wagne223
Platinum Member
Yes.
Also remember that the suspension is only one factor. The tires are usually the limiting factor.
Truck and Horse trailer questions
- Thread starter bazman82
- Start date
- Views: 9658
Also remember that the suspension is only one factor. The tires are usually the limiting factor.
I just bought a HD Ram 2500 with the Cummins turbo diesel. LOVE it. Had a deposit on an F250 and the dealer sold it to someone else when I was supposed to take delivery. Took me a while to get my deposit back. Went and negotiated a great deal on the Ram 2500. It's got the plow package, the 5th wheel prep kit, full size bed, crew cab, and...saving the best for last...auto-leveling air suspension. No other truck MFG'r offered that. It keeps the truck level under load, and actively monitors and adjusts while driving. I drive a ot of hills and curves in the Appalachian foot hills, and this truck is SOLID. I was ultimately able to negotiate almost 20% off MSRP. And get this...my old 1500 Ram Big Horn used to average 13.5 (combined) MPG. I'm getting almost 18 (combined) MPG on this Cummins.
I pull heavy tractors, horse trailers, and other equip. My *towing capacity* is rated at close to 19,000lbs.
Stay away from the Power Wagon. It's capacity is only around 10,000lbs. Different axle setup.
Test drive both trucks. I did. You won't be sorry.
I pull heavy tractors, horse trailers, and other equip. My *towing capacity* is rated at close to 19,000lbs.
Stay away from the Power Wagon. It's capacity is only around 10,000lbs. Different axle setup.
Test drive both trucks. I did. You won't be sorry.
OP
bazman82
Gold Member
Ah cool. Thanks, its good to know. Ive been reading that the rams have been decent on mileage so thats a plus. How big is the tank on yours? 20% off sounds great, I assume that was prob around 10k off the msrp then?
A 15,000 lbs trailer will put approximately 3,000 to 3,750 lbs on the tow vehicle (20-25%). Assuming you and your wife and all the things in the truck weigh less than 500 lbs, you’re looking at needing around 4,000 lbs payload, on the truck. Take the GVWR of the truck (hint: no way in **** is your 2500 truck rated at that) minus the weight if the truck, that’s your payload rating. Now, you have to see how much weight is on each axle. That, too, will be on the sticker in the driver door jamb. You can be under payload, but over in axle, etc.
For that much trailer, you need a heavy duty 3500. Dually would be better, maybe required (depends if you would be happy with a lower trim/less options model). Good news is you can skip the diesel. GM has a new 6.6L gas that would be perfect, for around 15,000 lbs. the best part about a gas engine is you also get more payload capacity.
For that much trailer, you need a heavy duty 3500. Dually would be better, maybe required (depends if you would be happy with a lower trim/less options model). Good news is you can skip the diesel. GM has a new 6.6L gas that would be perfect, for around 15,000 lbs. the best part about a gas engine is you also get more payload capacity.
Here’s the 2019 Chevrolet 3500 specs. Remember, this is going to be base weights. Options will come out of payload. Also, this is 2019, so the 6.0L is the gas engine. Next year, the weights will be slightly different.
OP
bazman82
Gold Member
https://www.gmcertified.com/PDFs/ModelLibrary/Chevrolet/Silverado HD/2015-Chevrolet-Silverado-HD.pdf
Here is the link to the specs of my truck. It is a 2015 2500HD crew cab 4x4 short bed. It has the Vortec 6.0L V8. GVWR is 20,500.
So the wife wants to wait now. She would prefer to pay off the lien we have on the truck (4.5yrs left, my fault since I used the truck as collateral to buy my tractor for a better rate). Without any negotiations, a dealership would give us 30k for our truck towards a purchase. I believe I owe like 18k or something. I almost feel we would make out better now, than 4 years from now...Plus shes still not completely convinced of the ram so then we'd be looking at those chevy 3500 duallys...$$$
Here is the link to the specs of my truck. It is a 2015 2500HD crew cab 4x4 short bed. It has the Vortec 6.0L V8. GVWR is 20,500.
So the wife wants to wait now. She would prefer to pay off the lien we have on the truck (4.5yrs left, my fault since I used the truck as collateral to buy my tractor for a better rate). Without any negotiations, a dealership would give us 30k for our truck towards a purchase. I believe I owe like 18k or something. I almost feel we would make out better now, than 4 years from now...Plus shes still not completely convinced of the ram so then we'd be looking at those chevy 3500 duallys...$$$
From the document you posted, your GVWR is 9,500-10,000, depending on factors. The GCWR, which you keep referring to as GVWR is 20,500 lbs. Huge difference. The GVWR is how much that vehicle can handle. For a truck and trailer, they will each have their own GVWR. The truck has to hold its own weight, the weight of passengers and cargo (in/on the truck), and the tongue weight of the trailer, all at or under the GVWR of the truck. The trailer must be at or below its GVWR when not attached to the tow vehicle. Some trailers list a higher GVWR to make up for transferred tongue weight, some do not.
This is important because legally, the GCWR is a made up number, from assumptions made by the manufacturer. The GVWR is a number you can be cited/ticketed/charged with a crime, for going over. If the GVWR is okay, axles and tires are the next common weight issues. In civil court, if you get sued, it will all be used against you. The Trooper won’t know or care, so long as the GVWR’s are not exceeded.
Here’s the GVWR, from the document you posted:
This is important because legally, the GCWR is a made up number, from assumptions made by the manufacturer. The GVWR is a number you can be cited/ticketed/charged with a crime, for going over. If the GVWR is okay, axles and tires are the next common weight issues. In civil court, if you get sued, it will all be used against you. The Trooper won’t know or care, so long as the GVWR’s are not exceeded.
Here’s the GVWR, from the document you posted:
Further down the document, you can see you have a GVWR of 9,500 and a posted payload of 2,950. Generally, this payload does not include options. See the door jamb for a closer number.
Even with these numbers, your truck probably weighs between 5,500 and 6,500 lbs. At 6,500, that only allows 3,000 lbs for passengers, cargo, and tongue weight. Say people and stuff in truck is 500 lbs, that leaves 2,500 lbs, for trailer tongue weight to max out GVWR of your truck. That truck can legally haul 10,000-12,500 lbs (25% tongue weight versus 20%) on a gooseneck or fifth wheel.
2500 series trucks can always pull more than they can really hold to haul.
Even with these numbers, your truck probably weighs between 5,500 and 6,500 lbs. At 6,500, that only allows 3,000 lbs for passengers, cargo, and tongue weight. Say people and stuff in truck is 500 lbs, that leaves 2,500 lbs, for trailer tongue weight to max out GVWR of your truck. That truck can legally haul 10,000-12,500 lbs (25% tongue weight versus 20%) on a gooseneck or fifth wheel.
2500 series trucks can always pull more than they can really hold to haul.
OP
bazman82
Gold Member
Thanks, that actually all just clicked. Treating the truck and trailer as separate parts and including the trailer tongue weight as part of the trucks individual capacity. I only see the weight issue being a legal issue if there was an accident of some sort if I was over weight. I know with my current set up I'm not over the limit or else something may have already broke.
JIGBUILDER
Silver Member
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2008
- Messages
- 228
The truck makers GVWR ...payload sticker is not used to determine how much load the truck can carry....or is it used in any civil court case if its exceeded causing death or injury or property damage..... or will a DOT officer use it to write a overweight ticket. However exceeding a axle or tire rating or a declared gross combined weight can result in tickets....civil lawsuits/etc
I ran commercial legally for over eleven years and 1.2 miliom mile of crash and ticket free service using mostly one ton DRW trucks.
All vehicles on the road come under states axle/tire load restrictions.
GM give's their 2500 trucks a 6200 rawr. Max rawr loads can be in the 3000-3400 lb range depending on actual scaled dry axle weights which can vary depending on trucks configuration. They all don't weigh the same.
Just stay under the trucks fawr/rawr or a registered weight. That way your legal....safe.....no tickets....no civil lawsuits.
I ran commercial legally for over eleven years and 1.2 miliom mile of crash and ticket free service using mostly one ton DRW trucks.
All vehicles on the road come under states axle/tire load restrictions.
GM give's their 2500 trucks a 6200 rawr. Max rawr loads can be in the 3000-3400 lb range depending on actual scaled dry axle weights which can vary depending on trucks configuration. They all don't weigh the same.
Just stay under the trucks fawr/rawr or a registered weight. That way your legal....safe.....no tickets....no civil lawsuits.
