killed all the grass... The next day it was finally gone, and that morning I went down to the boundary line, and hammered in new steel stake that was painted bright red... I think they got the idea !

RDrancher · Feb 5, 2012

brin said:
JP --- That is a great story ...it worked out great for you...but what would have happened if the guy had been armed and would have shot you..what would have happened to your wife if he went after her next ? What I do when I am alone is one thing but when I have my wife with me I temper my actions with her safety in mind....I mean who knows what can happen ?

The other reason is , it is never a good idea to go on someones property when there is a chance of an argument taking place...they can then say anything...they can accuse you of things you did not do...just by being on their property you are at a disadvantage.. Now had I caught him in the act, on my property then that would have been different...I would have driven my wife to the front of the property and walked back and taken care of business...See my point..? when are wives are with us we owe it to them to be absolutely certain we keep them out of harms way.

I would actually NEVER suggest anyone to handle things the way I did. That's just the way I've always handled things. Get even before I have time to get mad. My wife actually thinks she's mellowed me out a bit.

In my case, unless there' s some kind of ownership of airspace inside fence lines, the only thing that crossed his was the bucket on my tractor.

Hahaha...Just realized I put in the wrong quote.

jpm1 · Feb 5, 2012

Well brin Your right, dont' go on someone elses property with a badge with ya. First of all we dont' think much on "what if's" especially on MY PROPERTY! I WILL PROTECT AND DEFEND it and all my family on it no matter what it takes if we are right! and next . . . at one time my wife was a real good shot and with a rifle in the back window of the truck she followed after me. I told her, dont' shoot him unless i yell shoot! After things calmed down the Law found him carring a pistol and no permit. The Law never brought up the riffle we had and holding a man at gunpoint! In our county, and it is a good county too! you might wait hours for the law to show up unless you got a gun! . . . Besides It's nice to have a wife backing ya up that would go to the end for you, no questions asked! . . .John