HELP! New trailer or bigger axels

[El Wood]

I had the same dilema. I had a homemade 16' trailer with 3,000# axels and light tires. When I bought my BX25 I quickly found out it was too light as well as my Chev Colorado was too light. I checked all the things you have. Almost bought the 6000# axels, tires, wheels, and brakes. It was $900. When I described the trailer the trailer dealer stated he would sell the axel over the counter but would not install because of liability. He would also sell me a new or used 12,000# trailer but would not deliver if I hooked up in his yard. He would deliver and drop where I wanted, for a fee, and I could do what I wanted from there. Again liability. I then got smart quick. I traded the truck for a 1 ton dually 4 X 4. Then after 6 months of looking and following up on Craig's list adds; found a used 12,000# dual axel, hydraulic lift bed, bobtail trailer for $2200 at my tractor dealer. I saw used stuff from $500-$4,000 that either were sold when I got there or were a piece of junk. Now I am set for my BX plus most of what I may need to rent larger. Also the lift bed is great for hauling bulk material to dump; lift the bed and rake out w/the FEL. I think you will find your F-150 is not rated for what you want to do. I needed at least a heavy duty 3/4 ton to leagally do what I wanted. Also most states require working brakes on trailers the size you need so you need an electric brake controller or and inertia brake trailer. Think long and hard before you waste time and money on a part solution. This tractor business is not an inexpensive hobby if you do it right.

Ron

Thanks for this info Ron. It definitely sounds like the same dilemma. I talked to the same trailer dealer who sold me the aluminum 7x16 and he said he would sell me a nice 12,000# for around $3,000. After reading all the posts here, I think a new trailer is the best idea. I'm going to start looking on Craigslist also and see if I can find a nice used one. Another option is renting one when needed. The local rental store charges $40.00 / day. The only problem with that is I would like to be able to show up at my father's house last minute if needed with the tractor, especially in the winter to plow his drive. He's getting older and having a tough time doing work around his property. As far as the truck goes, I'm going to stick with my 2010 F-150. It's a 4x4 Lariat with 157" WB. It has the 5.4L V8 in it. Also, it has the 7350# gvwr package, tow package and sway control. I lease my trucks to if I don't like the tow, I can look at upgrading to a F250 next year when I turn it in. Thanks again for the post.

Paul

 

[downslope]

No need to do that. I have not messed with 14" wheels in awhile but from what I remember the C (6ply) 205's are rated at around 1,800# each. This would give you 3,600# of tire on a 3,500# axle if inflated to 50psi. You cannot get better tires in a 14" wheel so that means you will have to go to a 15" wheel and a 225 tire. There is no way that is going to fit under you fenders. Long story short, they put plenty of tire on that trailer. The limiting factor is not the tires or axles, its the Frame!!!! You need a new trailer.

I have been in the trailer business as a side job for nearly 20 years. Granted, 75% of my work is boat trailers but the rules still apply. GVWR is always the limiting factor.

Chris

Is it typical to build a factory trailer this way and something you have to watch out for, that is where the components don't somewhat match up? Like Azclan says, why would you go to a more expensive aluminum trailer if it can only carry the same payload as a less expensive steel trailer with the same axles and tires. I would think if a trailer was factory engineered the individual components should be somewhat matched to each other in capacity.

 

[Renze]

Is it typical to build a factory trailer this way and something you have to watch out for, that is where the components don't somewhat match up? Like Azclan says, why would you go to a more expensive aluminum trailer if it can only carry the same payload as a less expensive steel trailer with the same axles and tires. I would think if a trailer was factory engineered the individual components should be somewhat matched to each other in capacity.

How do components not match up ? they all match (or exceed) the 5000 pound GVWR, dont they ? The ultimate answer to your question is written on the manufacturers sticker... But you wanted to hear something different, from anyone dumb enough to ignore liability

Manufacturers have to make do with what axles are commonly available on the market. And they probably buy them in bulk, which means its easier to put 3500 pound axles from stock under it, than to order and wait for some odd 2500 pound axles. (dont know whats common in North America, but in Holland we had 1350 and 1800kg axles: the 1000 and 1500 were just derated axles with shorter torsion rubbers, but with the same brakes and hubs...)
Also with certain rim sizes you need to have a brake drum that fits in the rim... we had 200x50 brakes and 250x40 brakes, both in 1800kg but adapted to different wheel and rim sizes. These brake and wheel combinations had to be approved by the Dutch equivalent of DOT because an axle is approved with only a limited margin of tire rolling radii. Lots of reasons why manufacturers choose an axle with overcapacity in a lighter trailer. Sometimes technical, sometimes commercial reasons.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Is it typical to build a factory trailer this way and something you have to watch out for, that is where the components don't somewhat match up? Like Azclan says, why would you go to a more expensive aluminum trailer if it can only carry the same payload as a less expensive steel trailer with the same axles and tires. I would think if a trailer was factory engineered the individual components should be somewhat matched to each other in capacity.

Lets just say I have seen it before. I can not tell you how many 7,000# trailers with 5,000# couplers. As for aluminum trailers go I have one and can tell you there is not much weight savings. Mine is 1 32' long boat trailer and it weighs 1,350# empty. A comparable steel trailer would weigh about 1,800# Yes, its a few pounds but the biggest issue is corrosion resistance. In the case of a boat trailer its a big deal if you dunk it in salt water. For a car haul/equipment trailer it would be nice in the snow belt and you pan on using it a lot in the winter.

Chris

 

[Diamondpilot]

Thanks for this info Ron. It definitely sounds like the same dilemma. I talked to the same trailer dealer who sold me the aluminum 7x16 and he said he would sell me a nice 12,000# for around $3,000. After reading all the posts here, I think a new trailer is the best idea. I'm going to start looking on Craigslist also and see if I can find a nice used one.
Paul

Watch buying used. Its my experience is 9 times out of 10 you are better off to buy new. I have guys bring me used trailers they "got a good deal on" and by the time its all done they could have bought a new one.

Here is a good example. My a customer bought a used, 5 year old or so, 16' landscape trailer for $800. It needed paint bad. Thats a simple fix. The wiring was messed up and so was the brakes so they brought it over to me to work on. Long story short, new wiring, new brakes, 4 new bearing sets, 4 new tires, and a new wood deck all in the first year and they are into it for $200 more than I could have gotten them a new identical trailer.

Chris

 

[aczlan]

Like Azclan says, why would you go to a more expensive aluminum trailer if it can only carry the same payload as a less expensive steel trailer with the same axles and tires.

Seems to me that they may have taken the same trailer, put a lighter deck on it and de-rated it (not that that helps the OP)...
Looking at various open aluminum trailers (such as this, this or this) it seems that an aluminum 6-7k 6.5x16 or 7x16 utility trailer runs between 1000# and 1300# unladen weight.
I might call the manufacturer and see if that is the case with your trailer. If so, they might be willing/able to issue you a new Cert of Origin for a heavier weight. I know that some manufactures will do with a 10,000# or 14,000# trailer that is plated for 9990# to avoid CDL limits...

Might be worth a shot.

Aaron Z

 

[meburdick]

GVWR = 5000, but two 3500 axles, from his 2nd photo. Sounds like an understrength frame.

View attachment 271093

Couldn't agree more. While the GVWR can NOT exceed the capability of the axles, the cargo capacity does NOT have to be the the capability of the axles minus the trailer weight. In this case, it appears that the 6k capability of the axles is simply not met by the strength of the frame of the trailer.

With a cargo capacity of 3700 lbs, that frame may simply not be able to handle the required 3 to 4 times that amount for stress (when loads shift).

Get the correct trailer. 16' isn't going to cut it for a 3xxx with a FEL anyhow. I have a 2520 and am looking at an 18' so that I can balance the load correctly over the axles.

 

[CurlyDave]

...Get the correct trailer. 16' isn't going to cut it for a 3xxx with a FEL anyhow. I have a 2520 and am looking at an 18' so that I can balance the load correctly over the axles.

This is a really good comment. Look at the trailer in the first picture. The axles are placed all the way to the rear. Any tractor you place on that trailer is going to be forward of the axles, not even close to balanced over them. This will increase the tongue weight substantially.

You really want a trailer with the axles just slightly aft of the middle of the trailer, which allows your load to be in the center of the trailer and still gives you some tongue weight.

 

[meburdick]

One other thing you have to understand is that the manufacturer builds them to a certain specification, but the dealer may want it rated differently. For example... My local dealer has a CAM Superline 5CAM16 on his lot. The sticker says 9990 GVWR (actually, he has a bunch of these trailers... One says 9990 while the one next to it says 9998). If you look at CAM's site, the 5CAM16 is rated at 11,960GVWR.

Dealers will often times get the stickers on the trailers to list a lower rating to avoid certain types of problems with registrations (like needing a CDL if your trailer is over 10k). When this happens, the ratings of the parts will add up to more than the GVWR of the trailer on the sticker.