.22LR Ammo

[Code54]

5.5 cents a round roughly - thats pretty good now a days!

 

[daugen]

now that Winchester is less than 40 grains, but still loud because of 1200+fps?
Funny how one load is ten percent less than standard 40 grains. Like buying a 14oz loaf of bread today...
A nickle a shot is pretty good.
Like going to the fair grounds
Hey kid, 20 shots for a dollar!

is a plain round nose bullet more accurate than a hollow point for target practice?

 

[k0ua]

now that Winchester is less than 40 grains, but still loud because of 1200+fps?
Funny how one load is ten percent less than standard 40 grains. Like buying a 14oz loaf of bread today...
A nickle a shot is pretty good.
Like going to the fair grounds
Hey kid, 20 shots for a dollar!

is a plain round nose bullet more accurate than a hollow point for target practice?

Daugen, two things cause the sounds we hear from the firing of the .22LR cartridge.

First the sound level depends on the length of the barrel of the firearm we fire them in. The shorter the barrel the louder the muzzle blast as the hot gasses do not have a chance to cool in the shorter barrel. Also the longer barrel allows the gasses to expand along its length and cool down some, so the muzzle blast is less "explosive" as the bullet clears the barrel.

Second comes the "sonic crack" as the bullet in the air breaks the sound barrier. This is the exact same phenomenon as an sonic boom from a jet aircraft. While this velocity varies due to temperature and even humidity of the air, it is somewhere around 1200 fps or a little greater. So a bullet travelling less than 1200 fps will likely not produce this 'crack' sound. These bullets are said to be subsonic.

Ironically the identical round may have a crack sound when fired from a rifle but not produce the sonic crack when fired from a pistol, as the pistol may not be able to wring out the needed velocity out of the powder charge. BUT the pistol will always sound much louder due to the increased muzzle blast.

If we put a suppressor on the pistol and give a place for those hot muzzle gasses to expand slowly into its chambers and cool down before being released into the atmosphere this round can sound like a mouse fart. And since the sonic boom velocity is not reached by the bullet fired from the shorter pistol barrel, no 'crack' sound will be heard in the open air.

Also adding an ablative substance in the suppressor can further reduce muzzle blast sounds. These substances can include such things as wire pulling gel, vaseline, or even water. These substances help cool the gasses before they are released. But if the round from the pistol exceeds the sonic boom velocity then no amount of muzzle suppression will keep the sonic crack from occurring in the open air. This is why you see ammo listed as subsonic or standard velocity etc. Adding ablative substances is called shooting a "wet can". Several db's of sound suppression can be achieved by "wet cans"


As for hollow point vs. solid accuracy, that is a very difficult thing to say. The deviations in accuracy of different rounds in different firearms is greater than the deviations between the two types of bullets. There is some thought that some hollow point rounds may not be as concentric as they could be, and therefore might not be quite as accurate as possible.
I hope this little "book" helped.

 

[Sigarms]

Daugen, two things cause the sounds we hear from the firing of the .22LR cartridge.

First the sound level depends on the length of the barrel of the firearm we fire them in. The shorter the barrel the louder the muzzle blast as the hot gasses do not have a chance to cool in the shorter barrel. Also the longer barrel allows the gasses to expand along its length and cool down some, so the muzzle blast is less "explosive" as the bullet clears the barrel.

Second comes the "sonic crack" as the bullet in the air breaks the sound barrier. This is the exact same phenomenon as an sonic boom from a jet aircraft. While this velocity varies due to temperature and even humidity of the air, it is somewhere around 1200 fps or a little greater. So a bullet travelling less than 1200 fps will likely not produce this 'crack' sound. These bullets are said to be subsonic.

Ironically the identical round may have a crack sound when fired from a rifle but not produce the sonic crack when fired from a pistol, as the pistol may not be able to wring out the needed velocity out of the powder charge. BUT the pistol will always sound much louder due to the increased muzzle blast.

If we put a suppressor on the pistol and give a place for those hot muzzle gasses to expand slowly into its chambers and cool down before being released into the atmosphere this round can sound like a mouse fart. And since the sonic boom velocity is not reached by the bullet fired from the shorter pistol barrel, no 'crack' sound will be heard in the open air.

Also adding an ablative substance in the suppressor can further reduce muzzle blast sounds. These substances can include such things as wire pulling gel, vaseline, or even water. These substances help cool the gasses before they are released. But if the round from the pistol exceeds the sonic boom velocity then no amount of muzzle suppression will keep the sonic crack from occurring in the open air. This is why you see ammo listed as subsonic or standard velocity etc. Adding ablative substances is called shooting a "wet can". Several db's of sound suppression can be achieved by "wet cans"


As for hollow point vs. solid accuracy, that is a very difficult thing to say. The deviations in accuracy of different rounds in different firearms is greater than the deviations between the two types of bullets. There is some thought that some hollow point rounds may not be as concentric as they could be, and therefore might not be quite as accurate as possible.
I hope this little "book" helped.

Well said.

 

[daugen]

Well said, I agree and thanks.
now clearly I had to go look this up:
the speed of sound is 343.2 metres per second (1,126 ft/s; 1,236 km/h; 768 mph

I would think for target practice I would want something about 700 mph and either perfectly round or slightly spiraled?
I'm not trying to knock down an animal...what is unique about match grade bullets that makes them so accurate?
Is that why the most expensive .22LR's have an accuracy edge?

So for my own practice I will likely buy American and
fairly cheap. But when the guys come over, I want to bring out a box of the "good stuff".
Is that simply match grade ammo? Any suggestions? I thought the CCI rounds I've shot were awfully good, never had a misfire, ever.
But then honestly I haven't shot that much in a long time. Now that I'm retired and have the time, and the place, it's time to
get the targets up. And then start measuring back from the edge of the woods. And somewhere a lawn chair will be plopped down...and a folding table. And binoculars.
life is very good. Now we'll see if my eyes still work. Rifle has a modest but adequate quality scope on it, probably needs to be sighted in after getting banged around
in the move a few years ago. I also have a fairly nice bb gun I could play with. Would be interesting to see what ten pumps would do...not like bb's are perfectly round.

My instincts tell me to choose something with a plain round nose ,but otherwise it seems to be a choice of how much propellant and how heavy the bullet,
leaving out all the exotic purpose built rounds. No matter what you use a rifle for, you sure want accuracy but here's a case where accuracy trumps stopping power or
need for long range. To start, I think those Winchester rounds at a nickle a piece is a fine way to consume some American products.

Now if everything I wanted didn't always come up out of stock...but makes sense to me that availability will improve. There must be an enormous amount of ammo
stored away in the heartland and in the mountains. Probably not as much in the cities. Folks simply cannot keep buying ammo at the rate they have been, setting all records.
All you aliens, don't come around here...and I mean that in my neighborhood too. Almost every guy I know has a gun safe with large weapon collections. And I hear them being
exercised late in the afternoon. Sometimes sounds like WWIII here.

So...having a quiet round for target practice appeals to me. Subsonic. Suggestions are always welcome.

 

[k0ua]

As for what makes a "match round" a true "match grade round". Well, you have opened a real worm can there. But here are the basics. Anytime that more care and precision is put into the manufacture of a round, then more precision can be gotten out of it downrange. There, that is all you need to know.

.22 rounds are a mass produced item so it stands to reason that some will be on the ragged edge of specification all the way across the specification spectrum. Bullet weight, bullet concentricity, powder charge, priming compound uniformity in the rim, the crimp of the case mouth, brass variations etc. All of these things can and do have an effect on accuracy and terminal performance. Any time the standard deviation in velocity can be minimized, then of course vertical stringing downrange can be minimized.

So if you run a production line slower, and have more stringent quality control of components and do more post manufacture quality control and testing, does it stand to reason that the product will be more uniform? And if it is more uniform, it will be more accurate in most guns. See there I left myself an "out" with the weasel word "most". The fact is, chambers and barrels are "picky". Some just don't like perfectly good ammo that others just gobble up and produce good results with. In a recent test I saw of several brands of .22LR ammo running from the super hot to many "match" grades, some of the guns liked some of the "cheap crap" just about as well as or better than some of the "match ammo". Go figure.

If dead nuts accuracy is your goal, then you would be ahead to buy several types of ammo and test them in your gun. Keep meticulous records and make sure your control variables are minimized. Find out what your particular gun likes, and stick with that and hope the manufacture does their part and keeps making them all the same, or buy a whole bunch from the same lot.

If you want to have fun, then just buy some cheap blasting ammo that seems to run well in your gun and have at it.

Don't get me started on handloaded centerfire ammo, as now you can spend a lifetime searching for that "perfect load" and honing the gilt edge of the accuracy sword. Daugen, you can spend a lifetime studying this crap with varying degrees of success at producing good ammo. When all of the variables are at your own control, or most of them anyway you will have no one else to blame for poor results but yourself!

I hope this helped a bit.

 

[PJSprog]

Have you seen In stock ammo, guns, magazines, and reloading supplies

It's basically a search engine for ammo. If you pay attention to cost per round you might be surprised how much you're actually paying locally.

That site is a joke. It must be ad-driven. Seems like it only has 5-6 sellers repeated. I checked on Alamo Ammo since it's the closest to me. It's a small brick and mortar place that sells tickets. Similar to Ticket Master. I guess they sell ammo on the side.

Nope, not a joke at all. It is, as vidio1 noted, a search engine for ammo. Not sure what search you did, but my searches for .22LR come up with dozens of sellers. I used to only buy local, even at the inflated panic prices. I was not interested in buying online ... until I simply couldn't find any anymore. Someone on a shooting forum suggested AmmoSeek, so I tried it about a year ago. Opened up a whole world of availability and selection. There may not be any at your local Walmart, but there's tons of it out there on the 'net just waiting to ship right to your door.

 

[Code54]

K0ua sums it up nicely.

Consistency is a big part of accuracy - generally speaking with .22 the more expensive .22 are more consistent. (Rim thickness, case thickness, bullet weight, bullet shape, primer consistency, power charge, etc)

If you get into rimfire shooting you will note that most find Eley Ammo (UK Company) as top of the line or at least one of the best. They have less expensive ammo but paying $20 a box is not odd. When I was shooting for my college every 1/1000 of an inch in a group mattered - if you are not shooting matches and have a firearm capable of extreme accuracy most don't see the need for the big buck stuff. I have a nice 10/22 that I can feed CCI standard and get about 1/2 inch group- I can also feed it 10X or Match and still get about 1/2 group so in this case why pay more than $4 a box for CCI?
As previously stated a lot of rifle accuracy is in the test of different loads and seeing what really works for your gun. Also don't think because a buddy has the "same" gun and he says X ammo is the best it will also be for you. I have buddies with CZ455's that LOVE Eley Match and can shoot impressive groups with it all day, but my other buddies 455 shoots ok with Match but love CCI green tag?? No idea why - just sort of how it is....
Good luck and check out Rimfirecentral.com if you want to read a LOT about .22's

 

[Gunny]

One round that I've found to be pretty decent and not that expensive, Federal AM22, target grade performance, 40 grain solid bullet and hits about 1200 fps, designed for semi-autos. Not subsonic, but just get a pair of cheap ear muffs or ear plugs and go have a ball.
Academy has it from time to time for $18.95 for 325 rounds and it's not that hard to come up with another $6.05 of other stuff to qualify for free shipping. If you want to try some of the Ely subsonic, add a box to that order, then sit and wait for the FedEx man

 

[Eric Salop]

As K0ua and Code54 say, serious accuracy is all about consistency, both in the quality of the ammunition and in shooting technique.

The top 2 shooters where I used to shoot were in a different class to everyone else. To try and get the edge that could get them a place at county level, they would drive to the Eley manufacturing plant and spend a day trying out 12 or more different batches of Eley Tenex with their rifles clamped in special mounts. As well as looking at the targets by eye, a computer printout also gave them a statistical analysis of how each batch performed, with the difference between the best and worst performing batches being quite significant.

Whatever level you shoot at, getting the best accuracy out of any rifle can be quite addictive. Unless you enjoy making loud bangs, subsonics will be your best choice Drew. Get plenty of practice in before starting to compare different brands of ammo, then wait for a day with almost no wind. I'm looking forward to seeing a few pictures of how tight you can get those groups !