Corona Virus #7

[locknut]

This is bad news. It is evidence that the FDA has bowed to political pressure from the WH to bypass their normal expedited approval process in order to make chloroquine available. Very sad day for the FDA as they will have this hanging over the agency's head for decades to come. Science, not politics, should dictate when expedited approval is given in emergency situations. The FDA head had already indicated after Trump's press conference a week or so ago that chloroquine for coronavirus had not yet met their standards for approval for off label use. There has been no additional data since then, just political pressure. The head of the FDA should resign as this is the equivalent of having the Attorney General arrest someone based solely on pressure from the WH without appropriate investigation. Very sad day.

It also means that it may be difficult now for people with legitimate need for chloroquine to get their prescriptions filled as every yahoo in town is going to pressure their primary care doc to give them a prescriptions "just in case".

The FDA was established about 110 years ago precisely because it was necessary to have some control over snake oil salesmen who where bamboozling the public with "medications" that were either useless or toxic. The FDA has over the past century done an excellent job preventing US citizens from being cheated and poisoned. The scientific process/wall the FDA established works and became a model for other countries. It is really sad to see this black mark on their otherwise proud history.

In case some of you are unaware, the whole business about chloroquine started with a weirdo French physician who treated just over 20 patients. It was not a controlled trial and the outcomes were not so different from what would be expected with no therapy. This anecdotal paper was picked up by two Americans, one a physician who specializes in cryptocurrency speculation and the other a non physician/non scientist, who put together a truly awful and exaggerated "white paper" based on the French MD's unpublished report. Neither is a scientist or has any background at all in virology or public health. They claimed to have worked with Stanford Medical School (Stanford denies this) and University of Alabama Birmingham (UAB denies this too). Here is a link to an article that provides some background (yes, I know HuffPost is not as authoritative as Brietbart or Fox for some of you but read the article for an overview and then do your own research): The Hucksters Pushing A Coronavirus ‘Cure’ With The Help Of Fox News And Elon Musk | HuffPost

So,if you get this virus,will you refuse treatment using HCQ along with an antiviral drug?

 

[shooterdon]

For some families, the 3+ week wait for economic help is going to be VERY hard. Some have been laid off for 2 weeks already and 3+ more is bad. The $1200 per person will not go far for the people that are in dire need. They need to get back to work but the virus prevents that. If they get sick it will be very bad too.

I feel badly for those who work their butts off to stay afloat and now face this. I know many others who have decent jobs and piss away every cent they make, so I have no sympathy for them. What is sad, is the impact on the children of either "class". They are innocent but will suffer too.

There will be deals on things like boats, RV's, motorcycles, snowmobiles, UTV's, tractors, etc etc. Stuff people wasted money on when they should have put away savings for a rainy day.

I am looking for a snowmobile trailer so keeping my eye peeled.

 

[ultrarunner]

I do expect a lot of wants no longer wanted...

Especially recreational boats, Antique Cars, etc.

 

[gsganzer]

Yes. Very sad story. Sounds like someone in 2009 had the right idea to prepare for the next respiratory virus pandemic but that selfish commercial interests ruined the well conceived plan. Of course today nobody at the big medical device company that kiboshed the program to build tens of thousands of affordable ventilators can "remember" why they pulled the plug. It seems the company feared that the cheap but adequate ventilator design would interfere with sales of a fancier model that the company manufactured. An example of "catch and kill" just like when a magazine or newspaper buys an article and then doesn't run it.

It's the exact same thing that drug companies do with cheaper rival drugs or their generic equivalents. They buy them out and then never let them enter the market, so they preserve their market share, price and profits. We have a medical system in this country where the capitalism model has become perverted.

 

[Steppenwolfe]

Deleted. Maybe too political.

 

[/pine]

Maine sheriff investigating claim that armed men cut down tree to force neighbor'''s quarantine - ABC News

 

[ruffdog]

I do expect a lot of wants no longer wanted...

Especially recreational boats, Antique Cars, etc.

I think so too....it is a era that is bound to change priorities. We are eagerly waiting to get the boat out though. It will allow us to pretend things are back to normal...at least for a day.

 

[IslandTractor]

Just so I'm clear on this - putting the package in a household freezer is only slightly better than leaving it on the counter - ?

Probably. Multiple freeze thaw cycles would likely disrupt the viral lipid envelope (which is why we don't do that in virology labs) but I don't know of any data specifically about the Covid-19 virus.

 

[California]

I feel badly for those who work their butts off to stay afloat and now face this. ...
There will be deals on things like boats, RV's, motorcycles, snowmobiles, UTV's, tractors, etc etc. Stuff people wasted money on when they should have put away savings for a rainy day.

So true. My smaller tractor was owned by a guy with a suburban place that is only double the size of a city lot. Just an impulse-buy toy, compared to what he had any use for.

I saw the tractor on CL for $4,500 and thought hard about it. Two days later it was $3,500. I ran over with a cash deposit.

He said he is a finish carpenter and desperately needed $3500 right now to replace the blown transmission in his work van so he can resume work, where he is holding up completion of some new homes, as well as his rent is due.

When I was a carpenter and poor I don't recall buying anything beyond essentials. Never had a crunch like that poor guy. I agree we are going to see a lot of this.

 

[IslandTractor]

So,if you get this virus,will you refuse treatment using HCQ along with an antiviral drug?

1) there is no antiviral drug for coronavirus at this point.
2) the "evidence" for chloroquine is at this point non existent. The French doctor's article is no evidence at all.
3) the combination of chloroquine and azithromycin (an antibacterial) is just a "wildass guess" at an antiviral regimen
4) I'd rather just have a beer as there is just as much valid data that drinking your favorite brew is helpful as there is for chloroquine at this point
5) I'd happily sign up for a clinical trial where I might get either the experimental drug or a placebo as I do think that we should be doing good clinical trials