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   / Your last generator Maintenance Run #5,421  
In Olympia the 400 amp service is split to two 200 amp panels.

Off to the side is a Gen Tran 8 circuit box with each circuit having a 3-way switch... Utility-Off-Generator.

Like has been said it has important circuits set up for 5000 watt generator.

Of course someone capable has to be there to run Generator and switch loads.

Not ideal but economical...
That's how this house is currently setup, however I want to be able to run anything I need (mainly the water heater and A/C during the summer), winter I use wood stove so no resistant heat.
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   / Your last generator Maintenance Run #5,422  
Makes sense and something I might do in the future if I made the move...

It's rented now so I don't want to be responsible for a generator from 800 miles away...
 
   / Your last generator Maintenance Run #5,423  
Makes sense and something I might do in the future if I made the move...

It's rented now so I don't want to be responsible for a generator from 800 miles away...
Can't say I blame you!

I wouldn't really care about running the a/c, but this house has soo many windows facing the mid to evening sun that it heats up really quickly.
I plan on putting a uv reflective film on the windows, but a multi-day outage during the summer with sunny days would be pretty unbearable as my wife and I both don't like to be hot (I would get zero sleep!)



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   / Your last generator Maintenance Run
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#5,424  
I'm sure a setup could be made from scratch, however I would have a lot of hrs in research and testing to get it right, so probably not worth it.

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That schematic will likely haunt me for a while :cool: , but I did go back and find the system I was thinking of.

It was RoyKing, in Gainesville. Post # 3622.

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He lists the model # of the Deep Sea controller he used; a search for that may turn up tech docs....

(I guess my mind had conflated that ^ to Sea + King.... :rolleyes:).

Two pages later, he describes some of the tuning he did to match the controller to the application. (Post # 3642).

Rgds, D.
 
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   / Your last generator Maintenance Run
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#5,425  
Searching for Roy's system, I came across this post from CM, that begins with...

"Simplicity is king when it comes to reliability. Over the last dozen years complexity of engines, controls and emissions has increased several fold and reliability has suffered."..... (@ Top of Page)

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..... followed by several cogent paragraphs that sum up well the state of industrial product life-cycles (or lack thereof) today.

Re-posting that ^ above, as it illustrates the business-case for an independent company being able to market Generic Controllers - IMO, they don't even have to drop their price crazy low, all they really have to do is legitimately deliver on longer life-cycle support (in a reliable product), and seasoned techs will find them valuable....

Rgds, D.
 
   / Your last generator Maintenance Run #5,426  
the 400 amp generac switch has a single 400 amp rated switch, at least the ones i installed years ago. They were so damn expensive, hardly anyone uses it UNLESS you have a generator that outputs greater than 200 amps, than you cant use a 200 amp or double 200’s. In this case, you HAVE to use the larger switch.

parts manual for 400 amp switch….single mechanism

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467ABD25-9D5B-48DE-9829-928432EB1A47.jpeg
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if your lucky you have a meter set on a pedistal away from the house and you can add the transfer switches and generator away from the house. A big issue is where do you place the switches. They are aprox 14” x 30” units.

you can use an older generac switch on a newer generator with minor modifications (adding a fuse block for T1 power). You can use a newer generac transfer switch on an older generator, but the enclosed load shed module most likely wont work (its a crapshoot whether the older governor controlled generators will provide true enough waveform for the SACM load sheds used today, as compaired to the electronically controlled newer units). But you can always add SMM load shed modules, as these remotely sense a drop in frequency and shed a load. Be aware though, there are a series of generac units out there…..not sure of the model number though, that only came from factory with 58 hz output. Have no idea why this was done. They play havoc with the SMM load shed modules, and make clocks run slower when on generator.
 
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   / Your last generator Maintenance Run
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#5,427  
A lecture-hall worth of Controller 411.... thanks much grs !

Be aware though, there are a series of generac units out there…..not sure of the model number though, that only came from factory with 58 hz output. Have no idea why this was done. They play havoc with the SMM load shed modules, and make clocks run slower when on generator.

That ^, I would not have guessed.....

Rgds, D.
 
   / Your last generator Maintenance Run #5,428  
58Hz will be to ensure that any solar and or battery system connected shuts down. Victron use frequency shift in their inverters to shut down AC coupled solar panels. Fronius use it similarly too.
 
   / Your last generator Maintenance Run #5,429  
the 400 amp generac switch has a single 400 amp rated switch, at least the ones i installed years ago. They were so damn expensive, hardly anyone uses it UNLESS you have a generator that outputs greater than 200 amps, than you cant use a 200 amp or double 200’s. In this case, you HAVE to use the larger switch.

parts manual for 400 amp switch….single mechanism

View attachment 728574
View attachment 728576View attachment 728576

if your lucky you have a meter set on a pedistal away from the house and you can add the transfer switches and generator away from the house. A big issue is where do you place the switches. They are aprox 14” x 30” units.

you can use an older generac switch on a newer generator with minor modifications (adding a fuse block for T1 power). You can use a newer generac transfer switch on an older generator, but the enclosed load shed module most likely wont work (its a crapshoot whether the older governor controlled generators will provide true enough waveform for the SACM load sheds used today, as compaired to the electronically controlled newer units). But you can always add SMM load shed modules, as these remotely sense a drop in frequency and shed a load. Be aware though, there are a series of generac units out there…..not sure of the model number though, that only came from factory with 58 hz output. Have no idea why this was done. They play havoc with the SMM load shed modules, and make clocks run slower when on generator.
I figured it out, I was thinking of the B&S transfer switch, Briggs & Stratton 71057 400-Amp Split Service Automatic Transfer Switch + AC Shedding Service Disconnect

Looks like what I would need for my setup and less expensive then 2-200a Generac units! Would just take a bit more work to get everything functional but the hardware would be there at least.

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   / Your last generator Maintenance Run
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#5,430  
58Hz will be to ensure that any solar and or battery system connected shuts down. Victron use frequency shift in their inverters to shut down AC coupled solar panels. Fronius use it similarly too.
Interesting. I'm now wondering how common this is....

Synchronous motors are less plentiful than when I was a kid, but still around...

Rgds, D.
 
   / Your last generator Maintenance Run #5,431  
I wish I had known about the twin 200's instead of a single 400. When I asked why the install at my NC farm was so much more expensive than my
last whole house gen, they pointed to the line item price of that 400 box. Wow. Price of a small car years ago...
But it all worked flawlessly
 
   / Your last generator Maintenance Run #5,432  
Taking the SS Generac on a 4 hour tour. Hopefully nothing will spring a hole in anything and leave me deserted.

Haven't used the big whole house forced air furnace all season. Been using other sources to try and cut back on KwHrs used. But kicked it on to load the genny and fuel supply to check for conflicts. None noted so far, burners and blower both started fine with no noted bog in genney.

Darn thing's noisy though so close to the house. Probably going to have to move it, which I'm not looking forward to.
 
   / Your last generator Maintenance Run #5,433  
Funny thing about human nature...

Have new tenants in a nice single family on an acre which is rare in the city.

They came from a 1,000 square feet rental with a broken wall furnace... but weather here is mild.

Moved in December 1 and so happy and commented several times on the beauty of central heat and how much they love not being cold anymore... high efficiency gas furnace, well insulated and double pane windows...

Just stopped by yesterday and house cold and all wearing sweats...

I asked why so cold and they said at their old house the natural gas bill was never more than $20 a month... their first gas bill at the new house came with a gas bill of $220

Sometimes having what you think you want isn't the same as having it...
 
   / Your last generator Maintenance Run #5,434  
Throwing in some laundry to increase the load. Kicked on a 1500 watt oil filled space heater I haven't used in a while. Throwing everything at it including the kitchen sink ... hot water to run the water heater.
 
   / Your last generator Maintenance Run #5,435  
20 bucks a month for heat
well, maybe in Panama...
Ultrarunner your tenants had better not move to the NE or Canada and buy a house with fuel oil.

you'd really have to live in a goldilocks zone to accomplish that. And not mind fairly hot or fairly cold.
Not me, I want that thermostat on 71, 70 at night. As I've gotten older that number has crept up a couple of degrees.
Of course I live in a 900sf cottage and utilities are pretty cheap.

one of my favorite rv sites is expounding on the future of solid state battery banks instead of generators on rv's.
They need to figure out how to lower amperage consumption for hvac first. Some magic gas with 99% efficiency.
Because you can't depend upon solar being there. And solar isn't the most attractive thing in the world...
So we'll continue to ingest petroleum products in our generators. Which means we have to maintain them,
change the oil, recycle the waste oil, put the oily filter in the landfill, and make an enormous amount of noise
during operation. Which is why there are 162 videos, or so, on youtube showing home made generator noise boxes.

I'm up for continuing scientific breakthoughs. Is there an EMP proof option for generators?
Firing up the old Farmall with a gen on the pto will be in high demand if someone sets off one of those EMPs.
I'm no prepper but having some of the pre-electronic stuff might come in super handy. Some of these electric grids
clearly have some issues.
 
   / Your last generator Maintenance Run #5,436  
Generator noise can sound like dozens of Briggs and Stratton mowers for hours on end and think it took a toll during the planned utility shut offs.

I like quiet and if money no object a sound stage genset would fit the bill.

I was once where they will filming and the gensets all Honda Diesel so quiet in there huge cases you wouldn't even know they are running...

The $20 monthly natural gas bill at the renters old place was hot water only as the home heater was broken and never did get fixed... East Bay SF Bay Area where 2 million dollar homes probably don't have A/C...
 
   / Your last generator Maintenance Run #5,437  
As to generator noise I once found a neat trick.
My noisy Briggs powered genny was about 30 feet from my chalet and we could not converse.
Their was a hole near it, perhaps 1 foot deep and equally wide.
I attached some flex tubing that was handy and re directed the exhaust into that hole.
Miracles!--- all we could hear from nearby was the clacking of the valves.
The soil sides of that hole deadened 95% of exhaust sounds and we could carry on conversations at normal volume.
 
   / Your last generator Maintenance Run #5,438  
A whole house unit is way way quieter than a portable producing 1/2 the power of the standby.
actually my 6500watt portable is noisier than my 22 kw standby. I can hardly stand being next to the portable when its operating. I can carry a conversation next to the 22
 
   / Your last generator Maintenance Run #5,439  
Ive heard the larger Honda Inverter Generators and not bad... only know of one Generac in the neighborhood but never heard it run.

5 our on Generac Wait List at one time but no updates.

One is an elderly retired couple with a Honda eu3000 Inverter and electric start... I really like how quiet and fuel sipping since I refill it... most of the time is is on eco-idle.

It powers a oxygen concentrator refrigeration, lights and computer/internet...
 
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   / Your last generator Maintenance Run #5,440  
Has anyone tried putting a foot long pipe on
the exhaust on their generator??

Mine is not very loud but really don't want to
hear it run

willy
 

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