Running generators in parallel

[jenkinsph]

Yea, we manually synced generators in my power lab course in school. A little out of phase and you can make a huge hunk of steel jump. Lol

I have the honda 2000i, nice quiet gen. I bought the companion, now need the other half.

I very well remember bringing generators on line watching a kvar meter. Had to engage manually the 2500 amp breakers when the needle was at 12 o clock, if you missed it was dang near like an explosion. Scary as **** for me as there were 3 EMD train engines with 1.5 mega watt gensets on a drilling rig. Always had the driller stop the draw works when doing this. All the new stuff automatically connects and disconnects, but this was over thirty years ago.


I have both a 2000w and 3000 w Honda inverter generators and they are very quiet units. I have considered getting a 2000w companion generator for parallel use just because of the weight difference. For a truck camper a 2000w is sufficient for the cooler season use but summer with ac requires more power. The weight advantage is easy to understand, the 2000is generator weighs 46 lbs. while the 3000is weighs 135 lbs. I can easily load two small generators into the camper without help but the heavier generator is too heavy for an old geezer like me to load. I prefer on most campsites to set the generator(s) several feet from the camper so it is quiet with out vibration.

For larger power requirements needing 230vac I use either an Onan quiet diesel or Miller Trailblazer welder. The Onan is very quiet while the Miller is loud and a gasser.

 

[buckeyefarmer]

I had a project yrs ago where we rebuilt a set of 3 EMD generators, 5 MW power plant.

 

[MossRoad]

I had a project yrs ago where we rebuilt a set of 3 EMD generators, 5 MW power plant.

A few years ago I got to tour the power plant at the University of Notre Dame. Besides their main coal and NG generators, they have two Fairbanks-Morse 1MW diesel electric generators from WWII submarine USS Haddock. They use them for peak demand and backup.

 

[Garandman]

We studied the lessons learned from Hurricane sandy and bought two Hondas, a Honda EU2000S and an EU2000S companion. We also had our house wired.

The biggest problem after Sandy was available fuel supply. Stations weren't open locally and folks didn't have enough fuel to run their conventional generators for very long. Most 5-10K generator owners did t realize they'd use up to 20 gallons per day.

We got the duo because we can run the heat circulation pump and fridge on one, to minimize fuel consumption overnight. Then we can run the two together during the day for additional wattage. We have gas heat, stove and even clothes dryer so the house should be habitable in the worst case scenario for us near the harbor in Boston: an intense full-moon Northeast storm that brings heavy snow, cold temps, high winds and high tides.

With the two EU2000's, we can run for 8-15 days without gas resupply. In addition to spare spark plugs and fuel filters we also keep plenty of motor oil. And if one goes down we could still get by.

There are probably some lower cost clones around, to my mind saving the couple hundred just wasn't worth the risk.

I guess my first question is why do you want to run in parallel? What is driving you to wanting this configuration? How much power do you need? Do you have two or more distinctly different applications like home backup and portable for camping?

I settled on the EU3000iS. It is the quietest and has longest run time of the Honda generators, it has electric start (easy for wife) and although it heavy for portable transport, it can be loaded up in your truck. Having two gens means double the maintenance.

There is an EU3000 Handi that is lighter.

 

[RNeumann]

That's one of the main advantages of propane. I have a 1000 gallons and it only runs a water heater and stove....besides the Winco/Honda gen.

 

[dragoneggs]

We studied the lessons learned from Hurricane sandy and bought two Hondas, a Honda EU2000S and an EU2000S companion. We also had our house wired.

The biggest problem after Sandy was available fuel supply. Stations weren't open locally and folks didn't have enough fuel to run their conventional generators for very long. Most 5-10K generator owners did t realize they'd use up to 20 gallons per day.

We got the duo because we can run the heat circulation pump and fridge on one, to minimize fuel consumption overnight. Then we can run the two together during the day for additional wattage. We have gas heat, stove and even clothes dryer so the house should be habitable in the worst case scenario for us near the harbor in Boston: an intense full-moon Northeast storm that brings heavy snow, cold temps, high winds and high tides.

With the two EU2000's, we can run for 8-15 days without gas resupply. In addition to spare spark plugs and fuel filters we also keep plenty of motor oil. And if one goes down we could still get by.

There are probably some lower cost clones around, to my mind saving the couple hundred just wasn't worth the risk.


There is an EU3000 Handi that is lighter.

True indeed... the 'Handi' is out now. Although lighter, it is louder and the gas tank is half the size so half the run time, and no electric start (important for my better half). Noise, run time and electric start can't be beat. I will admit, the 3000iS isn' so portable. It's a two person lift.

 

[Garandman]

We always started our EO3000iS by hand. They are amazingly quiet and have a largerfuel tank than the EU2000i.

But for $20 you can buy a replacement fuel cap and hook to an outboard fuel tank.

 

[IslandTractor]

I can see the rationale for two smaller generators for camping etc but as a emergency power source for a residence it seems cheaper and easier to just get one larger generator if you have someplace to store it. I picked up a barely used Honda EX5500 for cheap money. Very heavy and built like a tank but pretty easy to wheel around. It is water cooled and literally as quiet as an idling Honda sedan. I use it for a 220 volt source for welding too which wouldn't be possible with two smaller gens.

 

[dragoneggs]

We always started our EO3000iS by hand. They are amazingly quiet and have a largerfuel tank than the EU2000i.

But for $20 you can buy a replacement fuel cap and hook to an outboard fuel tank.

Yes I always started by hand... in fact my on board battery was probably dead long before I knew it. But with traveling I needed the better half to be able to 'flip a switch' and thus I put a battery tender on it. Now I can be in Asia during a power outage and feel confident that she can DIY easily by turning the key. This means a lot to me. I hate leaving her in an uncomfortable position. Call me a chauvinist... who I am.

 

[3930dave]

Yes I always started by hand... in fact my on board battery was probably dead long before I knew it. But with traveling I needed the better half to be able to 'flip a switch' and thus I put a battery tender on it. Now I can be in Asia during a power outage and feel confident that she can DIY easily by turning the key. This means a lot to me. I hate leaving her in an uncomfortable position. Call me a chauvinist... who I am.

It's a Nice option To Have.

If the generator and you (meaning physically) are tuned up, then pull starting is often not a big deal. Add in unfamiliar with engines, or something like throwing out your back or damaging your dominant hand in an emergency, and what's normally easy suddenly may become tougher to Pull off.....

Just bandaged up the hand last night of a good friend's 18 yo son, down at their shop.... he'd cut his right hand on glass doing reno work. Normally, that young lad could probably bench-press a generator for an hour and not get tired, but pulling a cord would have been "fun" with that hand last night.....

On my Estart gen, I usually go back and forth between manual and electric start, just to make sure......

Typing away at this, I'm thinking I should see how well I do at Pull Starting with my left arm (being a righty) next time....

Rgds, D.

 

[Garandman]

I can see the rationale for two smaller generators for camping etc but as a emergency power source for a residence it seems cheaper and easier to just get one larger generator if you have someplace to store it. I

It is cheaper and easier. But the experience of many coastal dwellers during Hurricane Sandy was that they ran out of fuel and couldn't get more.

When I bought them an EU2000i plus an EU2000i companion was $2,150 MSRP and the EU3000is was $2,000. Those are both really expensive compared to any 3600rpm unit. But I can run the EU3000is on as little as 4.1 gallons per 24 hour day. If I run one EU2000 for 12 hours and both for 12 hours, I use as little as 3.0 gallons and have 3200 watts instead of 2800.

We fill our motorcycle tanks along with some stored cans, and between them have enough to run at least 8 days.

Read an account of one Sandy victim who owned a BX series. He'd acquired a PTO generator and ran his house on that. Forget the exact numbers but fuel consumed was really low. If you heat your house with oil you could run a looooong time!

 

[MossRoad]

It is cheaper and easier. But the experience of many coastal dwellers during Hurricane Sandy was that they ran out of fuel and couldn't get more.

When I bought them an EU2000i plus an EU2000i companion was $2,150 MSRP and the EU3000is was $2,000. Those are both really expensive compared to any 3600rpm unit. But I can run the EU3000is on as little as 4.1 gallons per 24 hour day. If I run one EU2000 for 12 hours and both for 12 hours, I use as little as 3.0 gallons and have 3200 watts instead of 2800.

We fill our motorcycle tanks along with some stored cans, and between them have enough to run at least 8 days.

Read an account of one Sandy victim who owned a BX series. He'd acquired a PTO generator and ran his house on that. Forget the exact numbers but fuel consumed was really low. If you heat your house with oil you could run a looooong time!

I see your points.... we have an older 4200W 3600PRM generator. It runs at 3600RPMS ALWAYS! Uses fuel like mad. So we run it for just an hour or so a couple times per day to keep the food from spoiling in outages and that's it. It was around $400, though. That leaves me $1600 for fuel. But, as you said, in major outages, fuel can be scarce. Does no good if you can't get it.

 

[Sawyer Rob]

I can buy a Honda 2000 for $999.00 any day of the week, I've seen them as low as $850.00. The companion model is $1,099.00.

SR

 

[bdog]

I still don't see the advantages of parallelng

You buy a small generator and ocassionally need more power. Instead of having to buy a large unit buy another small one and you are good to go. Big generators are heavy. I have a honda 6500 inverter (the predecessor to the 7000) and while I have put it in a pickup bed with two people it really takes 3. I also used to own the 3000 inverter. One person could load it but it hurt you really needed two. Those little 2000's my kids could carry around. Parallel two of them and you have more power than the 3000 in a lightweight easy to move size.

 

[dragoneggs]

You buy a small generator and ocassionally need more power. Instead of having to buy a large unit buy another small one and you are good to go. Big generators are heavy. I have a honda 6500 inverter (the predecessor to the 7000) and while I have put it in a pickup bed with two people it really takes 3. I also used to own the 3000 inverter. One person could load it but it hurt you really needed two. Those little 2000's my kids could carry around. Parallel two of them and you have more power than the 3000 in a lightweight easy to move size.

As a proud and loving owner of a 3000iS... I understand where you are coming from. All depends on your application/usage.

 

[Garandman]

I see your points.... we have an older 4200W 3600PRM generator. It runs at 3600RPMS ALWAYS! Uses fuel like mad. So we run it for just an hour or so a couple times per day to keep the food from spoiling in outages and that's it. It was around $400, though. That leaves me $1600 for fuel. But, as you said, in major outages, fuel can be scarce. Does no good if you can't get it.

The worst-case scenario here in Boston is a Northeaster with full moon. Large accumulations of heavy snow, high winds, and coastal flooding.

So we are most concerned with heating the house. We have natural gas, which is "off grid." If we lost that, it's pretty much over.

One thing we do from sailing. If we expect a bad storm, we freeze two or three milk jugs of water. If we loose power we put daily access items in a cooler, and keep those ice jugs in the fridge.

 

[IslandTractor]

The worst-case scenario here in Boston is a Northeaster with full moon. Large accumulations of heavy snow, high winds, and coastal flooding.

So we are most concerned with heating the house. We have natural gas, which is "off grid." If we lost that, it's pretty much over.

One thing we do from sailing. If we expect a bad storm, we freeze two or three milk jugs of water. If we loose power we put daily access items in a cooler, and keep those ice jugs in the fridge.

As most of our bad storms in NE occur in the winter (hurricanes excepted), refrigeration is really not that big a deal. The average refrigerator is about 38-40 so just sticking food in a cooler and leaving it outside works fine. Freezer is a different story except mid winters but even there leaving the door shut will keep things frozen for a day or two.

Also, while I know backup power is a big thing these days, areas like Boston and suburbs are rarely without power for more than 8-12 hours. Coastal beach front communities are a bit different. The power companies focus on urban areas first and there are also fewer trees to knock down power lines than in rural areas. I do have a wheeled 5500w generator that can handle our freezers and lighting if necessary but other than testing it every few months I've never needed it in 15 years living in a Boston suburb. I recall power has gone out a couple of times but never for more than a few hours.

 

[newbury]

<snip>
Also, while I know backup power is a big thing these days, areas like Boston and suburbs are rarely without power for more than 8-12 hours. Coastal beach front communities are a bit different. The power companies focus on urban areas first and there are also fewer trees to knock down power lines than in rural areas. I do have a wheeled 5500w generator that can handle our freezers and lighting if necessary but other than testing it every few months I've never needed it in 15 years living in a Boston suburb. I recall power has gone out a couple of times but never for more than a few hours.

But the infrastructure is crumbling in many areas, perhaps due to lack of maintenance and also due to people moving to more rural areas. When Hurricane Isabel hit Virginia in 2003 many sections of Northern Virginia within 2 miles of the Beltway were without power for days. And my boss who had just moved to Lorton, Va (only 20 miles from DC) was without power for two weeks.

He and I both invested in generators then. He bought a whole house 15KW for about $15K (including installation and rewiring, maintenance contracts, etc), I bought a $600 8.5KW Honda powered from Lowes. Since 2003 he's had to run his (other than maintenance) for several days, I've had to run mine for a couple of hours.

But there are many areas around the DC area that suffer outages for many hours due to storm damage from ancient trees.

 

[IslandTractor]

But the infrastructure is crumbling in many areas, perhaps due to lack of maintenance and also due to people moving to more rural areas. When Hurricane Isabel hit Virginia in 2003 many sections of Northern Virginia within 2 miles of the Beltway were without power for days. And my boss who had just moved to Lorton, Va (only 20 miles from DC) was without power for two weeks.

He and I both invested in generators then. He bought a whole house 15KW for about $15K (including installation and rewiring, maintenance contracts, etc), I bought a $600 8.5KW Honda powered from Lowes. Since 2003 he's had to run his (other than maintenance) for several days, I've had to run mine for a couple of hours.

But there are many areas around the DC area that suffer outages for many hours due to storm damage from ancient trees.

The further you are from a major metropolitan area the more likely you'll experience days rather than hours of power outage. The focus on urban areas first is certainly reasonable use of limited repair resources IMO. If I lived more than 20 miles from a major city I'd probably think differently about the need for a back up generator.

 

[zzvyb6]

Here in southeastern Michigan a month ago or so, very high winds caused about the largest outage ever for DTE covering 1/4 of the state or so. Rural areas were first to come back on. Most city areas (Ann Arbor, Detroit, Dearborn, Inkster, Redford took 1 - 2 WEEKS to get lights back on. It all depends on how much the local lines and poles were damaged. In my area, we allowed trees to be trimmed near wires and poles. We neer lost power. In the Tree Hugger areas, power was out for the longest times.