861 diesel problems

[Soundguy]

the someone that put that spot weld on was the factory. that ball and spring setup adjusts relief pressure. more spring tension = higher relief pressure.

 

[MitchellB]

Whoops! Well, that screw is pretty much in the same location, except being held in place by loctite instead of a Willy the wonder-welder looking blob of metal. I thought to myself that little pea of weld could pop off inside my hydraulics. My little screwdriver pried it off pretty easily. It was just stuck to the metal with no penetration at all. The lift was strong before, so I'm gambling that it will be OK. ????

My used injectors came today. I think I'll wait and test them before taking them apart. I just put them in a bowl of diesel to soak. They look much better than the ones I had. These were supposed to have come from a Ford 4000 diesel, but they appear to be the same injector that I have. Sadly, no copper washer included.

Still waiting on my pressure tester, though. Best deal I could find was Diesel Injector Nozzle Tester Pop Pressure Tester Dual Scale Bar PSI Gauge | eBay, but it ships from India, so it may be a few days. It said air-freight, so I hope it ain't on a slow boat. It may not be worth a crap, but if it works for me this first time, I doubt I'll ever need it again.

 

[wmonroe]

I let my Kubota and my truck sit unused for up to three months at a time when I'm traveling for work and they always fire up just fine when I get home. It is always better to run a machine regularly but letting it sit isn't going to hurt it.

I was semi joking about the weights, didn't think you were going to sell them. (But I am interested if you ever decide to. Lol)

 

[MitchellB]

I bit of good news today, but I still backed up some before moving forward again.

My pop pressure injector tester arrived today. That was fast from India. I was anxious to try it out; first on my used 4000 Ford injectors I found on eBay. Well crappolla, the one nozzle fitting I needed to fit my injectors was leaking real bad. The guy in India who made up the 2 tubing adapters that came with this tester failed to braze the nipple on on one end (the end I needed) It was brazed only on one side, not all the way around and squirted fluid 2 feet when I first pumped it. However, I did have some brazing rods and luckily still had enough gas left in my torch set to finish brazing the tubing like it should have been done in India. It has been a long time since I had done any brazing and I wasn't too sure I could do this thin tubing without any practice, but someone must have been looking over my shoulder. (I wasn't anywhere near that red devil Ford when I did it either

I then tested the 4 used 4000 injectors and only 2 of them sprayed out of all 4 ports in the tip and they popped off at about 2000 to 2300lbs, except one that just dribbled and never built up any pressure at all. Then I took out my 861 injectors and tested them. 3 of the 4 sprayed out of all 4 nozzles in the tip and one injector tip was clogged up in 2 ports (this was after cleaning). Also, the pop pressure was about 2300 in 3 and 3000 in one. I finally figured out how to adjust the injector pressure after I figured out that the adjusting tips was frozen up inside all my injector tops. I had to carefully unscrew them from inside the cap top without damaging the threads and chase out the threads. Changed the clogged tip in one and was able to adjust all 4 good injectors to about 27-2800lbs. I'm not sure what this would have cost me if I just took my four injectors to someone to test, but I'm not sure they would have took the time to fix anything; just tell me I needed new injectors. All in all, I'm glad I bought the pressure tester and tested (repaired & adjusted) these before installing them. I'm learning something new all the time; on my own and from you guys here. Thanks. I still need to find 1 copper washer. I hate to do it, but I guess I'm going to have to break down and pay $5 at the Ford dealer for one washer as I haven't been able to find that size anywhere else yet and I'm ready to put this back together.

 

[Soundguy]

In the end, 5$ well spent to put this to bed, push emrods for the gasser red tigers are spendy too!

 

[MitchellB]

I'm gonna die of old age before I finish this red devil. I got the injectors in and the valves adjusted cold to .015. Engine was a bear to spin over by hand. I put some farm jacks behind the rear wheels with it in gear to help push the tractor forward as I turned the engine from the front to take some of the pressure off the crank pulley bolt that I'm using to turn crankshaft with. I'd also push down on the valve springs to take compression off the pistons when it started building up and getting tighter to turn.

However, when I went to time the engine/injector pump drive there are no numbers visible on the flywheel. I can occasionally see the light hash marks as I spin it, but no degree numbers. If they were ever there, they have worn off. Then to make matters worse the drive slot on top of the oil pump is 180 degrees off when I get flywheel close to my estimated 23 degrees BTDC #1 cylinder. Book says it simply twists and lifts out of oil pump shaft/cam gear to move, but it ain't budging and I can't get a grip on it to pull with any pressure. Even tried sticking a magnet to it to help lift it up. It was dark and started blowing cold rain in on me so I covered the engine up and give up for tonight.

 

[Soundguy]

hmm.. that one be a question for Rick B.

 

[MitchellB]

Y'all will have to pardon my rant from last night. I was pretty frustrated that I could not see any numbers stamped on the flywheel. Although cold today, I pulled the starter back off from the other side of the engine to look in there through a bigger hole to see if somehow more light would show up the numbers I could not find yesterday. What I discovered made me feel pretty stupid. My book shows the hash marks and numbers on the face of the flywheel facing toward the front of the tractor. Like I said, the hash marks are there, but no numbers. To my surprise (and pleasure) there are also hash marks and the elusive numbers I been trying to find stamped on the outside surface facing to the side away from the tractor around the face plate of the flywheel gear. I could see them plain as day from the hole where the starter goes and marked the flywheel with a marker and turned the engine to 23o BTDC as it is supposed to be. However, I still have to get the pump drive gear shaft out and turn it 180o to time the fuel pump correctly. I hope it also proves to be my lack of experience that makes that sucker pop out and rotate easier than it seemed to want to move last night. I have been volunteered to do grandson watching today, so I had to quit early, but plan to get this fuel pump on and timed correctly before the weekend is over. After that, it should be simple bolt on's to finish this out.

 

[wmonroe]

Good luck getting it wrapped up. Hopefully it will be purring away soon.

 

[MitchellB]

Feeling like I may be on the downhill side of this refub at last. I got the fuel pump drive gear out and turned it in time; installed the fuel pump and got it timed in the window marks; installed the side and valve cover; made a battery hold down bracket; even began to put the fuel tank back on, however that front bolt is in a cramped spot for my fat hands to reach above the valve cover. It will have to wait until it warms up some tomorrow.

 

[Soundguy]

Sounds like home stretch!

 

[wmonroe]

Almost there. Did you get to do a test run today?

 

[kf4uda]

Personally, I can't hardly wait for a video of this old tiger purring like a kitten. Sounds like it might be coming soon...hint

 

[MitchellB]

No test run yet, although I probably could have. I got the fuel tank bolted in. I had to push the bolt up against the front tank bracket with a long flat bar in one hand while I held a long wrench with 2 fingers turning the bolt to get that bolt started. I got my sheet metal on (that was tricky by myself) and hood (still got to line the hood up) today. Got my headlamps wired back up to the light switch. Decided I better put a couple pop rivets through my $4 Red Tiger emblem I found on eBay that is taking the place of the missing Ford cyclops medallion to keep the sticky tape from letting go before I hoisted that sheet metal in place. Repainted my front bumper (from my 8N) where I had rewelded cracks at the bracket that holds it to the axle. I ran the copper oil pressure line and some other electrical wires in plastic wire loom to protect them somewhat.

I plan to go out tomorrow and get some diesel fuel and new antifreeze. I hope to have the grill, shroud and bumper on tomorrow and install my battery. I also want to double check my clutch adjustment. I picked up an I&T manual a few days ago and while it is tiny compared to the other Ford manual I had, it gives several clear and easy to understand procedures that in my other book just seems harder for me to comprehend for some reason. I think the clutch is close, but I want to measure as in the description to be sure. Pictures and videos (like I have found online) make more sense to me than reading a thick manual.

It is starting to LOOK like the tractor it was.

 

[Soundguy]

nice!

 

[MitchellB]

Tomorrow should finish me up. I got my grill, grill trim, lower guard and 8N bumper installed. Also got the intake, oil bath air cleaner, and exhaust stack mounted. Made up 2 long bolts for my battery hold down and got the battery in.

Bought fuel and antifreeze and filled up the fuel tank and as much antifreeze/mix as it would hold cold. readjusted my clutch freeplay but the peddle height was about right. Began bleeding my fuel system and whoa, I had a bad leak somewhere around my new fuel filter. Come to find out the top rubber gasket ring was not sealing to the filter, so I RTV the rubber to the filter. That cured that.

I could not find a bleed screw on the pump, but I cracked the input line and was good to there. The injector lines were still all loose, so I tried cranking the engine to see if I could bleed those. Well, although I had the battery hooked up to a China Freight trickle charger all this time, it was very weak and I had to get my big battery charger hooked up. After some time, the lines all show fuel dribbling out so I tightened them all down. I think my battery is really too small for a diesel. Moment of truth. After some more charging time, I tried cranking her up. Even the heaters did not let her fire up. I went to get my starter fluid, but I was out. Getting dark and cold, but I went to the parts store for some Starter fluid anyway. I was determined to get this to fire or blow something up trying tonight. First shot of starter fluid did not do anything. Tried another shot and I could hear an awful banging noise. I wasn't sure if it was starter fluid exploding or metal banging, but she eventually fired and sputtered to life belching blue smoke. Even with the open ends of my carport cover it was choking me sitting high up on the tractor. She wasn't exactly purring, but eventually she smoothed out to a steady rattle knocking as diesels are prone to do I suppose. My oil pressure was steady at 40 lbs. at idle. I never did race the engine much because I was waiting for it to warm up first, so I could top of the radiator fluid. I guess I'm too impatient because it barely began to move the temp gauge when I noticed a small puddle of oil forming on my right. I was not sure at first where this was from, so I shut it down to do a walk around. Turns out I was getting some splash from the rear hydraulic pump drive gear. It was cold and dark, so I stopped while I was ahead.

Tomorrow I need to install my hydraulic pump and top off my radiator. I ordered a pressure gauge from eBay ($10) and I thought I would mount it permanently on my hydraulic pump. I was reading in my book that you can screw a gauge into the bleed screw to test the release valve and thought, why not just mount a gauge there permanently if they are not too expensive. I got volunteered again to do grandson watching duty tonight and tomorrow (I guess school is out), so I don't know if I'll get much done till Wednesday. I'm feeling pretty good about that

 

[kf4uda]

I just have to say that you are a confident man by putting all that tin and stuff back on before even a test run but apparently confidence has paid off. :thumbsup: Glad to hear she fired up for you.

 

[TomSeller]

I agree. Excellent job staying with this. The old girl runs !!! I love the old iron.

 

[Soundguy]

nice deal! got her running.

 

[MitchellB]

I was able to get the hydraulic pump on today.

The old girl fired right up without using the glow plugs (heaters) or starter fluid. Air temperature was a comfortable mid-60s though. The arms lifted, but shuttered as it raised, but that may be because I had forgot I left the plug on top of the pump loose or it was the first couple pumps up and down. I drove it around the yard to warm it up a couple laps before I noticed some leaks, so I parked it again. Tighten the pump plug up, but the main leaks were coming from the fuel cap and fuel sending unit, so I removed them both and dried the metal lips. I cut a temporary leather ring seal for my fuel cap and RTVed the sending unit back in the top of the tank. I knew the new sending unit the original owner installed leaked some, but never noticed how bad it was until it was full of fuel sloshing around today. I’ll see if I can’t find a new replacement fuel cap.

Oil pressure is still holding fine at 40+ and I topped off the radiator again. I’m concerned though because my book claims the radiator holds 3.75 gallons, but I only was able to put in about 2.75 gallons of new fluid in so far. I’ll check it again after I run it some more.

I plan to hook up my scrape blade to it tomorrow and pull a few leaves out of the yard into the woods and give it a mild test run again. My hydraulic gauge should be in the eBay mail.

Another thing I noticed after my RPM gauge was hooked up to the pump and working today. I think this engine was running/working much harder before my rebuild to achieve the same RPM setting on the proof meter than it is now. Not knowing much about diesels when I bought this tractor seemed to run OK to me, but I had little diesel experience to judge it by. I remember I seemed to push the throttle further down to reach PTO speed when I was mowing with it. As a matter of fact, I mowed that first time with the proof meter needle straight up, not all the way to PTO speed. Now to reach the same RPM, the throttle lever is not nearly as far down as before, and the engine just seems to be relaxed without the vibration I remember it had before.

Although I’m not a happy camper about having to sink more money into a new (to me old) tractor, I’m hoping I’ve ended up with a machine that will last my lifetime without major engine problems again and out work my little 8N that I’ve maintained for the past 15 years. Thanks to all who helped with advice and encouragement. If luck holds, tomorrows test run and follow up should put an end to this thread.