Copper L pipe going bad after 20 years?

[GLyford]

My house was built in the mid 80's, and had all type m (yes, I know that is no longer allowed for other than hydronic loops now). Our water is hard and slightly acidic (left a green stain on fixtures). Starting about 5 years ago, I'd get one or two pinholes a year usually in the fall (extra acid from leaves, maybe?). When we redid the kitchen, all the piping areas were exposed so we had it all replaced with PEX. Our water heater (really a heat exchanger on the boiler) died after about 5 years, the replacement was the same except used stainless internal pipe and has not had a problem since.

So I think you may be dealing with a double whammy...normal aging of copper, sped up by both water conditions and heat? To me 20 years sounds like a good run, and you are getting good advice from your plumber. I don't know that there are any better options, or if the same thing for another 20 years is "good enough" for the task...? I know the jump from M to L is pretty significant...if the jump from L to K is the same, it may last you the remaining life of the building, if the budget allows?

 

[FTG-05]

When we went to sell our house in North AL in 2013, we discovered a leak in one of the copper pipes going into our main bathroom hot water heater. I did the repair on the leak, but had to have a couple carpenters do the repair on the floor rot.

It was all copper pipe installed the summer of 1994. One year less than 20 years.

 

[ultrarunner]

Lots of good information here...

The decision to replace will have to come from corporate from afar...

Meanwhile the repairs are left to me.

Going in all of the future Servicing Features were Value Engineered Out... it is an obstacle course above the interstitial spaces just to get anywhere compounded by numerous fire rated assemblies, ducting, reheat coils, alarm, telemetry, data, etc... plus the pass through solid concrete walls separating the new are from the existing...

I did raise my voice for keeping the planking the modest catwalk, light circuit and a second access point there were in the approved plans...

Out of everyone involved with the planning/construction back in 93-94 I am the only one left.

 

[bcp]

Better change those pipes before everyone gets pregnant.

===================

Sixteen nurses get pregnant at Arizona hospital ICU.

At a news conference, the women joked that there must be something in the water, ...

Sixteen nurses get pregnant at Arizona hospital ICU - BBC News

===================


Bruce

 

[ultrarunner]

I could see how that could wipe out a department!

Right now we are going through a lot of weddings... I think 5 so far in the OR department.

 

[plowhog]

My property in CA has old copper piping. Very old-- some documented at 45 years, others even older. We started noticing blue stains in the sinks and tub, so I had the water tested. The water testing company found the pH was not acceptable and told me that pH is known to cause pinholes in copper pipe. I installed a water conditioning system that titrates a chemical to correct it. The blue stains disappeared and I have had no leaks since.

 

[JimRB]

I was getting green stains from my well water. I installed a calcite filter that bumps up the PH. Never had a clue that low PH would eat away at copper.

At work we did not and neither did the building owner do a good job of checking the water in the chilled water system.

 

[ultrarunner]

My property in CA has old copper piping. Very old-- some documented at 45 years, others even older. We started noticing blue stains in the sinks and tub, so I had the water tested. The water testing company found the pH was not acceptable and told me that pH is known to cause pinholes in copper pipe. I installed a water conditioning system that titrates a chemical to correct it. The blue stains disappeared and I have had no leaks since.

I think you guys are on to something...

The last couple of weeks I noticed for the first time some green staining... never had that happen.

Water here is generally very good but sources vary in the summer/late summer.

But, the same water is used for domestic and no issues...

Could very well be the high temp of steam accelerates or intensifies problems.

I have adjusted the chem treat for the boiler supple.

Odd that so far the leaks have all been the farthest distance from the boilers... and all on the same steam loop.

Thank you to the TBN Brain Trust.

The section I cut out Friday night was indeed a pin hole... had an awl in my tool pouch and gave it a poke and it opened up to about a 3/32

Rest of the pipe seems solid... so, so far... just isolated pin holes in the pipe runs.

 

[Tractor Seabee]

With all the make up water for the sterilizers you are bringing in a lot of dissolved air which rapidly decreases the PH of the Water/Steam. Water in condensate sump ahead the boiler feed pumps may test OK; but, steam releases the air so the steam side could be PH negative. Do your boilers have de-areaters or is the feed water DAed before the pumps? My first step, if in your shoes, would be to have a complete water analysis (while operating) and evaluation done along with an expert boiler/piping forensic team that is also Board Certified. You may need to feed a PH neutralizer solution into the steam drum/discharge. Many years ago, now, this stuff was part of my profession. I closed my consulting business 3 years ago.

Ron

 

[ultrarunner]

I'm always a day late and a dollar short.

We did reduce treatment as Central Processing was complaining of spots on the instruments...

I fought it for a long time but was told to make the spots go away... cutting the treatment chemical and increasing blow downs did just that and started in January of this year... very possible the problem now is a result... with 3 of the 4 copper pipe pinhole leaks happening this year.

I have restored the treatment level and just waiting for the fallout should spotting occur... maybe the make a Calgon for boilers like dishwashers???

The pipes always looked a dull orange brown inside... now the pipe removed was very dark inside.

Can't thank you enough... really!