Buying Advice What tractor to buy for general utility work - <50 Acres??

[MinnesotaEric]

Why gear? You like pushing in a clutch? You like the clutch replacement time bomb?

1st, determine open station or cab: ask yourself are there more good days than bad days where you are at? Is heat, cold, dust, noise, or insects a consideration?

2nd, admit that since you are not farming, you don't need and should not want a gear tractor.

3rd, since you are looking at a 50hp model, look at Case and New Holland's 50 hp CVT tractors. Always in the right gear at the right time. Always.

4th, if you don't know of it already, check out tractorhouse.com

Look at New Holland Boomer 3050 Case's Farmalls, Kioti's outgoing DX series, and new NX series. Consider used? NH has a really cool open station retro 8N CVT.

 

[TSO]

Why gear? You like pushing in a clutch? You like the clutch replacement time bomb?

1st, determine open station or cab: ask yourself are there more good days than bad days where you are at? Is heat, cold, dust, noise, or insects a consideration?

2nd, admit that since you are not farming, you don't need and should not want a gear tractor.

3rd, since you are looking at a 50hp model, look at Case and New Holland's 50 hp CVT tractors. Always in the right gear at the right time. Always.

4th, if you don't know of it already, check out tractorhouse.com

Look at New Holland Boomer 3050 Case's Farmalls, Kioti's outgoing DX series, and new NX series. Consider used? NH has a really cool open station retro 8N CVT.

I like the idea of CVT ... in theory it seems like an awesome idea. However, it doesn't offer any PTO HP benefits is this size, and I don't think I've read anything but negative reviews on those NH CVT models. Lots of electrical gremlins and dissatisfaction with the CVT, from what I've seen anyhow. No real advantage over HST with cruise control.

 

[arrow]

Why gear? You like pushing in a clutch? You like the clutch replacement time bomb?
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The op has no comparison to go by as this is his first machine. Clutch actuation is not even thought about on a geared tractor. It gets like breathing. Secondly, there does not necessarily have to be a "clutch time bomb" of any sort. A clutch can easily last the life of the tractor. One should not make a buying decision based on "prospective break downs" as there is no such thing to guarantee mechanical viability for any mechanical device. Hydros can cause as much of a head ache as anything else or they can stay together as long as anything else.

One your other questions appear loaded and show your obvious affinity toward hydros. By telling the op what his "needs and wants" are, you are making the decision for the op already as if he is incapable of doing this himself. He needs to sit on both and discover HIS needs and wants.

 

[MinnesotaEric]

I like the idea of CVT ... in theory it seems like an awesome idea. However, it doesn't offer any PTO HP benefits is this size, and I don't think I've read anything but negative reviews on those NH CVT models. Lots of electrical gremlins and dissatisfaction with the CVT, from what I've seen anyhow. No real advantage over HST with cruise control.

Well shoot, he oughta get a Kioti NX with cruise control, then.

 

[MinnesotaEric]

The op has no comparison to go by as this is his first machine. Clutch actuation is not even thought about on a geared tractor. It gets like breathing. Secondly, there does not necessarily have to be a "clutch time bomb" of any sort. A clutch can easily last the life of the tractor. One should not make a buying decision based on "prospective break downs" as there is no such thing to guarantee mechanical viability for any mechanical device. Hydros can cause as much of a head ache as anything else or they can stay together as long as anything else.

One your other questions appear loaded and show your obvious affinity toward hydros. By telling the op what his "needs and wants" are, you are making the decision for the op already as if he is incapable of doing this himself. He needs to sit on both and discover HIS needs and wants.

No, I'm a former auto mechanic and I hate clutches in everything except motorcycles. If the clutch doesn't wear out, the slave cylinder pops a leak and screws up the clutch friction disk, the pilot bushing fries out, the throwout bearing starts to howl and then seizes, the diaphragm spring grows too weak to hold. In all aspects clutches are time bomb for cracking the driveline in half.

If I have an affinity, it is toward automatic transmissions, that's why I suggested a CVT. But more so because there is a trend in the industry toward CVT transmissions because they return better economy for their end user.

 

[arrow]

No, I'm a former auto mechanic and I hate clutches in everything except motorcycles. If the clutch doesn't wear out, the slave cylinder pops a leak and screws up the clutch friction disk, the pilot bushing fries out, the throwout bearing starts to howl and then seizes, the diaphragm spring grows too weak to hold. In all aspects clutches are time bomb for cracking the driveline in half.

If I have an affinity, it is toward automatic transmissions, that's why I suggested a CVT. But more so because there is a trend in the industry toward CVT transmissions because they return better economy for their end user.

An auto clutch and tractor clutch may have different propensities acting upon them and may not correlate as a result. I built funny car engines in the early 60's before forced induction took hold, clutches in these cars would not last the 28 years as my last geared tractor's clutch had.

 

[Texasmark]

On clutches:

1. I have a 1963 Ford 4 cyl 2000 4 sp, tranny drive PTO with 3600+ original hours, all in original condition but the generator, tires, and recently replaced fan belt and water pump. Clutching is a no brainer on the orig disc and TO bearing.

2. The 3000D is a '65 with 5000+ hours, I overhauled the engine about 10 yrs ago, orig clutch with 2 stage Live PTO; pedal pressure is nice but with a double clutch, it operates full stroke when you want to use it.

2. I had a MF 35, Live PTO, with the Perkins diesel which I dearly loved but the clutch was more than my left leg could take.

3. My Branson has a nice comfortable pedal and is no challenge for my left leg. I have a 24 sp geared tranny (3-4 hi-lo) and a shuttle shifter between F and R requiring clutching but that's a no brainer.

I have about 5 riding lawnmowers now in conventional and ZT configurations. All are hdrostats and only need the "clutch" pedal to disengage the engine drive belt for starting (safety). No problems with hydrostats for me.

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The Fords are easy on and off, easy to manuever and plenty of room for the operator. Controls are handy. Neither are power steering, nor was the Massey and that is/was a drawback. I think PS is a must and today I think it's standard equip.

Having had several tractors with FELs I feel that 4wd is a must for 2 reasons: First is adequate area of the front tires to support the loaded bucket on soft ground and second is the 4wd front end is usually much heftier and easily supports the added weight. I had a Ford I bought once that had the front axle broken by the FEL....PO did it and on soft ground the little 6.00/16s just sank. Actually there is a third reason for the 4wd and that is when you are working slopes, like cleaning out ponds, the 4wd will walk you back up the slope rather than slide into the muck.

I don't and never did have a backhoe nor needed one in 35 years of farming. The few instances where I needed a dozer or hoe I would rent one with the operator. Money well spent. However, if I had rocks in the pasture, or tree stumps in quantity then surely they are handy. Neighbor across the road had an old Ford with FEL and BH in an industrial series tractor. The thing was a dog. You had no room for anything else besides the added weight. If you are going to do any of the things I list in the next paragraph, and you can add mowing your pasture to that list, a hoe is just in the way.....but it wouldn't be if you had another tractor for it. If it is going to be a seldom used implement, then a good used rig surely would be something to consider.

I am a multi tractor guy for several reasons and connecting and disconnecting implements every time you want to do something gets to be a chore. Take haying for example: cut, tedder, rake, bale, haul off, plow, disc harrow, spike harrow, plant cover crop. Each takes a different implement. Today's tractors have greatly improved 3 point connection mechanisms and that is one of the main reasons I bought the Branson; it had the easiest, hands down. But still you get tired of having to undo and do every time you want to do something different.

Last is operator comfort. I'm over 70 and this time around I bought the cab and air ride seat. Money very well spent. I had always had open stations and sometimes I would buy the canvas canopy but weather and crop residue was always a problem and the canopies became more of a hindrance than an aid.

Good luck,
Mark

 

[joeu235]

My 4020 has 9500+ hours with the original clutch. When the time comes to overhaul the engine, the clutch will be swapped out as well.

 

[adirondackmtnman]

2nd, admit that since you are not farming, you don't need and should not want a gear tractor.

WOW!!! Going a little overboard to tell someone they shouldn't want something, I would say. I'm doing similar work to the OP with my Deere 5045D, and I specifically sought out the geared tranny for simplicity, and also economy...which was one of the OP's concerns. As far as not needing a geared tranny, that's pretty far from relevant...he doesn't 'need' either one, there are plenty of earlier compacts that had geared tranny's and also plenty of modern high-horse farm rigs with hydro's. He's simply trying to determine which best suits his budget and desired use.

To the OP; I recommend looking at the 50xx series Deere tractors, there's a lot of punch packed into a reasonably priced package, IF you decide a geared tractor suits you and your situation well. Good Luck!

Sent from my LGL35G using TractorByNet

 

[MinnesotaEric]

Dear Luddites,

Clutches are a time-bomb. Unless someone is giving you a free gear tractor, or you are awash in a nostalgic love affair with gear tractors and doing everything the harder way, the OP should be driven toward a hydro transmission for the lower maintenance costs, and ease of use. Can you imagine using a gear transmission on a zero-turn, a skid loader, or an excavator? Then why do people think a gear transmission is ideal for loader work? despite several posters examples (all given without type of use), a dry clutch on a non-hydro tractor is a $3,000 - $4,000 ticking time-bomb for maintenance. Of course how long a clutch lasts is dependent upon the operator habits more than anything, but if it's used on a loader tractor, then the owner will need to replace their clutch eventually no matter how gently the clutch is babied.