Help with small home on property

[TnAndy]

Before returning them, I would recheck my measurements. I do not believe there is such a thing as an attic stair that will only fit in a 25 inch opening. Your 24 inch on center trusses are the norm all over the country. Easily 90 percent of every house built has 24 inch on center ceiling rafters. The only other option is 16 inch centers, which I've only seen a couple of times in my life.

Helping my next door neighbor frame his house, he spec'ed 16"o.c. trusses....."because it would make the roof stronger" (House 30x60). I told him "more than you need"....and then I kept rubbing it in on every truss watching him (not me ! ) trying to squeeze between them up there.....and when we got about 2/3 down the wall, I hollered up "YOU KNOW WE'D HAVE DONE ALREADY with 24"oc !".....ahahhaaaaaaaa

And then it came back to bite him again. Building inspector wanted a 22x22" access hole in a closet ceiling.....but wouldn't let him cut a truss without an engineered approval ! He had put a cathedral ceiling (scissor trusses in the center part of the house), and ended up with a stupid looking 'door' on the upper part of both sides going into the trusses to keep the inspector happy. (I said "Once he is gone.........you know.....)

 

[TnAndy]

I stand corrected. I went to https://www.lowes.com/pd/Century-Elite-7-67-ft-to-10-25-ft-Type-IAA-Aluminum-Attic-Ladder/1001276226

and saw this "Designed for rough opening of 25.5-In. wide x 54-In. long"

Which kind of blows my mind since I've never seen this before, and I can't figure out why anybody would build this way.

Lot of older houses that used rafters and ceiling joists, ceiling joists were often 16"oc, and cutting one, then sistering another on the inside (so you could header each end of the opening) would be 14 3/8" + 14 3/8" + 1.625 (old standard for 2x thickness was 1 and 5/8) for a cut opening of 30 3/8". Then add about 2 pcs 1 5/8" thick, and the opening goes to bit over 26". 25 inches stair would give you a little clearance on either side. I'm surprised anybody still makes millwork for that older standard, but it is one possible explanation.

I used to remodel as a kid and we'd often run into 'old' standard 2x4's.....1 5/8" x 3 5/8" instead of 1 1/2 x 3 1/2. Clearly before your time

 

[EddieWalker]

Lot of older houses that used rafters and ceiling joists, ceiling joists were often 16"oc, and cutting one, then sistering another on the inside (so you could header each end of the opening) would be 14 3/8" + 14 3/8" + 1.625 (old standard for 2x thickness was 1 and 5/8) for a cut opening of 30 3/8". Then add about 2 pcs 1 5/8" thick, and the opening goes to bit over 26". 25 inches stair would give you a little clearance on either side. I'm surprised anybody still makes millwork for that older standard, but it is one possible explanation.

I used to remodel as a kid and we'd often run into 'old' standard 2x4's.....1 5/8" x 3 5/8" instead of 1 1/2 x 3 1/2. Clearly before your time

I've never seen or heard of a 1 5/8 stud, but I have worked on quite a few older homes here with actual 2inch by 4 inch studs. They are rough cut with saw marks on them. The corners of those houses have full 4 inch by 4 inch posts in them too. To add to the fun, they also have plaster walls, which I truly hate!!!!!

Back when oil was discovered here in Texas, the city of Kilgore became an oil boom town. It was nasty dirty from all the oil work going on, so the rich people all lived in Tyler, which was far enough away to not have to smell all the oil coming out of the ground. Those old houses are now massive money pits, where you will see just about everything possible in home construction!!!!

 

[Steppenwolfe]

I may be sending you off an email depending on how things play out.

No problem. Would be glad to help you out. Maybe help you sort through your choices. BTW, Eddie had a great point in possibly adding on to your house, would solve some of your issues and help down the road with re sale.

 

[TnAndy]

I've never seen or heard of a 1 5/8 stud, but I have worked on quite a few older homes here with actual 2inch by 4 inch studs. They are rough cut with saw marks on them. The corners of those houses have full 4 inch by 4 inch posts in them too. To add to the fun, they also have plaster walls, which I truly hate!!!!!

Back when oil was discovered here in Texas, the city of Kilgore became an oil boom town. It was nasty dirty from all the oil work going on, so the rich people all lived in Tyler, which was far enough away to not have to smell all the oil coming out of the ground. Those old houses are now massive money pits, where you will see just about everything possible in home construction!!!!

Yep.....worked on plenty of old houses with real 2x4 studs....some of them oak !

Lumber standard were established early in the 20th century, and revised again around 1962 to the current standards. Here is a link to the history of the standard if you want to wade thru it:

https://www.fpl.fs.fed.us/documnts/misc/miscpub_6409.pdf

 

[riptides]

My farm house is real wood. LOL. Real 2x4..2x6..4x4s and old growth...rough cut.....

Very difficult to work with....hammering...the nails bend.. sawing...the blades smoke.

 

[ultrarunner]

See all kinds of things with housing stock from mid 1800's to 1994.

Down by Lake Merit worked on one that still had gas lamps and 1 by ceiling joists with horsehair insulation...

My first single family home was 1910 cottage of 580 square feet on a 25x100 lot...

A good floorplan can substitute for a lot of square footage and some of the micro units are quite creative...

One project on a downslope in-law used an ejector for sewage... been 17 years no issues for in-law unit... with a pump sewage can really go anywhere... and tank was large enough to hold a day of shower, dishwasher and laundry.

 

[lman]

I remember when I was a kid, we built a pole barn using our own native maple lumber. When the maple dried it was too hard to put a nail in. We had to use a drill before putting any nails in the maple.

 

[Frankenkubota]

Before returning them, I would recheck my measurements. I do not believe there is such a thing as an attic stair that will only fit in a 25 inch opening. Your 24 inch on center trusses are the norm all over the country. Easily 90 percent of every house built has 24 inch on center ceiling rafters. The only other option is 16 inch centers, which I've only seen a couple of times in my life.

Yea, that's what i did, after i made the mistake. measured the opening. All my trusses are on 24 in ctrs and for no good reason, i thought all residential trusses were on 24 in ctr. Mine have a 22.5 in rough opening which is right for 24 in ctrs. Both garage and house.

I screwed up when i went to Lowe痴. As i said, they had 6-8 stairs, all identical boxes, 3 aluminum and 5 wood. EVERY one said .....for 25 inch rough in opening. If they had had 2 different sizes, it would have caused me to think but, the cubby hole was full and all for 25 in rough in.

Returned them yesterday, had to order the proper stairs, 3 weeks. I'm curious how long those other stairs will be in stock considering code here is 24 in ctrs.

This is the truth, my expert welder buddy wanted to start cutting up the trusses to make the wrong stairs fit! He better stick to welding!

Live and learn.

Just read mosses comments and believe he is right on. It's like when i go to walmart to buy chicken noodle soup and all they EVER have is 200 cans of cream of chicken!

 

[ultrarunner]

Sometimes it is a code required minimum opening size so one size fits all unless special ordered.