Solar & Wind Power

[k0ua]

Social engineering always results in unintended consequences, and sometimes those consequences are a net negative for the "social good". I always vote against social engineering. I say government should play no part in social tinkering. And that includes subsidies to oil companies or solar or wind companies alike. Governments should not be agents of change. The free markets should be agents of change. Oh, and by the way "affirmative action' is wrong also. It is the same thing as racial discrimination, which is wrong too. Just so you know how I feel about government intervention.

 

[IslandTractor]

Social engineering always results in unintended consequences, and sometimes those consequences are a net negative for the "social good". I always vote against social engineering. I say government should play no part in social tinkering. And that includes subsidies to oil companies or solar or wind companies alike. Governments should not be agents of change. The free markets should be agents of change. Oh, and by the way "affirmative action' is wrong also. It is the same thing as racial discrimination, which is wrong too. Just so you know how I feel about government intervention.

I appreciate the conservative view on government intervention however it isn't consistent. I haven't heard any conservatives advocating to eliminate mortgage deductions (which benefit only some members of society) or oil company write offs which clearly only benefit stockholders. What's good for the goose is good for the gander.

 

[NorTracNY]

Gee 21 hyjacked replies and the OP doesn't have an answer. Maybe that's the answer.

 

[IslandTractor]

Gee 21 hyjacked replies and the OP doesn't have an answer. Maybe that's the answer.

Unless the OP has never participated in a thread that was closed before, the answer is always the same: boys behaving badly.

 

[2LaneCruzer]

My view is that the government should encourage private industry...and pubic utilities of what ever ilk...to develop alternative sources of energy. R&D are usually tax deductible, which is the way it should be. Government subsidies for fledgling industries that are currently not able to compete is another matter, and should be used sparingly especially in areas that don't need them in the short run. There are plenty of areas where subsidies and pilot projects would serve the purpose. Ever been to the U.S.Virgin Islands, Puerto Rico; i.e. the West Indie Islands? Electricity, water and utilities in general are very expensive; operated, for the most part on fuel oil from Venezuela. In fact, even in those beautiful areas, wind generators are beginning to sprout up, and rightfully so. I say let's keep it all in perspective.


http://www.eia.gov/state/?sid=VQ

 

[teg]

Terms of use for TBN: "...We retain, however, the right to modify or remove posted materials that we, in our sole discretion, consider infringing, offensive, abusive, defamatory, obscene, stale, or otherwise unacceptable. We also reserve the right to edit posted materials for any reason or no reason..."

 

[IslandTractor]

Terms of use for TBN: "...We retain, however, the right to modify or remove posted materials that we, in our sole discretion, consider infringing, offensive, abusive, defamatory, obscene, stale, or otherwise unacceptable. We also reserve the right to edit posted materials for any reason or no reason..."

But, to be fair, the mods always have a reason and the reason is almost always boys behaving badly. The mods rarely stop a conversation that is proceeding in a civil manner regardless of the topic.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

What you do during a brief power outage, is, I assume, different to what you would want to do 24/7/365 ?

For getting hot water, heat recovery from coolant and exhaust from said generator is considerably more efficient than using an electric water heater. The term co-generation may not be too common, but if you live in a high lattitude and high altitude location, chances are you will have both a heat and power deficit to fulfil. In addition, a pair of solar water heaters is cheaper and considerably more effective than using non-existent electricity in a grid less situation (long term) to heat water. One has alternatives to getting heat (firewood) but you might not have woods on your property, so one becomes dependent on access to a different resource which is not a good thing.

You are very right. If I was completely off-grid, I would use even less electricity than I use now. I have a neighbor who is completely off-grid, just because he didn't want to pay the power company fee for running lines ($85,000). He uses very little electricity. Heat is solar hydronic with about 70 cubic yards of concrete thermal mass. A separate system supplies his domestic hot water. It's a thermal siphon system that does not require electricity. For AC he chills the hydronic system at night and with an evaporative cooler in daytime. Domestic water is a PV 48 volt piston pump to a water tower. Domestic electricity is a PV system and 3000w inverter, which is far more capacity than he uses.

It's a luxury to design for energy efficiency from the beginning of construction. His system had big up-front costs, but he has no utility bills.

My house is 45 years old, and I had to retrofit for energy efficiency. There were no energy codes when it was built. Thanks to my own timber, I have no shortage of firewood. There is more wood falling off of trees than I need for domestic heat. 20 years of remodeling have upgraded the insulation, windows, doors, and we just ponied up for cellular blinds on the south side of the house to reinforce the low-E U.36 windows. I installed a 2500 gallon spun poly cistern to compensate for low well flow in the late summer, and put it above the level of the house. Bingo, gravity feed water. You are right about the solar hot water. 50% of the energy costs of a typical household goes to nothing but heating water. I have just been too lazy to deal with it.

I don't get much concerned about external inputs. When things get tough, externals may get expensive but they will be available. The trick is to reduce the amount you need. The advantage of conservation is that it pays even if the lights stay on.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

Here are my thoughts on the matter. I am all for green energy technology. But I am against subsides of green energy. Those of you bragging about your subsidies of your systems stole money out of the pockets of each and every one of us. Yes you stole it with full assistance and approval of the government, but that don't make it right. It should not have been offered. Yes I have thought about taking the money too. But that still don't make it right. Now the subsidies go away this year. How is that fair?

Why should solar and wind plants be paid more per kWh than other sources of electricity? Why?

Every other source of energy is subsidized. Why should solar, wind and geothermal be any different?

 

[OldMcDonald]

Terms of use for TBN: "...We retain, however, the right to modify or remove posted materials that we, in our sole discretion, consider infringing, offensive, abusive, defamatory, obscene, stale, or otherwise unacceptable. We also reserve the right to edit posted materials for any reason or no reason..."

As Island Tractor has already posted - whoever did it had a reason. Who are "we"? They (since the plural is used in the statement) did not modify, remove or edit. They merely stopped çanyone else from posting. I was particualrly peeved because the final post is that the poster has never known any coal miner that died due to his work. I have, including my own father. There were many othes, and that excludes disaster where numerous people died at once.

So, the question still remains - who did it and why?