Pole barn reinforcement

[terry.dinerman]

Thanks again Master T. I'll be using all of that information.

How about hardie plank, would that hold up being so heavy? And since I've run my girders horizontal I'd have to do paneling vs. lap siding right?

Whats all this ".....I'd HAVE to do paneling..." stuff? The only thing you HAVE to do is die...everything else is negotiable...

Now lets talk a little engineering...

...have you tried to lift a 4x8 hardi-panel? By yourself, I mean? According to the Hadi website, a 4x8 5/16" hardi-panel weighs 2.7 lbs per square foot or roughly 86.5 pounds...steel or even plank siding would be a mere fraction of that...

I would have a by-GAWD Licensed Engineer figure that one out and put his stamp on it, as the engineering for the original USDA pole barn is designed for lightweight siding, and relies on that siding to provide the lateral and diagonal stiffening to resist the racking forces of the wind...

In addition, you need to consider the brittle nature of the cementitious material...your building is GOING to move...how are you going to prevent cracking at every edge, seam around every fastener..? Even if you frame standard stud walls in between the poles some motion is unavoidable...

That said, I HAVE done both vertical and horizontal wood lap siding....the horizontal job was a stunner....the customer had a mobile sawyer set up his bandsaw mill and custom cut cedar siding from trees he cut to clear the property...fantastic grain and they left a wavy bottom edge too....beautiful stuff....

...we framed a standard stick frame between the poles...2x6 studs to allow a smooth inner and outer wall and used let-in diagonal bracing to restore the stiffness lost to the vertical structural members...(as specified by the architect and HIS engineer)...it was a steel strap product from "Simpson Strong Tie" that you simply tap into a saw kerf and then nailed in place, instead of using 2x lumber. The walls were quite rigid....

In your case, it would be a small thing to pull the horizontal girts and use the salvaged lumber in such a fashion....leave the skirtboards in as your concrete form of course....and you could have the finished walls any old way you like...

Ill bet if you put some beer on ice and a pig on the pit on Saturday morning, you and 3 or 4 friends would have all those girts down, cleaned of nails and stacked up before it was time for some pickin...

...or how about a goat on the spit...?

Whatever you do...

Be Careful Out There...

T

 

[jimmysisson]

In our clay souls white oak won't last. Another preservation idea: drill 2-3 1/4" dia holes down Ito the oak just above the final soil or slab height. Keep a squirt oil can with diesel or crankcase drainings handy. Every time you think of it, give each hole a squirt. Posts generally rot only in the top 10-12", and the oil will kill those organisms without migrating into the soil.
Agree with the suggestion to let in wood or steel diagonal bracing everywhere you can. I don't think it's wise to count on the siding to brace the walls. Likewise the trusses unless you're using plywood for the roof sheathing.
Around here (western Mass.) we often use shiplap pine boards vertical in 1x10 or so wide for pole buildings. I would not use in a house as they seep a tad of rainwater some places, but are plenty good for a pole barn. Plus the inside looks good without an added layer. Nail right over your horizontal girts with HD or SS nails.
You WILL wonder why you didn't build it sooner. Especially if you can swing a slab inside. But that's another thread!
Jim

 

[scrimshaw33]

Gotcha. Hardie's probably too heavy. I have used it and have access to a scissor lift which has made things very easy when my friend and I have used it, but likely it will be too heavy. With regards to rough sawn pine or shiplap pine as well, I know pine is a soft wood...with paint or stain it will hold up find without rotting?

 

[terry.dinerman]

Gotcha. Hardie's probably too heavy. I have used it and have access to a scissor lift which has made things very easy when my friend and I have used it, but likely it will be too heavy. With regards to rough sawn pine or shiplap pine as well, I know pine is a soft wood...with paint or stain it will hold up find without rotting?

Pine, especially Southern Yellow Pine, has been used for-EVER for siding...a classic ship-lap pine siding, known as "116 Car Siding" is named that because it was used to side rail cars...

A good coat of paint or stain and you should have a beautiful and durable finished wall...

Go with it...

T

View attachment VintagePinePatterns.pdf

 

[teejk]

Ever consider steel in both sides? I used bright white on my shop interior ceilings and walls. They cut to order so it goes up fast and I love the light it throws off with T8 bulbs. Downside is you are probably stuck with external EMT wiring (personal preference as to whether you like the look or not).

 

[longshot47]

Since we're talking about wood siding, and there is obviously some considerable experience at the table, allow me to raise the question of how best to nail/secure the battens over the joints in typical, square edge wood [spruce/pine] siding.
Most every technique I've seen used seems to result in some form of problem.

 

[terry.dinerman]

Since we're talking about wood siding, and there is obviously some considerable experience at the table, allow me to raise the question of how best to nail/secure the battens over the joints in typical, square edge wood [spruce/pine] siding.
Most every technique I've seen used seems to result in some form of problem.

Pre-drill your holes a bit larger than the shaft of your deck screw. Run the screw down to just snug the batten in place on top of the adjoining boards....this will allow considerable movement from building racking or swelling / shrinking of the boards and help prevent spliting of the battens.

You might have to increase the number of fasteners to help keep the batten from "smiling" at you....

Be Careful Out There!

T

 

[longshot47]

Just to be sure.....I take it you suggest screwing the batten thru it's center, in thru the joint between the adjoining siding boars, and into the frame member?
Thanks

 

[Dr Dave]

I think, I would stay with a polebarn truss,for that span. It looks great sofar.

Dave

 

[Runner]

In our clay souls white oak won't last. Another preservation idea: drill 2-3 1/4" dia holes down Ito the oak just above the final soil or slab height. Keep a squirt oil can with diesel or crankcase drainings handy. Every time you think of it, give each hole a squirt. Posts generally rot only in the top 10-12", and the oil will kill those organisms without migrating into the soil.
Jim

This sounds like a good idea, but I've never heard it mentioned on here before. Has anyone else done this and then later checked to see how much the oil/diesel was able to permeate the wood? Seems a lot more effective and environmentally-friendly than applying the stuff to the outside of the post and then letting it run down the sides.

I don't see why it wouldn't also work with the borate treatment mentioned earlier.