electric in my barn.....need help

[buickanddeere]

Doesn't make what right? As I stated, I hired a licensed electrician who has been licensed for over 40 years. I am happy with the work done and my area does not require me to pay more money for someone to tell me it is ok to do something on my property............

There is no gaurentee the installation is up to code and safe . Many people fall into the trap of thinking "if it works, it's right ".
Why so much desire to be a rebel?

 

[countrybumpkin]

There is no gaurentee the installation is up to code and safe . Many people fall into the trap of thinking "if it works, it's right ". Why so much desire to be a rebel?

We just choose to live in a area with a little more freedom. As far as code goes, just because it's "Code" today doesn't mean it will be tomorrow.

 

[CADplans]

We just choose to live in a area with a little more freedom. As far as code goes, just because it's "Code" today doesn't mean it will be tomorrow.

My nephew was the town manager for a small town in NC,,, part of his duties was,,, of course,,, electrical inspections.
He had ZERO training in anything electrical,, but, he did the inspections.
He would call me when he was stumped,,, I know little more than him,, but, he had no one to help him.

I ran into that when I started a business,,, I rented a building.
Each time a commercial business started a lease, the town charged for an electrical inspection.
The guy basically walked around, and looked to make sure no 110 volt covers were missing.

Having an inspection can be more dangerous than having the electrical done correctly.

 

[CobyRupert]

I always wondered how a municipality can assume responsibility ("We require inspections!! (for your safety). This is safe, this isn't!")
.. but not be on the hook for liability.
(Ah yeah, we said it was okay, but your house burnt down.....sorry :confused3: )

This happened in my county were the county requires woodstove installation inspections. A week after inspection the house/country store burns because of an improper installation. Why isn't the county liable? What did you pay them for? They can't have it both ways. I'm pretty sure they didn't refund the inspection fee.

 

[buickanddeere]

No need to inspect anything then. No need for quality control at factories. Motor vehicle , marine and aviation manufactures can be trusted , no testing or rules required . No rules or regulations for medical staff qualifications or the equipment and medications used .
Where do you draw the line ? Where you can save a few bucks at home or at your dentist's office who is just as qualified and adheres just be same to the rules ?

 

[CobyRupert]

So should you pay the incompetent city inspector just because it's required, but also hire a 2nd competent inspector to......inspect that it's a safe installation?

 

[ultrarunner]

No need to inspect anything then. No need for quality control at factories. Motor vehicle , marine and aviation manufactures can be trusted , no testing or rules required . No rules or regulations for medical staff qualifications or the equipment and medications used .
Where do you draw the line ? Where you can save a few bucks at home or at your dentist's office who is just as qualified and adheres just be same to the rules ?

It is not an all or nothing proposition.

If we desire a higher level of competency we provide owner oversight with an inspector we hire... it is something we do all the time with medical construction... i.e. I never leave it to the authority of jurisdiction.

As for medical professional there are independent government recognized entities that require a higher standard be met...

Maybe the problem is people are just too complacent and simply believe a government stamp of approval is good enough.

Building codes only require a minimum...

Permits at one time were quite reasonable... not so anymore.

After natural disasters the city and county ceded inspection to others... and also liability... mostly certified engineers.

Part of the problem with inspections is many contractors will use a signed off inspection as prima-fascia evidence the job is complete... often it is not.

I'm going through a minor issue right now with an inspector... this building is located in a high crime area and metal theft and vandalism is daily life.

Inspector wants large signage outdoors to identify utility shutoffs... building is 21 years old and never an issue prior... inspector said emergency responders need to know locations...

Funny part is California implemented CERS on a statewide level.. .all of this information is available to field units... diagrams, special instructions, floor plans, emergency contact info... etc..

Inspector was not aware of any of this... often one agency is clueless to the actions of another.

It all gets to be a bit much at times... as having to redesign for ADA, implement costly changes only to have Fire require all changes undone...

As an engineer... I could be self serving... each change of added requirement is money in my pocket... but this is not how I think.

 

[DieselBound]

I'd state that, IMO, one of the main reasons for "inspections" is to appease insurance companies. In the end (if you're alive to collect) it's about paying off. If the inspector didn't do things right and the insurance company discovered so then you can be sure that the insurance company is going to go after the inspecting agent. As lay people we're not required to know whether a "legal" inspector is proficient or not: this would then go back to the trade's licensing arm.

I'm shelling out money for "licensed" people to do work for/on my new garage/shop. The folks I'm dealing with are sticklers, and for that I am glad because it will tend to promote a better end product: even went over things with the county inspector for the foundation (he wanted me to make sure that the builder did a couple of things correctly). I had one fellow give me a bid on doing something and I later figured out that he'd have used the wrong materials to do the job: I found this out after deciding to do the particular job myself, with my builder (who is a stickler) guiding me (he didn't like the materials that the one guy was suggesting to use and so he, the builder, told me to use other materials, which I did). I'm actually looking forward to working with my electrician (again): he provided me with key info on grounding that was necessary to get in place for my foundation pour; the electrician probably won't be on-site for several weeks yet.

 

[ultrarunner]

In 2002 I did the residential wire for my brother's new home... next door a new home was also being built at the same time.

The inspector had plenty of things to say about the electrician at the neighbors... one correction notice after another.

The panel box looked like a rat's nest and all framing was drilled with a much too big auger... j-boxes at different heights etc... one GFCI for an run where I had none daisy chained, panel box full to capacity with no room for more circuits.

So the contractor comes over and asks how much I bid the job after looking at my work... nice enough guy and had been in the business a long time... he said it is cut throat out there and jobs go to the low bidder...

I told him nothing other than the cost of material and lunch as it is a family job.

He said he would have to double his bid if his builder wanted the same job.

As mentioned... code is only a minimum...

 

[buickanddeere]

In 2002 I did the residential wire for my brother's new home... next door a new home was also being built at the same time.

The inspector had plenty of things to say about the electrician at the neighbors... one correction notice after another.

The panel box looked like a rat's nest and all framing was drilled with a much too big auger... j-boxes at different heights etc... one GFCI for an run where I had none daisy chained, panel box full to capacity with no room for more circuits.

So the contractor comes over and asks how much I bid the job after looking at my work... nice enough guy and had been in the business a long time... he said it is cut throat out there and jobs go to the low bidder...

I told him nothing other than the cost of material and lunch as it is a family job.

He said he would have to double his bid if his builder wanted the same job.

As mentioned... code is only a minimum...

Problem is the uninspected do it your selfer typically buys and builds BELOW code.