Ford says no to Diesel F-150

[94BULLITT]

I just did a trip to Cincy last week in my father's Super Crew Eco Boost 4x4 and 3.73 gears. Me, wife, father, 2 kids, and the bed full of baby items to give to a friend.

Left Muncie on 35 to Richmond, your neck of the woods, to I70 then down through Eaton to Fairfield right by Bass Pro and back. We did 23.7 mpg.

His truck, a 2011 has averaged 18.2 mpg since new with some light towing. Its rated at 16/21 window sticker but Motor Trend is getting what he does in their tester on the long term report.

2012 Ford F-150 Lariat 4x4 EcoBoost Long-Term Update 1 - Motor Trend

Chris

I can 19.2 MPG with a 5.0 Screw 4x4 and 3.73's. I could do better but the hills here hurt it. I think it may do 21 on the interstate.

That motor trend test was BS. Everyone I know with a Ecoboost is 18MPG.

I'm sure they can get that.

Most people do not, however. The fleet average on fueleconomy.gov is between 12 and 19.

In a head to head comparison done recently the GM 5.3. beat the EcoBoost in fuel economy. That was a skewed test though.

Car and Driver is really bad about that. They are pro GM.

 

[tcartwri]

I can 19.2 MPG with a 5.0 Screw 4x4 and 3.73's. I could do better but the hills here hurt it.
.

Hills have very little effect on gas mileage. For as you must go up, you must also go down. Our IH 4400 gets better mpg in the mountains than it does in the wide open flats.....

 

[tcartwri]

I just did a trip to Cincy last week in my father's Super Crew Eco Boost 4x4 and 3.73 gears. Me, wife, father, 2 kids, and the bed full of baby items to give to a friend.

Left Muncie on 35 to Richmond, your neck of the woods, to I70 then down through Eaton to Fairfield right by Bass Pro and back. We did 23.7 mpg.

His truck, a 2011 has averaged 18.2 mpg since new with some light towing. Its rated at 16/21 window sticker but Motor Trend is getting what he does in their tester on the long term report.

2012 Ford F-150 Lariat 4x4 EcoBoost Long-Term Update 1 - Motor Trend

Chris

That is very impressive.

 

[Peacock]

Car and Driver is really bad about that. They are pro GM.

This was pickuptrucks.com.

 

[dodge man]

Diesel in my area is pretty much even up with gas right now. I figure that will change though and they will jack up the cost soon. If Ford was getting ready to drop a smaller diesel in their half tons, the Ford lovers would be telling us how great its going to be. Everyone needs to be honest about their bias.

As far as the Ram 1500 diesel goes, time will tell.

 

[tcartwri]

2012 Ford F-150 Lariat 4x4 EcoBoost Long-Term Update 1 - Motor Trend

Chris

Actually, looking at their average fuel consumption, I would have to say the new diesel from RAM should be able to best the ford by at least 3 to 4 mpg. That is a huge reduction in operating cost. It has been my experience with my own diesels ( VW and a Duramax ), that they will easily outperform the gassers in everyday use, as compared to the numbers collected in the EPA testing cycle. It will be interesting to see.

 

[94BULLITT]

Ford is shooting for 30MPG with the 2015 F-150.

 

[tcartwri]

Ford is shooting for 30MPG with the 2015 F-150.

That's an 8 mpg improvement.... that's not going to happen.

 

[fordmantpw]

That's an 8 mpg improvement.... that's not going to happen.

7 over the 23 MPG 3.7L V6 2WD.

I would say it's not out of the question, especially with the planned weight reductions.

 

[94BULLITT]

There is supposed to be a smaller eco boost. I was trying to find the site that listed the new engines or at least what they thought.

 

[tcartwri]

7 over the 23 MPG 3.7L V6 2WD.

I would say it's not out of the question, especially with the planned weight reductions.

You have X amount of energy out of a gallon of gasoline. You need X amount of HP to push a 2.5 ton truck through the air at hwy speeds. You cannot change those variables enough to gain 7-8 mpg. Not going to happen.

 

[fordmantpw]

There is supposed to be a smaller eco boost. I was trying to find the site that listed the new engines or at least what they thought.

2.7L V6 is the new EcoBoost.

 

[Gary Fowler]

You have X amount of energy out of a gallon of gasoline. You need X amount of HP to push a 2.5 ton truck through the air at hwy speeds. You cannot change those variables enough to gain 7-8 mpg. Not going to happen.

The only way our USA vehicles will gain the required mpg is for them to go with the European and other countries models and use a smaller engine in a smaller frame. A large diesel in countries outside the USA is 2.8 L and while they do fairly well at running down the highway at 70 mph, they are pretty gutless when it comes to pulling a load or climbing a steep hill.
As mentioned for the Dodge, a 3.0 liter diesel is not going to get you much in the way of torque regardless of how it is tweaked. The only way that you can drive those engines is with a lot of RPM. BTDT and we Americans just don't go for that type of sluggishness in our big vehicles. Very few full sized cars and trucks exist outside of the USA with most being similar to the old S-10 Chevy or Ford Ranger series and those get by with the 1.8-2.8 liter engines as far as travelling down the road. I don't think they would get very far in America though as long as fuel is below $5 per gallon.

 

[Peacock]

I'll have to see 30mpg in a gas truck to believe it. The smaller EcoBoost engines don't fare so well in the real world in relation to their competition. Most of the time an Accord, Altima or Camry gets better fuel economy and have equal or better acceleration.

 

[DocDiesel]

Ford already has a light duty diesel in the works for their transit van. A 'light duty' Power Stroke

Small diesels will continue to work their way into the US market. They may be more initially, but as the sales volumes grow they will become more economical.

The new Ram diesel boasts the same payload and towing numbers as the Hemi V8 while besting the High-Fuel-Economy editions MPG rating. It's the best of both worlds, and you do pay a price for it.

Simply because 6 people who write long winded responses on a forum does not mean that there is 'no-market' for a light duty diesel. There is, and it will grow in the future just like every new introduction. The price starts high and will get lower until it goes from a high dollar option to a standard feature.

 

[Peacock]

Ford already has a light duty diesel in the works for their transit van. A 'light duty' Power Stroke

Small diesels will continue to work their way into the US market. They may be more initially, but as the sales volumes grow they will become more economical.

The new Ram diesel boasts the same payload and towing numbers as the Hemi V8 while besting the High-Fuel-Economy editions MPG rating. It's the best of both worlds, and you do pay a price for it.

Simply because 6 people who write long winded responses on a forum does not mean that there is 'no-market' for a light duty diesel. There is, and it will grow in the future just like every new introduction. The price starts high and will get lower until it goes from a high dollar option to a standard feature.

Excellent post!

 

[fordmantpw]

You have X amount of energy out of a gallon of gasoline. You need X amount of HP to push a 2.5 ton truck through the air at hwy speeds. You cannot change those variables enough to gain 7-8 mpg. Not going to happen.

Engine efficiency - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Modern gasoline engines run at 25-30% efficiency. Increase that and you increase fuel economy. To bring that back to your statement, 70-75% of the energy in a gallon of gas is being wasted to heat. 70+%!! Now, think about that and tell me there is no room for improvement!

There are also several things that can be done, each with incremental improvements:

1. More efficient trannies
2. More gears in the tranny to keep the engine in higher-efficiency range more often
3. Decrease the coefficient of drag
4. Reduce frontal surface area
5. Reduce weight
6. Reduce friction
7. Reduce losses from cooling, A/C, etc.

 

[Diamondpilot]

Diesel in my area is pretty much even up with gas right now. I figure that will change though and they will jack up the cost soon. If Ford was getting ready to drop a smaller diesel in their half tons, the Ford lovers would be telling us how great its going to be. Everyone needs to be honest about their bias.

As far as the Ram 1500 diesel goes, time will tell.

I will not have another diesel period. I have had 4 and still have one. None have been problematic but it looms over your head knowing a repair can run $10000.

The gas engines are just too good now days. Even the 6.0 in the GM's HD trucks does a good job for most.

Chris

 

[Diamondpilot]

Actually, looking at their average fuel consumption, I would have to say the new diesel from RAM should be able to best the ford by at least 3 to 4 mpg. That is a huge reduction in operating cost. It has been my experience with my own diesels ( VW and a Duramax ), that they will easily outperform the gassers in everyday use, as compared to the numbers collected in the EPA testing cycle. It will be interesting to see.

You must know some new math or something? Gas here today is $3.69 and diesel is $3.99. Say the gas truck gets 21 like Ford claims for the Eco Boost that works out to $.175 per mile. The diesel getting 25 mpg is running $16 per mile. In 100,000 miles the gas truck cost $17,571 to fuel. The diesel $16,000 to fuel, a savings of roughly $1,500. Now take in to account the $3000 up charge for the diesl which will be mor like $6,000 real world and you are looking at a 10 to 20 year payback all things being equal.

Chris

 

[Diamondpilot]

7 over the 23 MPG 3.7L V6 2WD.

I would say it's not out of the question, especially with the planned weight reductions.

Eco Boost and a 8 speed plus the 800# weight loss and some areo tricks. It will happen.

Chris