TC 40 hydraulic oil backing into crank case

[Soundguy]

With that much wear, you'd expect to see a lot of particles in your main hydraulic filter if you cut it apart or in the bottom of your reservoir. ....... You have to accept that your pump's wear is excessive. I'm not saying it isn't, but I am saying it had to be caused by something abnormal.

for piece of mind I think I'd flush any lines, change filter and flush sump to make sure no flakes or particles are left to circulate with the new pump.

 

[jinman]

Please explain how advising AGAINST a $200 seal kit that will not preclude the necessary $700 pump purchase amounts to overselling. Seems to me following that advise would have saved you a minimum of $235.
Fact is, the vast majority of shaft seal failures are caused by worn out pump shafts and bushings/end plates.

Rick, I think many of us have been completely happy with our seal kits fixing our pumps. If you search TBN, I'd bet you will find more pump seal repairs than pump replacements. Why wouldn't someone question the advice to replace the whole pump? Since when does a customer not have the right to ask a question? If these pumps are prone to fail because of wear before 1000 hours, why don't dealers tell us that when we buy their tractor? I think you can certainly make the argument that a dealer's shop would have found the pump excessively worn if it had been delivered to them for repair, but I don't think any of us are gonna accept that the pump is worn out, sight-unseen, without asking some questions.

 

[RickB]

Rick, I think many of us have been completely happy with our seal kits fixing our pumps. If you search TBN, I'd bet you will find more pump seal repairs than pump replacements. Why wouldn't someone question the advice to replace the whole pump? Since when does a customer not have the right to ask a question? If these pumps are prone to fail because of wear before 1000 hours, why don't dealers tell us that when we buy their tractor? I think you can certainly make the argument that a dealer's shop would have found the pump excessively worn if it had been delivered to them for repair, but I don't think any of us are gonna accept that the pump is worn out, sight-unseen, without asking some questions.

Customers can always ask questions, but it's a waste of time if the answers are ignored. Just seems odd for the OP to call out two instances where he was given advise that ended up being sound. Somebody tells me that my pump is probably shot and I shouldn't spend $200 on a seal kit, at the very minimum I'm gonna tear the pump down BEFORE I spend the $200 and either make or get an informed decision on whether the seal kit is a waste of money.

The pump has to be disassembled anyway does it not?

 

[jinman]

Customers can always ask questions, but it's a waste of time if the answers are ignored. Just seems odd for the OP to call out two instances where he was given advise that ended up being sound. Somebody tells me that my pump is probably shot and I shouldn't spend $200 on a seal kit, at the very minimum I'm gonna tear the pump down BEFORE I spend the $200 and either make or get an informed decision on whether the seal kit is a waste of money.

The pump has to be disassembled anyway does it not?

I completely agree with that. That's why I had my pump torn down in my dealer's shop from the get-go.

 

[RickB]

I completely agree with that. That's why I had my pump torn down in my dealer's shop from the get-go.

Thanks for jumping down my throat. Coming here is getting to be too much like being at work sometimes. Dealers are all scum, but when it's time for advise, everyone has the phone #. Not expected from someone with 17,000 posts.

 

[parcrotcart]

RickyB, I didn't go to the dealership before I got the seal kit. Just thought from reading on here that that was my problem. But I don't know how much I like the idea of a pump not lasting 600 hours. Seems like they could sell you the wear plates or shafts to replace with instead of a brand new pump. Had a J Deere for over twenty years that never needed anything but an oil change every now and then. Just not used to working on something so often.

 

[RickB]

RickyB, I didn't go to the dealership before I got the seal kit. Just thought from reading on here that that was my problem. But I don't know how much I like the idea of a pump not lasting 600 hours. Seems like they could sell you the wear plates or shafts to replace with instead of a brand new pump. Had a J Deere for over twenty years that never needed anything but an oil change every now and then. Just not used to working on something so often.

Lots of those pumps out there with thousands of hours on them; troublefree. Problem is, buying a used tractor it is impossible to know ALL the operational history of the unit. A previous careless operator could have easily caused a deadheading situation in the pump circuit and sent the pump on the road to failure in as little as a few hours. Most gear pump damage is not confined to the end plates and shafts, but extends to the aluminum center sections. When the center gets galled, the pump is done even if it were to have replaceable ends and shafts.

 

[pak7819]

It's my turn in the barrel now I guess. Had a sneaking suspicion over the past few months needing to add a quart of ambra to the hyd fluid fill point at back of tractor now and then. Wasn't noticing at first that my engine oil was slowly rising, but smelled it today and sure enough, it's hyd fluid mixed in with engine oil. I must have a very small leak since over the last 200 hours or so (since I bought the tractor) the engine oil has crept from within the "ok" area on the dipstick to just above the "ok" area. My dealer is just down the road, in fact been exchanging messages with my parts guy already on a sunday night getting things lined up. Has anyone on here completely disassembled the hyd pump?

 

[jinman]

Sorry to hear of your problems. This "turn in the barrel" is no fun. How many hours are on your tractor and what year model? It seems that the newer tractors are having more failures. I'm sure I caused my failure by overworking my hydraulics while attempting to push big rocks (boulders). The later failures seem to be caused by excessive wear.

EDIT: By your profile, I see that your tractor is a 2006 with 1100 hours.

 

[pak7819]

Yeah, I'm not too happy to discover that I have the problem. I'm in the process of buttoning everything back together, my dealer was able to acquire parts fairly quickly. Cost me about $80 in o-rings and the one triple lip seal for the main shaft in the pump. I passed on #17, the complete kit.

A few observations: my pump was worn on the inside opposite the pressure outlet (where the internal rotors spin). To me this makes sense, since the rotors producing the pressure are forced away from the pressure outlet. Since I have no complaints about lack of performance on hyd pressure, I left it alone. I did however find where I think my problem was coming from; the shaft where that triple seal rides was worn and had 3 distinct wear grooves about .002" deep. My new seal had about .020" of crush fit over the shaft, so I just deburred it on a lathe (taking about .002" off) and put it back together. This was the only defect I found on any of the components that could be causing a leak into my crankcase. Power steering side was fine, oil level was not dropping in that reservoir.

I do have one question: Has anyone tried spray weld or a "readi-sleeve" on the main shaft? I almost had a machine shop spray weld and then machine the main pump shaft where those grooves were, but decided not to b/c I don't think it would have held up. The shaft is obviously heat treated, especially on the end where the splines are. Spray weld is such a soft material compared to heat treated steel, I passed on a band-aid fix that would have cost me another $75. The sleeve didn't sound appealing either since the area between the sleeve and the shaft is just another leak path,..also you usually have to oversize the i.d. on your seal when you do that and i didn't want to take on the task of finding a custom triple lip seal rated for 2000+ psi.

I guess I'll see what happens. Won't know for a while if I'm still leaking oil. It was so slow for me, i'm not going to see results as soon as I turn the key.