Flail Mowers

[presnewt]

I am sure this question has been asked a million times but when I did a search I did not see any discussions on it, but, can a flail mower on a compact (50hp) tractor do the same job as a rotary mower. I would like something in the 6' size. The main advantage I see is the safety (less thrown objects and weight closer to the tractor). I don't necessarily have to have a nicer looking cut as it will be in a pasture. I have seen some that will cut 2-3" woody plants so it looks like they are certainly stout enough to handle most things the rotary mower will cut. I have looked for videos and the verdict is not really clear to me. I can find just as many people that prefer rotary as I can that prefer flail. Thanks for any help. If anyone has a link to another discussion, please post it. I will be cutting on some hilly areas and anything that may make the tractor a little safer is worth investigating.

 

[Bill Guenthner]

With a flail mower you use different flails for different cut. Hammers for bush-hogging or blades for finish cut.

 

[keg99]

I really like my 6' flail mower (pulled behind a 40 Hp tractor). But, you need to be aware it does not leave a nice cut like a rotary. It is halfway between a brush hog and a finish mower in its cut quality. A finish mower will create suction to raise the grass blades. But a flail has no suction, which results in the grass that you just drove over staying below the cutting knives only to pop up later as the grass regains its composure. The big advantage is you don't have a large implement swinging around in the back so you can maneuver better. And you don't have the chance of throwing rock, etc. as a rotary can do. I keep my rotary for those in-between jobs. Finish mower for the nice lawn area, rotary for the places where I almost need a brush hog and have trees to swing around. Brush hog for everything else.

From what you described, a flail mower might work really well. More comfortable on hills. And you don't really need the fine cut quality. I am not so sure about cutting saplings, though. It will do it, but . . . it just is not meant for that. I have driven into 3' plus grass and it cut fine. But again . . . it is not meant to blast through tall grass. If you go slow, it will work. If you go fast, you risk wrapping up grass around the center hub.

I also find the flail mower a bit more comfortable to use. Since it is closer to the tractor, it rides better with the ground contour. It also swings around better and faster since the mass is closer to the tractor. It does not crash hard into the rocks that are buried in places I always forget. It is not as hard on the tractor since it takes less power to drive it (at least that's my experience compared to my 6' brush hog). All in all, it fits perfectly for that in-between need.

Good luck in your search.

 

[presnewt]

I really like my 6' flail mower (pulled behind a 40 Hp tractor). But, you need to be aware it does not leave a nice cut like a rotary. It is halfway between a brush hog and a finish mower in its cut quality. A finish mower will create suction to raise the grass blades. But a flail has no suction, which results in the grass that you just drove over staying below the cutting knives only to pop up later as the grass regains its composure. The big advantage is you don't have a large implement swinging around in the back so you can maneuver better. And you don't have the chance of throwing rock, etc. as a rotary can do. I keep my rotary for those in-between jobs. Finish mower for the nice lawn area, rotary for the places where I almost need a brush hog and have trees to swing around. Brush hog for everything else.

From what you described, a flail mower might work really well. More comfortable on hills. And you don't really need the fine cut quality. I am not so sure about cutting saplings, though. It will do it, but . . . it just is not meant for that. I have driven into 3' plus grass and it cut fine. But again . . . it is not meant to blast through tall grass. If you go slow, it will work. If you go fast, you risk wrapping up grass around the center hub.

I also find the flail mower a bit more comfortable to use. Since it is closer to the tractor, it rides better with the ground contour. It also swings around better and faster since the mass is closer to the tractor. It does not crash hard into the rocks that are buried in places I always forget. It is not as hard on the tractor since it takes less power to drive it (at least that's my experience compared to my 6' brush hog). All in all, it fits perfectly for that in-between need.

Good luck in your search.

Can I ask what brand flail mower you have. Also, is the flail quicker or slower than the brush hog for "normal" mowing (cutting pastures a few times during the summer).

 

[Hay Dude]

I am sure this question has been asked a million times but when I did a search I did not see any discussions on it, but, can a flail mower on a compact (50hp) tractor do the same job as a rotary mower. I would like something in the 6' size. The main advantage I see is the safety (less thrown objects and weight closer to the tractor). I don't necessarily have to have a nicer looking cut as it will be in a pasture. I have seen some that will cut 2-3" woody plants so it looks like they are certainly stout enough to handle most things the rotary mower will cut. I have looked for videos and the verdict is not really clear to me. I can find just as many people that prefer rotary as I can that prefer flail. Thanks for any help. If anyone has a link to another discussion, please post it. I will be cutting on some hilly areas and anything that may make the tractor a little safer is worth investigating.

I have a custom mowing business. Hay & large fields and a few smaller fields. Have owned several mowers flail (John Deere 390 and Ferri swing arm flail) & rotary (John Deere CX & Woods Batwings) over the last 20+ years. Flail mowers are nice, but I didnt care for the extra maintenance on all the tiny hammers and had some issues with belts. A bush hog type of rotary mower is all shaft driven and pretty easy to sharpen the blades.
As you said, Flail mower less likely to throw objects, but my rotaries (John Deere CX series) have chain shielding and it works great. In 20 years I cant remember ever throwing anything in a dangerous manner through rotary chain shielding.
The flail is more compact and closer to the tractor for backing. How important is that to you versus the ease of service and ruggedness of a HD rotary?
Over the years, we have eliminated the flails from our fleet of mowers and are now all rotary. However, I can understand the attractiveness of a flail.

 

[presnewt]

I have a custom mowing business. Hay & large fields and a few smaller fields. Have owned several mowers flail (John Deere 390 and Ferri swing arm flail) & rotary (John Deere CX & Woods Batwings) over the last 20+ years. Flail mowers are nice, but I didnt care for the extra maintenance on all the tiny hammers and had some issues with belts. A bush hog type of rotary mower is all shaft driven and pretty easy to sharpen the blades.
As you said, Flail mower less likely to throw objects, but my rotaries (John Deere CX series) have chain shielding and it works great. In 20 years I cant remember ever throwing anything in a dangerous manner through rotary chain shielding.
The flail is more compact and closer to the tractor for backing. How important is that to you versus the ease of service and ruggedness of a HD rotary?
Over the years, we have eliminated the flails from our fleet of mowers and are now all rotary. However, I can understand the attractiveness of a flail.

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[presnewt]

Thanks Hay Dude. Nice to hear from someone who has extensively used both. I will have trees etc I will need to back up under but the largest acreage is open pasture. I am trying to balance safety and performance. The tractor may be more stable on hills with the flail but I am not really sure if the difference is much. We have cattle, so we have to deal with bull holes which makes tractor work a little more dangerous. Because of that I am looking at some oscillating tractors which will navigate those situations much better. Some of the dealers for those tractors like the flail mowers better because of the weight distribution, etc.

 

[keg99]

Can I ask what brand flail mower you have. Also, is the flail quicker or slower than the brush hog for "normal" mowing (cutting pastures a few times during the summer).

I have the Bush Hog brand mower. Hey Dude made some good points. I agree that the flail has more points of maintenance since there are many more blades to keep sharp and deal with, as well as belts. But I have never had any issues with maintenance. I just keep it greased and avoid chomping into the ground. That said, I don't cut a whole lot, so my use may not indicate how a flail stands up to a lot of cutting. It will stand up, but maybe not take the abuse a brush hog will take. (Heaven knows what I have put my brush hog through!)

As for speed, it seems just as fast. Not faster and not slower than a brush hog. As I noted in my original post, I find it easier on hills and when going around tress, etc. since it is closer to the tractor and does not have the large amount of weight that swings way out there. As with anything, there are compromises, benefits and detriments. Can't say one is really better than the other. Just different.

 

[Hay Dude]

Thanks Hay Dude. Nice to hear from someone who has extensively used both. I will have trees etc I will need to back up under but the largest acreage is open pasture. I am trying to balance safety and performance. The tractor may be more stable on hills with the flail but I am not really sure if the difference is much. We have cattle, so we have to deal with bull holes which makes tractor work a little more dangerous. Because of that I am looking at some oscillating tractors which will navigate those situations much better. Some of the dealers for those tractors like the flail mowers better because of the weight distribution, etc.

No problem! PM me if you need more help. We cut well over 1000 acres in hay & fields Per year.
You may actually like the rotary better for backing under trees. With a flail, your tractor is more likely to hit branches since mower is closer to tractor.

If you can find one of these, BUY IT. John Deere MX-8. Ran this thing for 7-8 years in way rougher ground and conditions than recommended and it never needed repairs.
They are fantastic for use around trees and split rail fences. I used this on my cattle pastures under fences and it does an amazing job. It side shifts to the left or right 2 feet!

 

[leonz]

I have written extensively about this issue on the forum for many years.

If you have the time and want to examine it in more detail look up the flail mower thread
on the attachments page to examine it further.

If all you are planning on doing is taking down pasture every few month's, it is a question
of what you want to spend on either a new flail mower or a used on that may be municipal
surplus that does not see any more than weather dependent seasonal use and most of these
are Alamo Industrial Flail Mowers.

In order to take pasture down every few months you will need to cut it down to 2 inches in
height each time.

This is simply because a flail mower works best when there is high flow of air (pressure gradient)
being pulled under the flail mower which works in combination with the high speed of rotation of
the flail mower rotor to clip the brush and lift it up and over the flail mower rotor and back down
to the ground.

A 48" flail mower will cut as well or better than a 72" flail mower it just depends on the quality of cut
you desire and how often you may end up passing over it a second time to shred it up more finely
to eliminate any chance of dead sod from grass matting up.

==================================================================

Here are a few of the things you need to consider in for this investment in an implement like a flail shredder/mower.

1. How much time do you have to mow??, my father mowed his pasture in 4 acre blocks every 2 weeks with his
Ford Jubilee and 7 foot John Deere 25A finish flail mower to a 2 inch cut.

2. How much can you afford to spend on a new or used flail mower or crop shredder?

3. A finish cut flail mower will have side slicer knives. a multipurpose flail mower will have.
scoop knives or cast hammer knives.

4. Side slicer knives will allow you to recut the clippings on a second pass, the scoop/hammer knives only once.

5. A flail mower or flail crop shredder will have many, many, many times more cutting edge length than a rotary
cutter or rotary mower and will provide you with a finer clipping that will dissolve more quickly.
With a side slicer knife you will be able to flip a dulled cutting edge for a sharp one when needed before they
need sharpening.

There is much more to read and examine before you begin looking for a flail mower for your needs.

 

[kthompson]

I have had three flail mowers. First was bought to use behind a B2710 Kubota and it handled it fine. No idea the brand but was sold by Agri Supply. I took it back after one use for it had the "Y" blades on it and was bought to mow lawn and it looked terrible. It was few years before I bought my second one which I used on 12,000 excavator for mowing around fields and pond. Still have the mower head but now on a tractor boom mower. Also tested a boom mower for Agri Supply for about three years with flail mower head. Two years ago I bought my third but the fourth flail mower I have run.

I think the rough-cut Brush cutter is a fast ground speed. I think it is simpler but there are draws back to that.

Flail mowers are to me better on a boom than a rotary mower. They offset better than a rotary mower does, well maybe should say there is more offset options with the flail mowers. If you break a rough cut mower blade with the mower raised or tilted often it is real hunk of metal that goes flying. Have heard of them clearing a house to damage the house on far side. Of course a flying flair mower blade is serious but nor likely to be as much weight.
For me the flail mower if setup correctly (direction of rotation comes into play. Some around it to rotate forward or reverse, many do not) will mulch brush or trees where a rough cut does not. I have seen a rough cut mower throw a stump over 75 feet to do major damage to a car door to a car driving by. Never had a flail to really throw debris more than 4 to 6 feet.

As other has posted I have all three mowers types and like each one.

 

[Hay Dude]

Thanks Hay Dude. Nice to hear from someone who has extensively used both. I will have trees etc I will need to back up under but the largest acreage is open pasture. I am trying to balance safety and performance. The tractor may be more stable on hills with the flail but I am not really sure if the difference is much. We have cattle, so we have to deal with bull holes which makes tractor work a little more dangerous. Because of that I am looking at some oscillating tractors which will navigate those situations much better. Some of the dealers for those tractors like the flail mowers better because of the weight distribution, etc.

We mow under and around all kinds of objects. I actually like our wide area mowers best because you can drive the “wing” under the object, or back up to it and keep the tractor from getting all scratched up. Heres me cutting under power lines next to a fence. No problem with a wide mower.
In your case, consider a side shift mower.

 

[workinonit]

I have a offset 10' Maschio with hammers. When set properly, which is within 1.5" from the ground it cuts as good as my 20' FM.

 

[Hay Dude]

Heres my Ferri swing flail mower. It offset about 4’ either side and angles upward or downward. You need a very heavy tractor or counterbalance weights to really make it work.

 

[workinonit]

Yea, people buy those things and don't have a clue how awkward they are. They will put you in the ditch you are trimming if you aren't careful. I've been running a rotary version of one for years.

 

[wirlybird]

Others have given great info here.
Here is my 2 cents worth!
I have three flails of different size and configuration.
First thing is if there are ANY rocks or similar debris forget it! The flail blades just don't do well.
As far as saplings and cutting up to 2-3 inch take that with a grain of salt. I found my flail with hammers is more likely to bend over any type of saplings or stiffer stalky types of vegetation and just scuff over them and leave them standing.
I think the flail will do better than a rotary cutter in areas with low vine type of stuff. It has its place but the flail really doesn't replace the rotary cutter.
I do use my largest flail with scoop or duck foot type cutters to do a large field and that does a really nice job but the field is debris free and is kept cut.

Think of the brush hog as a "multi tool", it does an ok job with whatever you throw at it.
The flail is a little more "specialized", it has areas where it is very good but I don't think it is nearly the general use tool as the brush hog.

 

[Xfaxman]

If anyone has a link to another discussion, please post it.

I have written extensively about this issue on the forum for many years.

If you have the time and want to examine it in more detail look up the flail mower thread
on the attachments page to examine it further.

Here is the epic flail mower thread: Flail Mower - Let's talk flail mowers

 

[Cahaba Valley Farm]

I have a custom mowing business. Hay & large fields and a few smaller fields. Have owned several mowers flail (John Deere 390 and Ferri swing arm flail) & rotary (John Deere CX & Woods Batwings) over the last 20+ years. Flail mowers are nice, but I didnt care for the extra maintenance on all the tiny hammers and had some issues with belts. A bush hog type of rotary mower is all shaft driven and pretty easy to sharpen the blades.
As you said, Flail mower less likely to throw objects, but my rotaries (John Deere CX series) have chain shielding and it works great. In 20 years I cant remember ever throwing anything in a dangerous manner through rotary chain shielding.
The flail is more compact and closer to the tractor for backing. How important is that to you versus the ease of service and ruggedness of a HD rotary?
Over the years, we have eliminated the flails from our fleet of mowers and are now all rotary. However, I can understand the attractiveness of a flail.

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How many mowers do you have Hey Dude???

 

[Cahaba Valley Farm]

A 48" flail mower will cut as well or better than a 72" flail mower

Please explain why.

 

[Cahaba Valley Farm]

The flail is a little more "specialized", it has areas where it is very good but I don't think it is nearly the general use tool as the brush hog.

Where do you think it shines the best?