Kyoti CK35 HST hydraulic woe's from a newby

[DK35vince]

One other thing I have had happen in really cold weather on my Kubota is the pump shaft broke in the gear pump. Aluminum gear pumps like these really hate very cold weather. The housing shrinks a lot compared to the gears and can bind the pump especially with the added pressure of very cold oil. Did you have a block heater or anything or was the tractor all -40?

Good point.
If the quick couplers and remote valve get checked out/repaired maybe check to see if you have hydraulic flow and pressure.

 

[TJP89]

Hate to say it, but the implement pump may be kaput. -40 outside is not good, even if that's Celsius. If the HST and the steering work, and no messed up remotes, it is likely the pump.

 

[Pete28]

That thought crossed my mind as well. I'll be able to check it tomorrow and will report my findings in the next few days.... if I figure it out that is.

 

[Gittyup]

Hate to say it, but the implement pump may be kaput. -40 outside is not good, even if that's Celsius. If the HST and the steering work, and no messed up remotes, it is likely the pump.

I would expect to lose power steering too if it were the pump. Doesn't sound good. Pump is like $1300 U.S. I'd at least try a $50 filter first. Does the tractor seem like it loses power when you try to operate the loader or backhoe or when wheels turned against the stops? If pump is "functioning" and dead headed, it should lose power when further loaded. If it's not, sounds like broken pump.

And BTW not all backhoes are the same. Mine can be connected backward. Then the controls are just backward but otherwise it all works. Mine must not have a check valve.

 

[jimmyj]

This has to be associated with stuck hydraulics somewhere.

Re the remote detent, mine was VERY stiff to change position for the first couple of years, but it would change position and I had been told that I should not leave it stuck in the "active" position when I'm not using the Hoe.

Since the whine goes away when you depress the clutch it has to be a deadheading issue. For example, if I reversed the hoses for the backhoe I would get the same noise, and heat, and the hoe would not work.

But since your loader and hoe both aren't working it worries that it's more than just the remote detent.

Does the whine go away if you unhook the hoses for both the FEL and the BH, or either or?

 

[TJP89]

I would expect to lose power steering too if it were the pump. Doesn't sound good. Pump is like $1300 U.S. I'd at least try a $50 filter first. Does the tractor seem like it loses power when you try to operate the loader or backhoe or when wheels turned against the stops? If pump is "functioning" and dead headed, it should lose power when further loaded. If it's not, sounds like broken pump.

And BTW not all backhoes are the same. Mine can be connected backward. Then the controls are just backward but otherwise it all works. Mine must not have a check valve.

Two pumps, at least on HST. One for steering, one for everything else. HST is separate from both I believe. Thus if the Steering doesn't work, it is likely NOT the pump, unless both have failed. The usual remote issue seems to not be the issue, and the tractor sat outside in -40C which is still way colder than is good.

However, it is more likely that the cold jammed something and it is causing the problem. It may be the remote, or internal, which is almost as bad as the pump, because very likely you'll have to tear the rear end apart to one degree or another. I would drop the BH, get the remote working, and see where you are. Also check the steering and HST performance.

Also, keeping the tractor outside in those temps is not good for it. They are just not designed to be exposed to that cold a temp. You should probably look into storing it under some kind of shelter.

 

[Gittyup]

Two pumps, at least on HST. One for steering, one for everything else. HST is separate from both I believe. Thus if the Steering doesn't work, it is likely NOT the pump, unless both have failed. The usual remote issue seems to not be the issue, and the tractor sat outside in -40C which is still way colder than is good.

However, it is more likely that the cold jammed something and it is causing the problem. It may be the remote, or internal, which is almost as bad as the pump, because very likely you'll have to tear the rear end apart to one degree or another. I would drop the BH, get the remote working, and see where you are. Also check the steering and HST performance.

Also, keeping the tractor outside in those temps is not good for it. They are just not designed to be exposed to that cold a temp. You should probably look into storing it under some kind of shelter.

You are right about steering pump. It could easily still work. I forgot that it's a separate pump. Both pumps do share the same fluid, so it isn't likely to be the filter either. I would try disconnecting both the loader and the hoe and see if the whine is still there. If it is, it's not in the implements. Then I would manually open all port connectors by depressing the balls/valve seals to make sure they aren't stuck. Then I'd try a loopback on each port pair, one at a time and see what that does. If none of these alleviates the whine, it's in tractor circuit somewhere: not good. Be careful if you crack open live circuits. The fluid pressure is very high and can cut and kill.

 

[IndyIan]

Also, keeping the tractor outside in those temps is not good for it. They are just not designed to be exposed to that cold a temp. You should probably look into storing it under some kind of shelter.

There's nothing wrong with the tractor sitting in -40C, but trying to start it in -40C is another thing altogether... Personally my cut off is like -15C as the hyd fluid takes forever to warm up. It rarely ever snows at -20 here I find anyways so I wait until the temps come up a bit.
I'd assume that the factory fill hyd fluid from Kioti may not even pour at -40.
Pete,
If you find you can't find the problem, I'd recommend my dealer, Doug's Small Engines near Castleton. Doug is a mechanic himself and they've been to NC for training a couple times since I got my tractor there.

 

[k0ua]

By the way, -40 Fahrenheit and -40 Celsius are the exact same temperature. And both are too darn cold to be running your tractor without some kind of pre heating of the fluids.

 

[TJP89]

By the way, -40 Fahrenheit and -40 Celsius are the exact same temperature. And both are too darn cold to be running your tractor without some kind of pre heating of the fluids.

That's interesting, the OP picked one of two spots where the scale doesn't matter. As you said, -40 is way too cold to run a tractor without a lengthy warm up sequence, if things aren't frozen at that temp, they're pretty close. It doesn't sound like the OP went through that much of a warm up, probably what led to the issue.

All beside the point, but he should keep it in mind. Gittyup pretty much nailed the next steps to be taken.