3rd Function Diverter pressure relief

[Redneck in training]

I have seen a tool, while looking at some German forestry site, for connecting and disconnecting quick couplers. It looked like channel lock pliers with a fork instead of a jaw that fits on the coupler. Squeezing the pliers connects the coupler even under full pressure.

 

[J_J]

It is difficult to believe that an average individual can not couple the QD's if they are a matching pair, and the temp is the same as when disconnected.

However difficulty is a relative valve.

Sometimes my hands do not function well due to things like arthritis, and it is a struggle to couple the QD's.

The QD coupling should be done with engine off

As you all know. the culprit is heat causing pressure to rise, and therefore making connection more difficult.

I simply press the male QD ball on a hard surface.

If the QD is on a cyl with a load, it is very hard to couple, as there is pressure generated by the load, plus heat.

For those that are having difficulty, there are QD's that couple under pressure. Some couple under low pressure and others at operating pressure.

I have suggested a tee and an on/off valve in series with the QD to release the pressure if necessary to make things equal. A needle valve would work to relieve any pressure.

Some QD from different manufacturers work fine, and some don't.

QD's with poppet against ball type QD sometimes work and others don't.






.

 

[Leejohn]

If this has been this way all along. This is just a guess maybe the valve only lets the back pressure relief one way. It wouldn't take just a few to change the hoses around on the valve. I'm thinking the in and out ports not the work ports. This is only coming from left field, and if you are 100% sure you are hooked up right forget this.

 

[Redneck in training]

I have seen a tool, while looking at some German forestry site, for connecting and disconnecting quick couplers. It looked like channel lock pliers with a fork instead of a jaw that fits on the coupler. Squeezing the pliers connects the coupler even under full pressure.

I can't find the site with tool mentioned above but found similar tool used for installation of sleeves on PEX tubing. It is the same idea.
RAUTOOL M-light

 

[dstig1]

Like I said, I took JJ's advice from earlier in the thread to finally solve it for good. I hoped the connect under pressure fittings would do it, and they do help - you get about a 50/50 chance of them working alone. When they don't then you use the pressure relief tool which is the old fittings on the piece of pipe as mentioned. That seems to break the pressure enough to solve it for sure. I decided not to do the needle valve method as I was more concerned that the valve could be left open or get knocked on during use. That method would surely work too.

Both my friend and I were totally unable to connect these fittings by hand previously. Neither of us is small or nor a weakling. The fact that it required more pressure than a bar clamp could provide is good evidence that it isn't us. I'm suite sure the solenoid is not allowing the pressure to release fully, though I don't know why. My guess is that it needs hydraulic pressure/flow to work right, so it just doesn't relieve when off.:confused3: When you apply pressure to the fitting with the bar clamp, it creates pressure in the system that then can be relieved by tripping the solenoid switch. You do that a couple times and it draws together a little bit each time until it finally clicks in (before these changes).

I know the concern with fluid heating up in the hoses in the sun. This is not the issue. All of these tests were done with the tractor in the shed with immediate disconnects/reconnects so there is no sun and no time for anything to really change and build pressure. It has to be the solenoid, I just don't know why. Maybe it is the design, or perhaps it is somehow defective, but it works just fine in use (grapple or plow angle moves like you'd expect). There is no way to connect it up wrong as it is just a pair of input ports and 2 pairs of output ports - one to the curl/dump, and one to the 3rd function. If it was connected wrong, something would either be moving backwards or it just wouldn't work at all.

I'd like to know why, as it is(was) very frustrating, but at least everything is now usable without a fight this way...

 

[Leejohn]

I know you guys have tried everything you can think of. Let me bring one other thing that might of been missed. I take it that you are useing the loader valve for the 3rd function. When you are moving the switch for the 3rd function just make sure you push the loader lever way to the right. 1st to the right is regen and 2nd the spool is then open to tank on dump. 1st to the right might not let the psi off of that line.

 

[dstig1]

Thanks for the thought, Leejohn, but I have it done both 1st and 2nd notches on the loader valve with the same effect (i.e: none).

 

[Guesseral]

Ok one last thought. Is there any possibility that the valve is not getting power when the key is in the on position, and that it only gets power when the engine is running? This would be possible if there were some kind of relay that was tied into the power circuit, so that no power were able to be utalized till there was an output from the alternator. This could be a reason why the pressure would not release if the key was on when the engine wasn't running because the valve wouldn't work no mater how many times you tried to release it. Now that being said I have no idea how your valve is wired or if it was wired by the dealer or you did it, or if you have already looked at this already, but if the valve works properly when the engine is running and doesn't (to releive pressure) when its not it would make sence. Usually when something doesn't work properly and you ahve exhausted all avenues to correct it it is something really simple! :confused3:

 

[dstig1]

Good thought, but not it. I wired it myself and it is a switched circuit so it is only on with the key on (engine running or not). So I always stop the engine, then turn the switch back on to activate the solenoid circuit. You can feel/hear it click, it just doesnt seem to relieve the pressure.

Thanks for tossing the suggestion out there. I appreciate it.

 

[Guesseral]

Well that's all I got!~

 

[Credit]

I was just wondering if for some reason you don't have the voltage necessary to really move the solenoid w/o the tractor running.

 

[Rustyiron]

My Kub. 9540 does just as described as well. It is in the tractor side, not the attachment. Moving the buttons on the (dealer installed) 3rd function does open the solenoids, you can hear the clikking, but the pressure is not relieved. Get out the wrench and break the fittings! PITA.
JJ, if your reading, all my stuff is "flat face" and the "push the center ball trick" can not be done on this type, what does this needle valve look like that you have mentioned? Like you said, it's prolly only a teaspoon of fluid that prevents normal coupling.

 

[J_J]

The needle valve mounts in a tee at the QD, and you release a little fluid to connect the QD's.

One other way is to plug the QD into a dummy QD with open end, just don't let it leak all you fluid out. Store above the source of the fluid.

Here is a needle valve , but they are not cheap, but will work. Actually any high pressure valve would work.

Surplus Center - 3/8 NPT 8 GPM PRINCE WNV-600 NEEDLE VALVE

 

[Rustyiron]

Thanks JJ, I guess that you'd just tee that valve into the line at a convienient point?
For the sake of keeping things as "tidy" as possible, do you know of a small inline type of valve that with a tiny schrader valve type type of thing. For that matter, I wonder what psi the best schrader valve can handle? Feel free to tell me I'm stupid:laughing: Sometimes I'm in the brush & sticks with either the tooth bucket or a root rake, things can get pretty ugly out there and those valves will find their way into trouble. As I'm typing & thinking, there is no reason that those valves you linked to could not go back on the loader arms at the connection between the hard lines and the hose where it main pivot is. That area is a much safer than out on the torque tube where the other connections are.

 

[dstig1]

Rusty, That is why I went JJ's idea #2 - a dummy QD on an open piece of pipe. I did this for the same reason - I was concerned about a valve getting caught and either damaged or opened during use. Besides, I only need to use it when changing implements so keeping the dummy unit with the attachments means it is right where it needs to be.

Credit - I doubt the voltage is the issue. If it has enough to reliably start the tractor (it does) then it is not short on voltage. Running voltage isn't that much more than battery voltage on a good batt.

 

[BryceSteiner]

I know this is an old thread but I have the exact same issue. I cannot connect one of the flat faced connectors to the third function. I can let the tractor sit for days without running and then maybe be able to connect. Otherwise you are out of luck. Very frustrating. I'm going to switch to the 1/2" pioneer connectors I have on the backhoe. Those are reliable and seem to be able to connect. if they are under pressure, it's just a matter of tapping the tip on the front of the male connector.

 

[Xfaxman]

I know this is an old thread but I have the exact same issue. I cannot connect one of the flat faced connectors to the third function.

This solved that problem for me on flat face connectors: Why are hoses hard to connect???

Also use it to connect the hoses together when not using the attachment:

 

[dstig1]

Resurrected! I don't put my grapple on much anymore but when I do the only way is using he relief tool and typically some help from a clamp. I made jaws for a pipe clamp similar to what Xfaxman shows that help. I was looking for a photo of it but no luck. I will try to take on this weekend and post it here. It makes instant sense once you see it, but harder to visualize describing it

 

[BryceSteiner]

thanks for the responses. I was going to make a tool like that but I was able to acquire the quick connects from summit and it has changed everything.

Summit Hydraulics sent me the .5" pioneer quick connects. I think they are the same as the rear remotes

1/2" Ag Hydraulic Quick Connect Couplers, Poppet Valve ISO 5675

1/2" Ag Hydraulic Quick Connect Couplers, Poppet Valve ISO 5675​ 1/2" Ag Hydraulic Quick Connect Couplers, Poppet Valve ISO 5675 - FREE SHIPPING

I received them yesterday from USPS (not sure how). Shipped Friday from Arizona. Weren't supposed to be here until Wed or Thurs.

I switched them out and wow! it works so much better. I can disconnect and reconnect with no issues on either one. Sometimes, even one handed.

The entire order for 2 m/f sets was $29.90 including shipping.

I don't know if that's useful for you or if everything is working fine. Too much frustration for me. When I did get them connected, then I couldn't get them disconnected after using. I would loosen the connector to the coupling for it to bleed a little pressure.