A backwards disk chisel, (chisel disk?) to make food plots

[AntiqueIron]

Howdy folks, new to the site, seasoned to the seat.

I live where the primary crop grown is rocks. Corn country but the rock piles are frequent and deep around fields. Below 6” it’s digging with a spud bar and after about 18” it turns into shale.

Looking to make a couple new food plots this summer. In the past a buddy came over with his hydrostatic John Deere and a rototiller but it was always really rough on that setup. I also have been starting to drink the no-till koolaid recently.

A recent conversation with a soil conservation advocate that I had taught me that there are certain instances where optimal planting requires non virgin ground and rocky soil tends to promote that.

I am in particular looking to plant clover on an old clearing, so my thought was to brush hog the growth and till about 4-6” deep, just enough to break up the surface rocks and old root matter.

I have my doubts about a conventional disk having enough gusto to go through that kind of ground. So I thought of making my own with a spring trip scarifier bar in the front of sorts. This would break up the crust, create some downforce for the disc blades and if I set them up in a V hopefully I can eject the larger rocks before they go through the discs and wreck stuff. In short a backwards disk chisel, to break virgin ground with the least amount of soil disturbance necessary.

For technical info I’d be running 10 rippers with spring trips made from snow plow trip springs, a 8 foot 2 gang toothed disk, single row, and pulling the whole setup with my 5000 ford. It would be made from scratch with the exception being I may see about finding an old worn disk to cannibalize for the cost savings.

I can’t seem to find anything about this being done, which has me wondering if it’s not a good idea. What do yall think?

 

[oldnslo]

Are there and old disk chisels in your area? They would have straight disks in front of chisel or ripper shanks. I would be concerned about grass, weeds, etc wrapping and plugging the ripper shanks unless brush hog really chews up everything.

We run a Case IH 870 ecolo-tiger disc ripper on corn stalks and it occasionally plugs even with two rows of discs in front of the ripper shanks.

You could then use your tandem disks to break up the sod even further.

My experience with disc ripper and chisel plow is they will pull up rocks and are typically challenging to run that shallow but being custom made you can probably adjust entry angle of ripper shanks to be correct at that shallow depth.

wishing you the best in finding a solution

 

[AntiqueIron]

Are there and old disk chisels in your area? They would have straight disks in front of chisel or ripper shanks. I would be concerned about grass, weeds, etc wrapping and plugging the ripper shanks unless brush hog really chews up everything.

We run a Case IH 870 ecolo-tiger disc ripper on corn stalks and it occasionally plugs even with two rows of discs in front of the ripper shanks.

You could then use your tandem disks to break up the sod even further.

My experience with disc ripper and chisel plow is they will pull up rocks and are typically challenging to run that shallow but being custom made you can probably adjust entry angle of ripper shanks to be correct at that shallow depth.

wishing you the best in finding a solution

Good thoughts all around.

I’d be brush hogging right close to the ground. Usually 3” is plenty height for me lest there’s a lot of surface rocks. Surprisingly this hasn’t been too much a problem.

I guess pulling the rocks up is my goal, in order to protect the discs.

The rippers wouldn’t be down any deeper than the disks, probably I’d use box blade rippers.

Good thought on the double pass idea- I did a plot for a neighbor a while back using the rippers on a box blade to yank rocks but it was incredibly hard going without the trip feature.

I’ve wondered about a chisel plow but those seem like they run too deep for what I’d need.

Good idea on the used disk chisel. I’ll keep my peepers open for a 7 footer

 

[oldnslo]

Been awhile since been around a disc chisel but I believe some models had an adjustable height tongue so that you could get them running level at different depths or tractor draw bar height. I would suggest looking for that feature since you want to run shallow.

May also be option to remove a couple shanks if you find 9 ft at reasonable price.

Depending on rocks could also pull 3 - 14” bottom mold board plow with either trip beam or spring reset. Should be able to 14” bottom 5 - 6” deep. That would turn all the ground and then couple passes with tandem disc should leave surface ready to plant.

Chisel plows and sod usually lead to a very rough ride trying to disc the clods left behind.

 

[airbiscuit]

What about making something with Danish S Tines?

Mine buries itself about 6" down, and really fluffs up the soil. I follow that with a disc and drag.

 

[paulsharvey]

So, I understand what your trying to do, but is there a good reason you don't chisel/cultivate, and then just run a conventional disc, with the gangs set pretty mild? The All purpose plow/field cultivator/spring chisel plow, should do what you need, and then the disc can be used to smooth/level, or to cover the seed after the fact. It might be of value to fabricate a basket roller for behind the disc?

How are you seeding?

 

[paulsharvey]

Our soils are very different, but people around me use a disc as primary tillage for food plots, so used 6 ft (5/6/7) ft discs are in high demand used. Once you get 8/9/10/12, they often are in no man's land size, to large for home owners, to small for ag, and if your willing to drive a couple hundred miles, an 8/10/12 is often cheaper than a 6.

So, with that, I was able to get a 7 ft spring chisel for $100, as they aren't popular, and it did a fantastic job on my old sandy over grazed pasture. Ran it around about 5 times over everything, then drove over it all for a little bit of soil firming, and then drop seeded by rye, and ran chisel at like 1" deep over it all to cover the seed.

 

[paulsharvey]

The spring chisel also tends to bring roots (and i would assume rocks, but that depends on size of rocks) to the surface, where they can be picked up.

 

[AntiqueIron]

M

So, I understand what your trying to do, but is there a good reason you don't chisel/cultivate, and then just run a conventional disc, with the gangs set pretty mild? The All purpose plow/field cultivator/spring chisel plow, should do what you need, and then the disc can be used to smooth/level, or to cover the seed after the fact. It might be of value to fabricate a basket roller for behind the disc?

How are you seeding?

Currently I have no true tillage equipment, so whatever equipment I decide on is going to need purchased.

My thought is that my chisel disc idea could be built for 2 grand or less and it’s only 1 implement to store. I found a chisel plow for 1100 new, and I suppose I could get by with that and my York rake. Though I’ll certainly lose a lot of soil with the rake trying to remove weeds. I’ve done it in the past but results were mediocre.

I’d also have a lot of problems trailering a disc down the logging roads on my land and I’ve been told a 3 point just doesn’t have the downforce to rip ground.

Seeding wise I usually just broadcast onto the tilled soil and cultipack.

I guess my hope was to make a small footprint implement that could do a one pass till, with the minimum necessary soil disturbance needed to loosen the ground for root growth and weed removal. So I suppose the a somewhat better question is, does such a tool already exist, that doesn’t cost 30k?

Thank you all for your time and insights. I’m learning a lot here!

 

[oldnslo]

A heavy 3 point disc will cut as good as a pull type if you have enough tractor to lift the weight

Not knowing how rocky and size of rock a heavy offset disc will cut sod but may not like the rocks if they are big and solid in the ground.

Not sure if there is a single implement that will do what you want.