3 Pt on GC2300/JD2210/BX2230

Henro · Jun 24, 2004

I have to jump in on this. There is no such thing as a limited cat 1 3 point hitch. 

OK, that may be true...

By I think the Kubota BX is claimed to be cat 1 in the advertising.

Now I have a BX2200 and a B2910. Both are Cat 1.

I can tell you they are not the same. Not close...the BX spreads less, lifts less and the lower lift arms are shorter to boot.

If there is no such thing as a limited CAT 1 3 PH, then what do you call what is on my BX, which is certainly not the same as what is on my B2910?

Whatever it is called, the BX 3PH is certainly limited...sad, but true...

Bob_Skurka · Jun 24, 2004

( I have to jump in on this. There is no such thing as a limited cat 1 3 point hitch. ASAE has specs that call out pin size and width for lower arms and hole size for top link. If you buy a sub or even a small compact you should accept that all implements will not work. For example a Kubota B7500 would not work well with a 7 foot brush hog, does this mean that the 7500 also has a limited cat one hitch? /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Dave )

The term LIMITED has been used by JD sales people to describe what is on the rear end of the 2210. I suppose they made up the term. Regardless of who made it up, where it came from, or how it evolved, the Cat 1 hitches on SOME of the Sub-CUTS is smaller in several dimensions than a "standard" Cat 1 hitch. So we could all argue the term, that was used. Or we could take our tape measures out and see the proof. If the lower arms don't spread far enough, or if the lift is not high enough, to allow a standard Cat 1 implement such as a 4' blade (no need to go up to a 7' unit) to rotate 180 degrees while it is mounted on the tractor then I think it qualifies as limited. The fact that the BX series units Cat 1 hitches don't seem to allow the lower arms to spread to full ASAE width (which explains why so many owners have to modify standard implements to fit BX tractors) also would imply that those size hitches are limited in some way and are not fully compliant with ASAE standards for a Cat 1 hitch. But if you choose to call it a SUB-standard hitch or some other term, that is fine with me. I think many people understand the term I used for what it is.

As for your example, which is patently absurd, it fully misses the point. A B7500 can, in fact, hook up to the 7' brush hog you mention without modifying the brush hog's a-frame assembly. The tractor might not be capable of practical use of the implement due to hp limitations and weight issues, but the fact is it's hitch is capable of connecting up to it. Back up a BX to the same implement and you will quickly see that it won't physically be able to connect to implement because the spread of the lower arms won't permit a wide enough opening to between the ball sockets to make the connection. Again, I think most people would understand that that is a limitation of the hitch size, hence, what is commonly being referred to as a LIMIITED CAT 1 hitch.

Will_C · Jun 25, 2004

I have been reaidng this thread for awhile, and Bob and Henro are right on the money. I have a BX, and I love it, but it is not the choice I would make if I planned to use the 3pt hitch a lot. I have used various implements, and it can be a chore. I do like the fact that I can use properly sized cat 1 implements, but it does require work and thought, to attach and adjust. If I were to buy any new implements for this tractor, I would certainly but either the Woods Estate series or the King Kutter XB line.
Will

Bob_Skurka · Jun 25, 2004

Will,
I think that sometimes people take factual information and consider it to be criticism. I have never criticized the BX line of tractors, nor will I ever recommend them. They are excellent tractors, but I won't recommend them because of their hitch. I think a lot of people would out vote me, and gladly recommend the BX line up, and that is totally fine with me. It is not a sin for me to say that I like the Massey 3pt better, or that the NH TZs look to be the best of the Sub-CUTs right now from the standpoint of the 3pt hitch -it does fall short in not allowing for a backhoe (ditto the JD2210).

I simple prefer standardized implements and tractors that can use those implements, consequently I would not personally choose the JD or the Kubota. The Massey and the New Holland seem to have the most standard size hitches of all the sub-CUTs. If I needed a backhoe I'd go with the Massy, if not then I think I would buy the NH, but that is because the NH dealer in my area is an excellent dealer, not because the tractor is significantly better in any way.

Wood_Butcher_Dav · Jun 25, 2004

Bob,

It might just be semantics but the point I was trying to make is the BX2200 meets the spec for CAT 1 Hitch. I don't have the numbers in front of me but I believe the minimum spread for the lower arms is 26-28 inches. I will also say that the manufacture also recommends certain size implements to be used. So if you use an implement that is larger then what is recommended it may have limited function. I will agree that some implements are harder took hook up because of the spread not as great as larger tractors that also have CAT 1 hitch. The BX2200 is a small tractor so you have to use smaller implements. I will now take my glorified garden tractor and go home./forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Dave

MessickFarmEqu · Jun 25, 2004

I think people are making a much bigger deal out of this than what it really needs to be. Maybe because its the one area where there is an actual clear difference between these tractors.

Really, probably 80% of the people who buy these tractors never use the 3pt hitch. Those who do, need to buy estate sized implements anyway. One question that was not raised was if anyone actually has a problem getting CAT1 stuff to fit, of all the stuff that goes out of this store I have yet to hear of anyone that has a problem.

While this certinaly should be a consideration, it should not be the end all and be all factor for picking what tractor you want. Personaly, I sell the NH and Kubota side by side. If I had to buy one for myself it would be the Kubota, but thats not to say that for each customer thats the right choice because we all value different things.

BotaGuy · Jun 25, 2004

I agree. I had a 4 foot bush hog on the back of a NHTC21d, and a Kubota B7500, neither had a loader but did have the full complemnet of front weights and loaded tires. In both cases I could pull wheelies going up my driveway, with the NH being the easiest to lift the wheels. My point is this, the bush hog did not overload the 3 advertised 3 point capacity...not even close, yet the dynamics of the small frame CUTS really do not allow you to use all of the load rating, so the load ratings become statistical annoyances that everyone agonizes over before they purchase. And Bob, while you say you can't recommend the Kubota, I find that I could never possibly recommend the articulated tracotrs that you offer to prospective purchasers for the fact that none of their implements cross over among other considerations.

Bob_Skurka · Jun 25, 2004

BotaGuy, bear in mind, I have a B2910 parked in my driveway as I write this, so I am NOT anti Kubota, in fact I really like them. However, for a Sub-CUT, I would only recommend a tractor that could take a standard, not an estate size, implement. And I said that was a personal choice.

I do totally agree with Neil that the question about the 3-pt is getting a bit more attention that it probably needs to get. If you don't use implements then it doesn't even matter if you have a 3pt, but if you have a 3pt, then I believe (again my personal opinion) that is should be able to handle standard implements.

As for your point that it is easy to put too big an implement on the rear of a TC21 or B7500, I think you will find my posts about my TC24 popping wheelies and needing front weights. But none of that has anything to do with the fact that the hitch on the BX is, and I will refer everyone to HENRO's several posts on the topic, smaller than normal.

I don't say don't buy BX machines, I simply say I won't recommend them because of that one issue. I welcome resonable disagreement and have no problem with anyone who does disagree (including the guy who lives across the street from me and loves his BX). But if you do disagree, and you want to argue the point, then offer up valid arguements of why a sub-standard sized, or limited sized hitch is better.

As for the articulated machines, I consider them to be pretty specialized for specialized applications and I do recommend that people consider them when they have an application that those are best suited for. And, just to set the record straight, several models of articulated tractors have Cat 1 3pt hitches on the back, in addition to their proprietary front mounts.

jhoward000 · Jun 25, 2004

I bought my BX2200 about a year ago (now with 108 hours). I have a couple of large Ford farm tractors as well. At first, the hitch on the BX2200 was very frustrating as I tried to hook up various implements. I have a lot of different implements for use around the farm and use the 3-point a lot. The BX2200 hitch spreads wide enough to fit any implement I have tried, it just doesn't go much wider than the implement, making it difficult to get over the ends of the pins.

After a while, I decided to try Pat's Easy Change. This virtually eliminated all my frustrations. Not only did it solve the problem of spreading the hitch arms, it made the overall geometry of the hitch much better. Everything lifts higher, the top-link has more space to do its job, etc. I couldn't be happier. It is now easier to attach implements to the BX than to the large farm tractors. I now want to get a set of these for the larger tractors.

The main pain that remained after the addition of Pat's Easy Change, were the turn-buckle stabilizers. My implements are of various widths, so I was always adjusting the turnbuckles. I recently added the slide adjustable stabilizer upgrade that has been so well documented in this forum - much better. With these two modifications, I think the BX must be about as easy to hook to CAT I 3-point implements as any tractor out there.

I guess I should say that I am not affiliated with Pat's Easy Change in any way. After using it for a while, I am simply a big fan. However, he did seem like a really nice guy when I placed my order.

An interesting (and related) thing happened when I was in my local Kubota dealership a few weeks ago to buy a new tiller for my BX. The guys in the shop had fitted the tiller on a BX so that they could cut the PTO shaft to the proper length. Luckily, the salesman and I went back to check their progress just before they made the cut. When I saw what they were doing, I told them that I had a quick-attach device on my 3-point hitch that would affect the needed length of the shaft. To my amazement, the salesman asked if it happened to be a Pat's Easy Change. I said yes, and asked him if he was familiar with it. He said they had been getting them in and putting them on some tractors. With this new knowledge, the shop guys slapped a set on their BX and remeasured for the shaft. I told him how pleased I was with the Easy Change. The salesman was interested in this because so far they had only installed them on very large tractors. I told him he should strongly recommend these to all of his BX customers.

After a year, I am extremely happy with my BX.

Bob_Skurka · Jun 26, 2004

jhoward000 . . . I totally agree with you about Pat's!!! Best money I ever spent on myself!

My dealer had my TC24 in to install a MMM and had never seen the Pat's system. I personally think if you can't get the extendable lower links (like on the B2910) then you NEED a Pat's easy change!