Help Me Choose What to Test Drive

[dodge man]

I would consider an HST a must have. Where a gear tractor is best is putting power to the ground, like plowing a field.

 

[jeff9366]

HST is especially good for maneuvering. Infinite speed control when approaching a FEL load. Zero tractor rollback on hills when you let up on the foot throttle. With HST forward/reverse change is effected with foot rocking the right foot pedal, described as a treadle pedal. On slopes, carrying debris in a grapple, good to have left hand for the steering wheel, right hand ready to drop FEL via joystick, AT ALL TIMES.

Kubota's HST/PLUS is multiple increments of improvement over all other HST transmissions. Grand L operators extol the half-step HST shift-on-the-fly ranges available with the flick of a wand on the steering column. Great for Loader work and mowing. I like Stall Guard, which it is easy to forget as it operates in the background. I stall my tractor no more than once per month. As I age I like being able to moderate control reaction speed. I have control reaction speed slowed to 70% of default.

Much, much, much, much more to HST/PLUS. You pay a chunk for HST/PLUS and PLUS is worth it.

When operating on hillsides good to have just a little more horsepower pushing HST relative to gear.
I made this allowance offering Kubota model recommendations.

VIDEO: Kubota HST Plus Transmission Features - YouTube

 

[jeff9366]

In the Mahindra lineup I'm struggling a little to see the key differences in their 2600 series, 3600 series, and 4500 series. I did a spreadsheet as Jeff mentioned and the weight increases pretty significantly with each jump so is the primary difference just physical size or is it features as well? For example the 2645 is 44/36 hp @ 3285 lbs, the 3640 is 40/31 hp @ 4367 lbs, and the 4540 is 41/31 hp @ 5192 lbs... Gut feeling is the 2600 series might be a little on the light side for me, but the 3600 series would be in play.

Your controlling application is removing a large quantity of trees and tree debris on 15 acres of sloping ground. Focus tractor research on tractor weight, tractor width, wheel/tire ballast, Three Point Hitch counterbalance and 4-WD. Most tractors have one standard FEL, sometimes one option, so FEL lift capacity is a sub set of tractor weight (+/-).

There is a market for "old school", technologically simple tractors everywhere. In India, the highest volume market for tractor sales in the world, technologically simple is the entire market. Depends where in the USA you are shopping but in many states Mahindra and Branson compete for lowest price per pound of tractor weight. As owner/operator of a 25-year old Mahindra 3505 you will feel immediately at home on a new made-in-India Mahindra. (Smaller Mahindras are manufactured in South Korea, badged for Mahindra.)

Kubota 'Grand L' tractors are at the opposite end of the compact tractor spectrum. The Lexus of tractors.

 

[Milo]

- Mowing. Initially just the 3 acre clearing and sides of the driveway, but as I clean up the woods I want to make/maintain trails and potentially even have the woods thinned enough to mow the entire property underneath the canopy of mature trees........
- Cleaning up and maintaining woods. This will involve removing a lot (and I mean a lot) of downed trees. Many are small, many are not. I think I absolutely want a grapple attachment and the ability to lift trees that are in the 24" diameter range. Will be collecting firewood as well.

Others here are offering good advice on tractors, and I believe a grapple will get a lot of use. Do you have a UTV (side-by-side) Maddog? I have acreage that consists of a lot of woods and I find myself using my UTV in them way more than my tractor. Used it to carry my saw and Still brush cutter to put trails in. I only had to cut a few large trees because I tried to go around or between them but had to clear a lot of small stuff up to maybe 6" diameter. When I ride the trails now I carry a saw and loppers in the back to clean up whatever falls across them. UTV is handy for carrying cut firewood as well. I did use my tractor bucket (Kubota B7500 at the time) to carry material for fill in a few places and still do maybe once or twice a year to dump some stone in a wet rut or grapple something, but generally I find that a tractor with a loader and ballast box can be pretty cumbersome in the woods. Three maybe four times a year I run my ZTR over the trails with deck all the way up for keeping the weeds and grass down.

I occasionally walk through the woods to cut large vines or invasive plants such as multi flora rose. It is really none of my business but I will just ask.... why thin out the woods everywhere to mow? Wildlife appreciate and actually need all the undergrowth, small understory trees, standing dead trees, downed trees, brush piles, etc. and the rotting wood is good for making more soil. It is enough work just maintaining the trails I couldn't imagine trying to pick all the rock and tree debris in the woods and keeping it that way to mow.

Nice looking property BTW!

 

[Thomas]

Not less than 30hp and frontend loader,since your land some what flat HST transmission...most of all make sure your wife comfortable operating the tractor.

 

[airbiscuit]

A trip to the John Deere Dealer and test driving several sizes will give you an idea what feels right to you. I like eir numbering system, because it relates to frame size. My preference for your described needs (regardless of brand) would be a 40 - 45 hp large frame CUT.
Here is what I put together as a "general" guide.

 

[Maddog10]

Others here are offering good advice on tractors, and I believe a grapple will get a lot of use. Do you have a UTV (side-by-side) Maddog? I have acreage that consists of a lot of woods and I find myself using my UTV in them way more than my tractor. Used it to carry my saw and Still brush cutter to put trails in. I only had to cut a few large trees because I tried to go around or between them but had to clear a lot of small stuff up to maybe 6" diameter. When I ride the trails now I carry a saw and loppers in the back to clean up whatever falls across them. UTV is handy for carrying cut firewood as well. I did use my tractor bucket (Kubota B7500 at the time) to carry material for fill in a few places and still do maybe once or twice a year to dump some stone in a wet rut or grapple something, but generally I find that a tractor with a loader and ballast box can be pretty cumbersome in the woods. Three maybe four times a year I run my ZTR over the trails with deck all the way up for keeping the weeds and grass down.

I occasionally walk through the woods to cut large vines or invasive plants such as multi flora rose. It is really none of my business but I will just ask.... why thin out the woods everywhere to mow? Wildlife appreciate and actually need all the undergrowth, small understory trees, standing dead trees, downed trees, brush piles, etc. and the rotting wood is good for making more soil. It is enough work just maintaining the trails I couldn't imagine trying to pick all the rock and tree debris in the woods and keeping it that way to mow.
Nice looking property BTW!

We do have a UTV. It's a 2017 Kawasaki Mule Pro FXT. Absolutely love it and use it daily. Short wheelbase, can be 3 seater with full size bed or 6 seater configuration with small bed. Best piece of machinery that my family owns. Here's a picture of me and my son picking up sticks pulling down some huge vines that had climbed an old oak tree along the driveway.

As for the woods, we are still on the fence as to what exactly the plan is. It seems to change daily. We've discussed full clearing of the back woods except for 20-30 mature trees, we've talked about clearing an area for a nice pond, we've talked about just creating trails and leaving the rest for deer/turkey (we currently have one main access trail cleared that loops around the back). That trail was cleared by an excavator and the trees are piled up along the side of the trail. We love the wildlife and they are especially abundant in our front woods which is going to remain as-is except for just picking up fallen trees and clearing deadfall that could be dangerous for the kids while they play in there. The back woods though is scraggly and mostly scrub trees that block what would otherwise be one of the best views in the county. Our building site is at the top of a hill and you can see for miles but the trees block most of it. Like I said, not exactly sure the plan. This is view looking East which is clear other than the treeline I'm standing in.

 

[Maddog10]

Productive day. Made it to one of the three towns with dealerships that I intend to shop before making a decision and had an opportunity to at least sit in all three models I'm considering. Got quotes on all models loaded out with FEL, 6' rotary cutter, 6' box blade, 3rd function installed, and 6' grapple.

I approached all my conversations the same as I did this one. I didn't go in looking for a particular model or size, I just tried to accurately describe the work I intend to be doing and allowed them to size the tractor for me. All three ended up in that 40 hp class.

Mahindra 5545 4WD Shuttle Shift
- 43/34 hp
- 5,567 lbs
- Price w/ attachments (well, forks instead of grappler): $33,620

Spec wise this tractor gets the nod. It was by far the heaviest and had the highest lifting capacities while also coming in at the cheapest price point. Sounds good, yea? Well that's about where the good stopped. The dealer relationship didn't go well from the start. Salesman seemed relatively disinterested from the word "hello". Maybe it's because I'm a young guy and he didn't consider me a serious buyer, maybe he was just having a tough day, I don't know. He also for some reason refused to price me the grappler attachment, insisting I get pallet forks instead. Ensured me I'd never hook up a grappler if I had a set of forks, and maybe he's right, but I left the dealership still not knowing the price of the grappler that I wanted... Anyway, on to the tractor. I initially thought it seemed like a nice tractor but I noticed right away I did not love the ergonomics from the seat. For such a large tractor I was surprised by the lack of leg room. Also, the loader control lever was stuck and I could not raise the bucket. Salesman slammed the lever back and it broke free, raising the bucket as it's supposed to. He claimed "these tractors sit out and don't get used so sometimes they get stuck." Alright, if you say so? I test drove it around the parking lot and the shuttle shift was nice, worked smoothly. All in all I felt that even with nothing to reference it against I could tell that Mahindra was going the economy workhouse route by sacrificing luxuries and comfort for an impressive machine that gets the job done at a budget price. I'm not ruling this one out yet, just going to chalk it up to a bad experience and certainly will not be buying from that dealer. It is far from the front-runner right now though.


John Deere 4044R 4WD HST
-43/34 hp
- 3,770 lbs
Price w/ attachments: $44,000

This was the second stop of the day and was an eye-opening experience after the first one. Salesman was very professional and genuinely interested from the outset, did an excellent job explaining the features of the tractor and took the time to explain the difference between the M series and R series. Some of it got lost in translation, but I felt so much more knowledgeable about the machine before ever even climbing into the seat. Wow, the difference was immediately noticeable compared to the Mahindra. The seat suspension and spacing in the cockpit alone instantly put the comfort factor well above it's competitor. All the controls and ergonomics seemed comfortable, hitch assist seems awesome, and I could just see and feel the quality difference in most every aspect. Unfortunately, all these amenities don't come for free and it was significantly the highest priced machine of the day, likely out of the budget range that I was considering.

Kubota Grand L4060 4WD HST
- 42/32.5
- 3,759
- Price w/ attachments: $35,000

Another great experience at the Kubota dealership. The salesmen were all busy when I arrived so I started looking on my own. Started with the L3901, which I quickly decided was too small of a frame and lacked the loader capacity for what I wanted. I then moved on to an L4701 which is what I was looking at when a salesman arrived. I explained my needs and expected uses for the tractor. He explained to me (basically echoing what Jeff said) that the sizing decision for my tractor should be based more on the lifting capabilities rather than the horsepower since most of my tasks were not heavy hp-dependent, which I agreed with. He then explained that at the same price point I could move from the L4701 to the Grand L4060 which has a beefier chassis, higher lifting capacities, and all the bells/whistles at the expense of 7 hp. I have to admit that this idea won me over. They didn't have a L4060 on-site but they did have a L5460 that I was able to sit on. Loved pretty much everything about it. Spacious, comfortable, the ergonomics made sense, and the features of the Grand L seem quite practical. The salesman told me that the company has a L4060 at another location and that he would have it here for me to test drive by the end of the week.

The search continues, but right now the Kubota Grand L has a commanding lead.

 

[airbiscuit]

Yep...

 

[jeff9366]

I have many hours on a 35-horsepower 'Grand L' HST/PLUS operating over flat terrain.

An L4060 with HST/PLUS will feel underpowered to you working on hills during day two (2) of ownership. Fine on flat terrain.
LA805 FEL spec lift is circa 1,750 pounds.

L4760 and L5460 with HST/PLUS have enough power for hills and grapple loads.
LA1055 FEL spec lift is circa 2,300 pounds.


When operating on hillsides good to have just a little more horsepower pushing HST relative to gear.