Pros/cons of tier 4?

[RickB]

Does EPA cover DEF repair cost after warranty expires? No

Of course not. But the question was related to a 2011 vehicle which was withinn the 5 year EPA mandated warranty period (excepting the vehicle's apparent accumulated mileage which wasn't mentioned). The fact the poster mentioned an $1100 repair cost on a 3-4 year old vehicle drove my question. Apart from the mileage, repairs WOULD have been covered. See linked Federal Code:

eCFR — Code of Federal Regulations

DEF (and EGR) system repairs will be covered beyond the manufacturer's warranty up to the limits of the EPA warranty.

 

[Gator6x4]

Of course not. But the question was related to a 2011 vehicle which was withinn the 5 year EPA mandated warranty period (excepting the vehicle's apparent accumulated mileage which wasn't mentioned). The fact the poster mentioned an $1100 repair cost on a 3-4 year old vehicle drove my question. Apart from the mileage, repairs WOULD have been covered. See linked Federal Code:

eCFR — Code of Federal Regulations

DEF (and EGR) system repairs will be covered beyond the manufacturer's warranty up to the limits of the EPA warranty.

I think the installation of any of the after market kits or modifications done on the new diesels voids all factory and EPA warranties. Not saying that was done in the posters case, just pointing out a lot of people do install after market kits and make tuning modifications and are shocked when they have a problem and have to pay.

 

[genesusie]

I think the installation of any of the after market kits or modifications done on the new diesels voids all factory and EPA warranties. Not saying that was done in the posters case, just pointing out a lot of people do install after market kits and make tuning modifications and are shocked when they have a problem and have to pay.

I think the thought here is to leave it alone till after the warranty is up. During the warranty the problem belongs to the dealer/manufacturer. After that period is up the owner is on their own, that's when the aftermarket comes into play.

 

[RickB]

I ran across this thread on a mainstram Ag forum that I visit. Real world commentary on DEF systems on CaseIH tractors as compared to Tier III machines.

Viewing a thread - New Case IH MX 235 or used that doesn't require DEF fluid?

 

[genesusie]

What exactly is DEF fluid and what does it cost per gallon? I read some use water.....

 

[DeereMann]

If the DPF and other tweaks raise questions, one may consider looking at Mahindra. Some have said Mahindra redesigned there engines and do not use emission "Add On's" to get in compliance.

yeah - so they ****** the snot out of the fuel injection timing to lower peak cylinder pressure & temperature. In order to retain power of the entire power stroke of the piston, they keep injecting fuel later in the combustion stroke, thereby using significantly more fuel than an SCR exhaust engine.

cool, eh? except not so much. so either you use SCR and get good mileage, or you don't use SCR & get lousy mileage. anyway, Cummins changed their minds in the Ram truck recently & added SCR.

 

[DeereMann]

What exactly is DEF fluid and what does it cost per gallon? I read some use water.....

water is not DEF. water is used in gas turbine engines to cool peak temperature to lower NOx in the exhaust, but it does not work with a selective catalytic reduction aftertreatment system such as on truck diesels. DEF is urea, which in the presence of the catalyst turns into ammonia (NH3), which in the presence of heat takes NOx and turns it into N2 & H20, which are not hazardous engine exhaust emissions.

you can now find DEF at any truck stop or farm supply store. it is not that expensive, the dosing into the engine exhaust stream is very low. but all the dosing equipment is expensive.

 

[genesusie]

The EPA limit of 5 years coverage on pollution issues is not anywhere long enough for a diesel engine. It should be more like 10 or 12 years to at least cover normal life. Again the government does not care about costs we have to endure.

 

[genesusie]

Here is a dictionary definition of urea in scientific terms.
Urea - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I'll admit DEF fluid is better sounding.

 

[DeereMann]

Marketing (spin) is everything, Gene! :laughing:

You should see the packaging of DEF - smily faces & sunny, blue skies, etc.