425 again…movement problems…

[Modrob]

Not trying to question Terry but I would want to check fluid in the lines to the motors for debris before ever connecting to a new rebuilt pump and potentially trashing it at startup. I suspect Terry knows this but he is playing with your nickels.

Yes Terry had covered all that from the beginning. I’ve learned he’s very thorough as well as having a great wealth of knowledge. And he wants to take care of his customers.

 

[2manyrocks]

We didn’t have a long conversation about it, but I believe it was easy to hear in his voice he was a bit saddened to see the condition this poor girl has come to in 24 years—it’s first 14-15 years it was pushed to its limits moving timber from the nearby woods—mostly hillsides, pushing, dragging, lifting, etc. Built nearly all of two homes with the lumber the late husband brought out and milled. Even the heavy metal that supports the rear wheel motors have fatigued to the point the wheels splay out some.
The poor motor has been run ragged as well—I’ve had to do a lot of work on it too. Honestly I think it’s just plain wore out…
So for about 2500 we would be back in the game, at least where we were before the movement issue started. Chancing the wheel motors and other systems on how long they might play along. Probably before long I’d think a new motor would have to be done…$$$$ and who knows…so we’ve been tossing around the idea of a new compact tractor—so many to choose from but all are a pretty big chunk of change. Hard to fathom 18 to 24 grand for a homeowner that uses a tractor for occasional projects. I really wished several times that our 425 had a heavier lift capacity and better digging ability. (We have lots of shale in our land)
It appears whatever we choose, it’s going to be a big chunk of change to have a tractor. (Note: I do have a 1950 IH T6 gas crawler/dozer that can really dig! But tears up a lot of ground and the wife would then tear up my arse…)

Sounds like the PT 425 was used instead of a skid steer. One way of looking at this is your wife's late husband has already gotten the money's worth using the PT425? $2500 for a pump. $2000? for a new engine. Then what else?

IMO, the question is whether a new PT425 fits your needs better than the other options like a new tractor. The PT425 is kind of a niche product that has a narrow turning radius and is low to the ground. I don't know of any similar 25hp farm tractors that could turn like a PT425 or be as stable.

If you already have other PT425 implements, that could be a cost savings instead of buying new tractor implements.

 

[ponytug]

Not trying to question Terry but I would want to check fluid in the lines to the motors for debris before ever connecting to a new rebuilt pump and potentially trashing it at startup. I suspect Terry knows this but he is playing with your nickels.

PT is very careful. They know their tractors well, and they do clean, pig, and flush their lines.

Yes Terry had covered all that from the beginning. I’ve learned he’s very thorough as well as having a great wealth of knowledge. And he wants to take care of his customers.

PT, and Terry, are very close to what their customers get into and experience with their machines. This isn't Deere, or Yanmar or Kubota. How many folks have the ability to have the company head of service on speed dial, and have that person be informed, helpful, and trying to do the best for the customer? I've tried to buy parts from him on occasion and he has not only told me to buy it elsewhere, but walked back into the stock area to get the exact part number.

I have faith that @Modrob and his tractor are in good hands.

All the best,

Peter

 

[2manyrocks]

I would listen carefully to Terry's recommendations. From my limited experience, he doesn't appear to make unnecessary recommendations.

You know what to expect with another PT425 based on your past experience with your PT425. I think they may be about the same machine then as today except for perhaps a wheel motor upgrade somewhere along the production history?

When the 20hp V twin kohler started giving me real trouble on my Terramite, I replaced it with a new Kohler engine after reading comments that rebuilds may not have that much life expectancy. Small air cooled gas engines seem to have a finite service life.

 

[MossRoad]

I'm fairly certain the newer models have better/bigger wheel motors and slightly higher lift as the 2001 model.

 

[Modrob]

Well… yesterday wife and I drove back down to Power Trac and picked up the “body” to bring home for its “memorial” service. No cremation or burial—will be on display for the visiting public to pay their respects. Instead of flowers donations can be made to the “fund for a new 425”…
But seriously, Terry and the gang are super folks. After he forklifted it onto our trailer, he showed me the destruction that occurred inside the pump…real ugly. On a brighter note, the sun started to come out about then, he took us to the showroom and showed us all the models and implements. Wow! What a place! I believe the wife was impressed so much she’s talking about getting a new unit. Actually I believe she’s convinced.
So, one door closes, but another will soon open. More to come in this adventure…LOL

 

[ponytug]

Good luck!

I remember the show room as being an amazing sight. The 1845 on a 45 degree slope table firmly set my respect for anyone who drives one on those kinds of slopes. 30 degree slopes are adrenaline inducing enough for me.

All the best,

Peter

 

[MossRoad]

I was only 3 hours from Tazewell the other day, but unfortunately I was on a layover in Charlotte.

Some day......

 

[Modrob]

Good luck!

I remember the show room as being an amazing sight. The 1845 on a 45 degree slope table firmly set my respect for anyone who drives one on those kinds of slopes. 30 degree slopes are adrenaline inducing enough for me.

All the best,

Peter

Yes sir—it is an amazing sight! Lots of great stuff, and well built. Heavy.
And I believe it’s “official”…when wife gets back from work in Detroit next week, she’s sure now she wants a new one. This time with a grapple-bucket and a post hole digger.

 

[Modrob]

I’ve been thinking again (oh no!)
Since the old 425 has been retired, I’m thinking of trying to use 2 of the wheel motors and adapting to my towable HF trencher/backhoe. It would be great to be able to move the backhoe around without having to hook up something to maneuver it around…
I’m sure I’d have to put a bigger pump on the backhoe (or maybe not, since the other functions won’t be in use while it’s moving? But I believe the current pump is 4.3 gal.—maybe not big enough? EDIT: new info says stick pump is 2.7 gal.) and probably another, or additional “spool”—(is that what it’s called?) to control the motors? I know very little about hydraulics but will be digging in to study up…
Of course that’s after getting the new 425 (wife is now convinced she wants a new one) What do you think?

 

[oldnslo]

If you have room to mount the motors they certainly should move the back hoe. Does it self balance or would you also need some stability wheels for self propelled feature to work?
How would you steer the unit?

You may need to add a provision to disconnect the motors so that it can be towed

 

[Modrob]

If you have room to mount the motors they certainly should move the back hoe. Does it self balance or would you also need some stability wheels for self propelled feature to work?
How would you steer the unit?

You may need to add a provision to disconnect the motors so that it can be towed
[/QUOTE
Let’s see…I would have to rig up/add/weld something to mount the motors to—maybe square tubing to use as an axle? It’s sort-of “self balancing” as it is…in tow mode the two short axles are inserted into a cross tube on the bucket end; the end with the motor has an extended tube with ball receiver mounted. If boom is pulled in for “stored mode” then the hitch end is easily lifted with one hand…in working mode, the axles are inserted into cross tube at the rear and then long stabilizers are put in place on bucket end. I’d reconfigure the current wheels to stay on bucket end but are able to be “rotated up” out of the way for stabilizers to slip in. The new wheels would be added at the back. So it would have 4 wheels on at all times. And I wouldn’t be using tow mode for any road travel—I don’t think it’s built hearty enough for that even though some folks do. After all, if it could move under its own power I wouldnt need to tow it.
Steering…hmmm…hadn’t thought that through enough I just realized Thanks! The one fellow on YT that I saw put those full swivel wheels in front of his, but noted they probably should be a little heavier. He steered by changing the flow to one or the other side motors…

 

[Modrob]

Sorry—somehow my answer was put inside the previous comment…

Let’s see…I would have to rig up/add/weld something to mount the motors to—maybe square tubing to use as an axle? It’s sort-of “self balancing” as it is…in tow mode the two short axles are inserted into a cross tube on the bucket end; the end with the motor has an extended tube with ball receiver mounted. If boom is pulled in for “stored mode” then the hitch end is easily lifted with one hand…in working mode, the axles are inserted into cross tube at the rear and then long stabilizers are put in place on bucket end. I’d reconfigure the current wheels to stay on bucket end but are able to be “rotated up” out of the way for stabilizers to slip in. The new wheels would be added at the back. So it would have 4 wheels on at all times. And I wouldn’t be using tow mode for any road travel—I don’t think it’s built hearty enough for that even though some folks do. After all, if it could move under its own power I wouldnt need to tow it.
Steering…hmmm…hadn’t thought that through enough I just realized Thanks! The one fellow on YT that I saw put those full swivel wheels in front of his, but noted they probably should be a little heavier. He steered by changing the flow to one or the other side motors…

 

[ponytug]

@Modrob since your old tractor had a hydraulic "meltdown / explosion", I think that every part of that system should be thought of as containing abrasive metal debris. If you do decide to use pieces (motors, hoses, cylinders, etc.), I would strongly encourage you to clean them out / run pigs through the hoses / disassemble and clean, before using, and install return filters on all hydraulic fluid coming from them, and I would install a magnetic trap like the one @SpringHollow made in the sump.

Personally, I do not think that the risk of destroying the new system by metal debris from the old is worth it, but that's your call. I have heard of it being done on other hydraulic systems, but those systems tend to have more filtration systems installed.

All the best,

Peter

 

[Modrob]

@Modrob since your old tractor had a hydraulic "meltdown / explosion", I think that every part of that system should be thought of as containing abrasive metal debris. If you do decide to use pieces (motors, hoses, cylinders, etc.), I would strongly encourage you to clean them out / run pigs through the hoses / disassemble and clean, before using, and install return filters on all hydraulic fluid coming from them, and I would install a magnetic trap like the one @SpringHollow made in the sump.


Personally, I do not think that the risk of destroying the new system by metal debris from the old is worth it, but that's your call. I have heard of it being done on other hydraulic systems, but those systems tend to have more filtration systems installed.

All the best,

Peter

Hmmmm…yep, good food-for-thought. And yes, I would ensure cleanliness of the motors. (I believe that those would be the only parts I’d use from the 425–otherwise I’m thinking they’re really expensive to buy new, and these will be just sitting there.)
Hmmm…maybe adding a small aux tank, pump system, etc and tie into the HF motor? But I guess that’s getting a little deep…seems so easy in my mind LOL

 

[MossRoad]

Hmmm.... If you don't have one already, now's a good time to get an extra quick attach plate for the 425 and weld a 2" receiver tube to it. Slip in a ball hitch, and weld a 2" hitch socket on the backhoe. Use that to move it longer distances around your place.

The 2" receiver tube on a QA plate is really handy for other things as well.

 

[2manyrocks]

If you get a new PT, I agree with MossRoad to use your 425 to move your BH around.

Also agree with Ponytug that there may be debris in your old 425 system.

 

[Modrob]

Hmmm.... If you don't have one already, now's a good time to get an extra quick attach plate for the 425 and weld a 2" receiver tube to it. Slip in a ball hitch, and weld a 2" hitch socket on the backhoe. Use that to move it longer distances around your place.

The 2" receiver tube on a QA plate is really handy for other things as well.

Yes we will likely purchase an extra quick attach plate. The backhoe already has a 1 7/8 hitch socket on it. I was using the 425 to haul it around—the previous owner had welded on a plate for a ball to mount in. I left it coupled up one day working the backhoe because I was having to move it frequently, and in one instance I got a little too rough and broke the welds. I welded it back on along with a couple of chain hooks and it did ok, but I didn’t trust my welds would hold up to any kind of roughness. So I’d go easy and pull the hoe around just to a new location or back to storage area.
Still, it would be so much less pain to have the ability to move the backhoe with its own power. After towing, I unhook, and using a crank jack I mounted on the tongue of the backhoe, raise it up just to make it steady . Then fire up the hoe, move bucket to one side to raise it, slide out wheel and axle shaft and carry to the back, then insert it into the rear axle tube. Then grab the two pieces of the stabilizer arm and install in bucket end axle tube. Drop that side, then swing bucket to other side and raise. Repeat the wheel and stabilizers movement. Then start digging. Many spots I’ve worked here haven’t been good for lots of room, so crab walking it around takes FOREVER. It would be so much easier to have the ability to move it on wheels. Of course it needs another set of wheels that “swivel up, pin, and out of the way” when working. Those extra wheels would swing down and lock in order to raise the stabilizers off the ground so those heavy things could stay in place. It ain’t no fun having to do the normal routine several times a day—hard on the spine.
But…

 

[Modrob]

If you get a new PT, I agree with MossRoad to use your 425 to move your BH around.

Also agree with Ponytug that there may be debris in your old 425 system.

Very true…

 

[2manyrocks]

Tempted to say the miva mc13 mini excavators are priced around $4200 in middle Tennessee from resellers who buy them at auction. You might find a better buy at auction and sell the HF.