Buying Advice What is the best generator for our needs?

[Carl_NH]

Read my prior posts where I suggested to have some water stored on hand. I suggested this stored water for flushing toilets and also distilled water for drinking. I should add that I personally have a deep well pump too. Recognize the OP has a limited budged.

Jenkins,

See my post with the PDF generator sizing the OP needs to run his 3 HP pump - its a 10KW unit and draws 14 amps on the primary leg and 17 full load (probably 32-33 starting amps). The Generac 10KW is a 42 amp running 240V with 12KW starting is sufficient to run the 3 HP pump. These new are $2000 and would also run the rest of his/her needs. Then if they wanted they could buy a second pressure tank to get a higher drawdown and only run the pump "as needed"

Regarding storage, we do srockpile water 25 gal for drinking as needed and I have used snow and collected rainwater in times past to flush toilets with the mantra if its brown flush otherwise wait..

So yes the OP can get a decent generator in the price range he/she has adn it will work.

Carl

 

[newbury]

Since this is now a general "generator" thread, with one poster even thinking the OP is male, I'll continue to comment.

Animals (people included) require Air, water, food - in that order - (and the means to get rid of them) and sometimes temperature control even in EMERGENCY situations.
Keeping at the temperature your body AND clothes REQUIRE is nice. In Virginia my interior house temperature has ranges from 80 degree F in the summer to 50 degree F in the winter, with some complaint from SWMBO. It is easily doable.
Light at night is nice, but I've bought these hand cranked flashlight/radio/usb charger combos.

I wanted to make a point about the need for water. The main thing I got the generator for is running the well. Everything else was secondary. Life is impossible without it and if you have to get it other ways than out of the faucet it takes a lot of work to handle, even if it is available. Flushing the toilets is vital. For me it would be a mistake to buy a generator that could not run the well. <snip>

I agree, but...
And if the well pump fails what do you do? If the city water fails what do you do?
In the city I keep about four 6 gallon glass carboys (left over from beer brewing decades ago) and a 5 gallon "camp style" jerry can of drinking water. This is for when the water goes out, which it has once or twice. When I lived in Vermont we had a 3 acre pond and a surface spring. Potable sterile water is primary (boiling is easy).
That's one reason I recommended the IBC totes and collecting rainwater.


That is easy storage for 500 gallons for minimal cost (/edit - mine were free). If you have acreage storage should be no problem. If you have a tractor movement of one of them (partially full) on a pallet isn't that difficult. And you fill them when you get them, not after the emergency starts.

The OP, in another thread where she is buying a tractor, will have both.

Hi all, I have 5 acres with horses..

I actually think EVERYONE with acreage and a tractor should have a few Does she need well water for her horses?

My secondary priorities are as follows:
Septic tank pump - you do not want this stuff backing up into your house
Sump pump - you need it most during and after a storm
Refrigeration - you need food and you can pay for the generator from food saved in a couple of outages.
Radio/TV - you will want to know what is going on during any crisis. These are pretty low power items, but you might consider a TV Antenna to backup cable since it will probably not work. A satellite dish can easily run on your generator.
Lights - These are lower priority than you think since long running flashlights can give pretty good light and are needed anyway for times when the generator is not running. You should be able to power some of course since lights and particularly CFLs are very low power.
Cooking - Use your microwave, electric skillet, and grill. Keep an extra propane tank always full or plenty of charcoal.
Other stuff - the longer the power is out the more stuff you will want to run. After a couple of days the hot water heater will be cold and a well water shower or bath does not work for me.

I agree with most of this - but if you don't have the first two don't worry about it.
Radio - definitely a hand crank absolute minimal.
Cooking - camp stoves.
Showers? We don't need no stinkin showers! It's an emergency, we be stinkin

We seem to loose power just prior to big events. Both daughters weddings with a house full of people. We were very glad to have the generators.

Just my opinions and some things to consider. Considering my other misleading comments on this thread, my opinion here is probably not worth much. Good luck with whatever decision you make.

So your power was not contained? Or did you lose your power

Great opinions and your comments have helped educate me about "deep well" problems, I've lived with either shallow well water (most of my life) or city water.

 

[newbury]

We all like to live in total comfort and I have four gensets of my own so feel I am well covered. But it strikes me that you need to be able to get by with less on the rare occasions that electric, gas or water is unavailable. I have been through a few hurricanes and the lack of power after a few days can be unpleasant. Dumping a gallon or two of water into the toilet tank is too much trouble you think? Then you are too soft and spoiled like so many Americans.

Being the cheap guy I am my solution would be to take it out of an IBC tote.
I've got one small house under renovation that has the water turned off. I use water from the dehumidifier to flush.

 

[Carl_NH]

Newbury,

Your post made me remember what the cab drivers in Singapore said - watch out for the He-She's.. thats another topic or should I say off topic?

Sorry to have referenced the OP Catdiva a "his" and "his/hers" in the recent post, from now on its "she" or "her's".

 

[RFB]

If the OP is buying a tractor, then a pto generator of fair capacity is a workable option: NorthStar PTO Generator 13,000 Watt, 24 HP Required | PTO Generators| Northern Tool + Equipment

Regarding showers: I am unaware of how long the outages some posters refer to; ours have been more than a week while experiencing sub-zero (F) temps. Hygiene is a critical survival issue; it is not a luxury. A significant number of diseases throughout the world can be prevented with proper hygiene. It is also a morale issue if you have a family to provide for and protect.

 

[meburdick]

OP - The best things you can do are as follows:

- Understand how much you'll need to operate the generator. Some areas are prone to power loss, some are not. The more it will be in operation, the more of a concern you will have for things like fuel efficiency and size.
- Do some online research for sizing a generator as it will help you to estimate what sorts of power consumption to expect.
- Write down the start and continuous operation needs for all of the equipment that you'll want in use while the generator is in use.

I have a very large house (2600 sq ft) and am able to run my garage door opener, most lights, well pump, oil-fired water heater, circulating fan for the wood stove, refrigerator, ceiling fans, and even some of the televisions off of a hard-wired 6250 continuous operation gasoline generator.

While I agree that there is a lot of great content in this thread and lots of points to get folks thinking, it seems that a lot of the latter posts are geared more toward an episode of "Doomsday Preppers" than in just identifying how to size a backup generator.

I've quoted a post of mine from back on Page 2 of this thread to reiterate what I said then. Figure out how often you lose power, determine how much power you need when the grid is out, then evaluate against your budget.

If your power goes out once per decade for four hours, you can be very minimalistic. If it goes out once per year for a week, that's a little different.

Power very seldom goes out in my neighborhood, and usually isn't out for long when it does. In the last twenty years, there have only been two significant outages that I am aware of (one was last Halloween). Why, then, did I spend $800 on a new generator after that storm? Because having a generator to run the house for a week was a life saver. When it essentially rattled itself apart during operation, I knew we needed another one.

I spent a little more and bought one with electric start so that my wife would never have an issue starting it if I wasn't home for some reason. The next thing to get her comfortable with is operation of the tractor to clear snow if I'm not here.

 

[meburdick]

If the OP is buying a tractor, then a pto generator of fair capacity is a workable option: NorthStar PTO Generator 13,000 Watt, 24 HP Required | PTO Generators| Northern Tool + Equipment

Regarding showers: I am unaware of how long the outages some posters refer to; ours have been more than a week while experiencing sub-zero (F) temps. Hygiene is a critical survival issue; it is not a luxury. A significant number of diseases throughout the world can be prevented with proper hygiene. It is also a morale issue if you have a family to provide for and protect.

Yes, and no. lf the loss of power means that people are dying in the streets around you (a la The Stand), you need a way to protect yourself from germs. If you get dirty shoveling snow, you aren't going to die from it.

Go to a warehouse store and buy those anti-septic wipes for around the house to keep counters and surfaces clean. Buy some baby wipes too, and you'll be able to get yourself mostly cleaned up. And you don't need water for any of it.

 

[RFB]

We will have to agree to disagree.

"If you get dirty shoveling snow, you aren't going to die from it." No, but you may fell like dying with just a mild case of a number of common illnesses. Hand-to-face/mouth is the most common vector for disease.

Think carefully about what has become a very common problem on cruise ships even with working facilities. Its called Viral gastroenteritis caused by the Norwalk or norovirus, and is usually transmitted by fecally contaminated food or water, by person-to-person contact, and by aerosolized expectoration of the virus and contamination of the surrounding environment. This is the most frequently occurring cause of viral gastroenteritis. Immunity is virtually non-existent. Where one sees this normally is in semiclosed communities, such as long-term care facilities, overnight camps, healthcare facilities, jails, dormitories, and cruise ships. It spreads rapidly by person-to-person transmission or by contaminated food. Epidemiology studies frequently trace it to food that was handled by a infected person.

Norovirus is rapidly inactivated by either sufficient heating (washing with hot water) or by chlorine-based disinfectants. Chlorine should not be used on skin because of the mild resomation effect due to the pH. Alcohol based cleaners has little effect upon it.

Now those are facts. Your mileage may vary.

 

[catdiva6]

Let me start off by saying you guys are great! I appreciate all the advice and it has given me a lot more to think about than I originally thought which was just basically a good brand name and size. I am up in the air about powering the well now due to the expense. In any case it's an 80ft well (can't remember if static water is at 35 or 50 ft), 3hp submersible pump, and the two poles are 30 amp. Some generators can't be shipped to CA due to CARB rating standards. I saw one at Sam's but it wouldn't ship. I can not ever remember having a power outage over 6 hours and if there were an outage for an extended period we are pretty conservative and could make due with very little. What would draw the most energy would be the well. I do see those totes around and those are a good option for storage. I also liked the hand pump idea in the event power was out for a prolonged period although it ate up my generator budget! So at this point I am unsure whether or not to include the well....

 

[jenkinsph]

catdiva6,
I am curious what this well is for, is this an irrigation well or something similar? I ask because if the well is only 85 ft deep and uses a 3 hp motor then it must have a very high flow rating. Most residential wells with an 85' depth could get by easily with a 1/2 to 3/4 hp submersible pump.