Geothermal HVAC

   / Geothermal HVAC #11  
Here's a schematic of my Climatemaster geothermal unit if that helps the conversation:

View attachment 357820

The tech manual does mention hot water in all seasons.

Note the HWG is part of the reversible compressor refrigerant loop.

Also note that in cooling mode, the air coil is the evaporator and the ground loop is the condenser. In heating mode, the air coil is the condenser and the ground loop is the evaporator. That was a simple observation that cast the operation into agreement with my understanding of regular AC / heat pump systems (where the exterior fan and coil replaces the ground loop of a geothermal system).

Actually if you look, the HWG is on the compressor discharge for either mode. As mentioned it is technically known as a desuperheater and cools the hot gas discharge from the compressor.

paul
 
   / Geothermal HVAC #12  
If it produces more DHW in the winter that would be a big plus in my mind... more likely to take longer/hotter showers or baths in the winter than you are in the heat of summer. When I decided to go pellet stove to get away from propane there wasn't much info about geothermal with horizontal ground loops but it is something I would have seriously considered if I had more info at the time.
 
   / Geothermal HVAC #13  
Just as a data point, here is data from the ClimateMaster Tranquility 38K BTU unit. If you look at the column "HWC", which is the hot water generator BTU output (in 1000's BTUs). You can see for every condition, the output in "Heating" always exceeds that of "Cooling"

paul
 

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   / Geothermal HVAC
  • Thread Starter
#14  
Thanks techman for a great explanation!! I am having a very well-known and reputable HVAC guy bid our job right now.
 
   / Geothermal HVAC #15  
Thanks for starting new geothermal thread.
 
   / Geothermal HVAC #16  
In the winter you heat DHW with 30°-40° EWT. In the summer, EwT is in the 80°-90° range. For my unit SUMMER cooling makes more hot water than winter heating mode. you dont read the table across at the same EWT, you need to look at the proper season temps. In the middle season it's a moot point. my unit is 2200btuh winter heating and 4000btuh summer cooling. ymmv.
 
   / Geothermal HVAC #17  
In the winter you heat DHW with 30°-40° EWT. In the summer, EwT is in the 80°-90° range. For my unit SUMMER cooling makes more hot water than winter heating mode. you dont read the table across at the same EWT, you need to look at the proper season temps. In the middle season it's a moot point. my unit is 2200btuh winter heating and 4000btuh summer cooling. ymmv.

I am surprised by your EWTs. In winter I reach 27-29 deg by the season end. Summer I never get above 60 deg. But even at 80 deg summer and 40 deg winter, the DHW generator output is close to the same number, not really favoring summer.

Do you have bore holes or a ground loop ? Ay 80-90 deg EWT in the summer is not much improvement over a conventional air-air heat pump.

paul
 
   / Geothermal HVAC #18  
Hmm - in my case I use well water pumped through the GSHP and dump back to anther well - temp stays a constant 58deg - does this relate to why I don't seem to have much difference between heating/cooling mode?
 
   / Geothermal HVAC #19  
Personally, I would want to know nothing except what can be expected to fail in the next ten years and what is that going to cost me? Is the thing and its components subject to those "Surges" that service people always speak of when they can't tell you why something failed?
 
   / Geothermal HVAC #20  
I have had a Climatemaster geothermal with horizontal ground loops since 1987. My coil failed in 2003. First and only service call. I gather many coils of that vintage in many brands failed. Personally I think another few dollars for stainless steel instead of plain steel would have been a better design. Powder coated is not much more impressive but it has last 5 years longer than the first one.

I do a coil cleaning once a year. I have to deslime my evaporator line to my condensate pump once a year because I am not smart enough to place some deslime tablets on the condensate pan.

No booster heat. The unit produces hot water most of the year. I have the electricity turned off to the hot water heater 9-10 months of the year.

One thing I like over conventional systems is the temp does not swing as much as the old school natural gas. Of course more modern energy efficient gas units are probably not at hot when running as systems from 25 years ago.
 

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