France getting rid of diesel cars.

[Tig]

I didn't trust the source, no offence to Fox News :laughing: I'm pretty sure the article is a little misleading, seems they want to get people to buy electric instead of diesel, not move to gas.

France to rank cars for pollution, wants to phase out diesel fuel | Reuters

Thanks, interesting article. Electric does make more sense for Europe. I lived in Paris for a year when I was 10. Among many other memories, I remember soot.
I'd love to have an electric car myself, but the limited range to purchase price ratio makes them impractical even as a second vehicle for us. We're just too rural for now. That ratio gets better each year, so I'm sure I'll get my electric car one day.

 

[kiotiken]

Thanks, interesting article. Electric does make more sense for Europe. I lived in Paris for a year when I was 10. Among many other memories, I remember soot.
I'd love to have an electric car myself, but the limited range to purchase price ratio makes them impractical even as a second vehicle for us. We're just too rural for now. That ratio gets better each year, so I'm sure I'll get my electric car one day.

I'm in the exact same boat. I've never kept a car as long as my current one and it's starting to cost me lots of money to keep it going, but I'm holding out for the "Economy" Tesla that may be available in 2017. I'm hoping by then, the Nissan Leaf will look normal AND have an equivalent range, the BMW i3 will grow up into a real car AND have an equivalent range and there'll be plenty of other choices as well. Unfortunately, I'm not holding my breath, Tesla seems to be the only one that gets it and I just can't see spending that kind of money on a car. Tesla Model S is one of the nicest looking cars on the road, seats 7 (kind of), goes 300 miles on a charge, recharges for free in 30 minutes and blasts 0-60 in 3.2 seconds (officially, 3.1 tested making it faster than the McLearan F1 Supercar) and is available as AWD. Hopefully, some of that makes it into a more reasonably priced version and they hit their target date.

 

[wawajake]

Kiotiken I see your near Ottawa , so you would have almost as cold a winters as me up here beside Lake Superior. Have you ever seen any research about electric car impacts in our winters with minus 20 degrees F and defrost needed for windows fulltime. ( France would not need to worry about that aspect) I have wondered about impact on battery I suspect the cold would cut those ranges down substantially here in Canada.

 

[kiotiken]

Kiotiken I see your near Ottawa , so you would have almost as cold a winters as me up here beside Lake Superior. Have you ever seen any research about electric car impacts in our winters with minus 20 degrees F and defrost needed for windows fulltime. ( France would not need to worry about that aspect) I have wondered about impact on battery I suspect the cold would cut those ranges down substantially here in Canada.

Yes I have, that's why I'm not ready to jump aboard the electric boat quite yet. There's a guy in Norway (also very cold) that blogs and makes videos of his long winter road trips and experiences owning a Model S P85 (the really fast version!). He's compared his winter range and battery fade to friends with Leaf's and claims there's very little impact on the range of his Tesla compared to the Leaf. From what I've read, the Leaf will loose about 25% of it's range in the extreme cold. Combine that with an estimated 20% drop in range with battery fade over 5 years and the 120 KM range of the Leaf doesn't work for me. I want a car that I don't think/worry about range at all, regardless of weather or extra running around I may have. I don't want to plug in at work, only at home overnight, just like my cell phone. I don't need a car to take on long road trips, we currently have a van for that and will switch to a truck in the next year.

These batteries are more efficient when cold, they actually generate a lot of heat that needs to be dealt with using a cooling system normally. Also, all electric cars that I know of allow you to preheat/cool while still plugged in, either by smart phone app or timer. If you park in a garage (I do) and can park inside at work (I can) then the extreme cold is possibly a benefit aside from the heating load that's added.

 

[tjcarguy]

In France electricity to recharge batteries and preheat interiors on cold days is abundant because they rely on nuclear.---Trevor

 

[davrow]

These batteries are more efficient when cold ... then the extreme cold is possibly a benefit aside from the heating load that's added.

Ah, but that 'heating load' that you are discounting is actually the primary contributor to loss of range. Resistance heating, normally used for windshield heating and cabin heating in EVs (very few use battery heat for the cabin) is very inefficient.

(I've been driving EVs for 12 years now)