Adding Aux Hydraulics to a Mahindra 4110

[Dougster]

Does the 4110 give you enough hydraulic power to run the 509 off the auxillary remotes? I know a lot of people are running the hoe off a separate PTO powered pump.

Hi Keith. So far so good with the 509, but ask me again next month after I've tried to remove an oak stump!

I've already got the dealer's price for adding a PTO-driven pump, but he is not recommending it unless I desire more backhoe "speed." He says if I am only looking for additional digging power to forget it. He says it will only increase my digging power by about 15%. His words... not mine. Then again... when you think about it... 15% is nothing to sneeze at!

It is a costly little upgrade, and I really need a bunch of other things first (like this grapple bucket et al)... so I'm guessing that unless there is a real deficiency apparent with those stumps, I will put it off until "if and when" I become profitable.

Dougster

 

[Dougster]

I assume you have 2 connectors exclusively for the backhoe and 2 connectors for the lever controlled rear remote. If you disconnect the backhoe do you you have to jumper the two backhoe specific connectors together? OR do you have to do something specific when the backhoe is connected or disconnected like move a lever or something? I am just trying to determine how your backhoe is plumbed as there are several different ways of doing it and your options will vary depending on how the backhoe pb is plumbed.

Hi Mad. I'm back home now and had a chance to go through the manuals again and examine the Beast very carefully against the manuals. The manuals (and some separate spec sheets) all say I should have "rear remotes"... but there is nothing there in back except those two ports that are connected to the 509. Apparently those "remotes" I read about were an option that didn't come on my machine... or were taken off by the dealer to accommodate the addition of the 509. I just don't know.

I misunderstood you earlier about the levers. Sorry. There are no levers for the rear remotes because there are no remotes! I see that now. Earlier, I thought you had meant the 3pt controls. Those are the controls they told me would have no effect while the 509 was being powered. Now that makes sense based on what you've pointed out to me.

As far as I was told... to disconnect the backhoe, I simply relieve system pressure and remove the two hoses from the ports. They are attached with quick disconnect connectors. Then I put the dust caps in place. I think that is it. There is no jumper and I don't believe there is a lever to throw.

Once again Mad, many thanks for your help. It's obvious from other threads I've found that you are THE MAN when it comes to hydraulics. I appreciate you taking the time to help a flaming newbie.

Dougster

 

[jpm]

doug your rear remotes are powering the 509,there should be a 3rd lever on your right side behind your 2 3pt levers,locked open so pressure is flows only 1 way though your hoe.The pto pump is much better than the on board hyds.

 

[Dougster]

doug your rear remotes are powering the 509,there should be a 3rd lever on your right side behind your 2 3pt levers,locked open so pressure is flows only 1 way though your hoe.The pto pump is much better than the on board hyds.

You're absolutely right. Once again, I got it wrong. Holy Cow!!! Thank you for setting me straight.

There is one unlabled lever behind the seat on the right that is held firmly in position by a bolt and hook arrangement so that it can't be thrown. I failed to connect it with the rear remote because the pictures in the manual show two levers and two rear remotes (A&B) if you have that "exterior hydraulics" option. Obviously, I've only got one set... hence one lever.

So I do have one set of rear remotes... not two (A&B) sets... albeit locked in one position apparently in order to use with the 509. Where does this leave me with the FEL grapple bucket? Can I use the "V&M Add-A-Valve" that Mad had shown me? Or does the 509 require that the lever be locked in position such that the V&M Add-A-Valve won't really help me?

Asking the question a different way: Can I unbolt and free up that rear remote lever so I can use it to control the grapple via a V&M Add-A-Valve ... and just make darn sure it is in the correct position when I switch the V&M Add-A-Valve over to the 509? Or is that too risky and/or not going to work?

Yes, the PTO hydraulic pump would solve all this rather quickly... and give me some added BH power too. At $1,395 for the Mahindra/Bradco kit, it seems expensive until you figure that it could save me from buying and installing an extra control valve for the new grapple. My dealer offered me another brand of PTO pump at half the price, but it sounded like a less than perfect replacement.

Anyone have a picture of the Mahindra PTO pump for the 509... installed or otherwise? How much added complexity and time will there be to removing/reinstalling the backhoe? Is it any noisier or quieter than using the onboard hydraulics?

Dougster

 

[mlitt12345]

here is my 4110 with homemade grapple......and I bought the toothbar, you will have to beef up the upper lip and top of the bucket or it will bend, I used 3/8 flat stock on mine, I'm also using my rear remote for grapple function, let me tell you the grapple definitely comes in handy for brush-debris cleanup....you can also see more pics and closeups in member photos section of forum just enter my screen name mlitt12345 in the search box......good luck with the grapple.....mlitt12345

 

[Dougster]

here is my 4110 with homemade grapple......and I bought the toothbar, you will have to beef up the upper lip and top of the bucket or it will bend, I used 3/8 flat stock on mine, I'm also using my rear remote for grapple function, let me tell you the grapple definitely comes in handy for brush-debris cleanup....you can also see more pics and closeups in member photos section of forum just enter my screen name mlitt12345 in the search box......good luck with the grapple.....mlitt12345

Hi Mlitt12345. Thanks for posting those pix and the description of your arrangement (especially the reinforcement details). That is one SWEET looking homemade grapple! Darn thing looks about as stock as stock could get! Want to sell it???

I love the tooth bar too. It completes the look and must enhance the functionality too. I will be sure to check out your other pix. Incidentally, after seeing a few badly bent tops on Mahindra FEL buckets, I was thinking of reinforcing the top edge anyway... but I was thinking angle iron (or even C-channel to get that front drop edge) for maximum stiffness/strength. Is that not a good idea?

Dougster

 

[Keith_B]

Yes, the PTO hydraulic pump would solve all this rather quickly... and give me some added BH power too. At $1,395 for the Mahindra/Bradco kit, it seems expensive until you figure that it could save me from buying and installing an extra control valve for the new grapple. My dealer offered me another brand of PTO pump at half the price, but it sounded like a less than perfect replacement.

Anyone have a picture of the Mahindra PTO pump for the 509... installed or otherwise? How much added complexity and time will there be to removing/reinstalling the backhoe? Is it any noisier or quieter than using the onboard hydraulics?

Dougster

$1395 sems kind of pricey to me for a PTO pump and reservoir.

Northern Tool sells the Prince PTO pump for $399 Prince PTO Tractor Pump 11.4 GPM, Model# HC-PTO-2A | Pumps | Northern Tool + Equipment

A 12 gallon reservoir, which is more than sufficient to run your backhoe and just about anything else you would want, runs around $100, smaller reservoirs are cheaper. Northern Industrial Tools Steel Hydraulic Oil Tank — 12 Gallon | Tanks + Reservoirs | Northern Tool + Equipment

By the time you get all the fittings, filters, etc. you are looking at half the price of the Bradco setup.

Going with this option will give you plenty of power for your hoe, without decreasing the hydraulic output for your loader, or use your remotes, in the event you want to operate the loader and hoe at the same time (comes in handy in those times of need when you are trying to get as level as possible or get stuck).

 

[Keith_B]

here is my 4110 with homemade grapple......and I bought the toothbar, you will have to beef up the upper lip and top of the bucket or it will bend, I used 3/8 flat stock on mine, I'm also using my rear remote for grapple function, let me tell you the grapple definitely comes in handy for brush-debris cleanup....you can also see more pics and closeups in member photos section of forum just enter my screen name mlitt12345 in the search box......good luck with the grapple.....mlitt12345

That is a nice looking grapple!! What was the build cost, if you don't mind me being nosey?

The upper lip of the bucket is definitely in need of beefing up. I bent mine when I raised the bush hog up, while it was on the back of another tractor. The tailwheel bound on the bucket and I had a chain hooked to the hog on the center hook. I figured I'd get a piece of 3/8 thick angle and reinforce it.

 

[Dougster]

$1395 seems kind of pricey to me for a PTO pump and reservoir.

Oh absolutely! I'm sure it's megabucks extra for the Mahindra/Bradco brand and the custom components/fit/color/etc. My dealer is not exactly inexpensive either. Every single Mahindra part and accessory is priced out at full list plus labor... zero discounts so far. As I've said before, I think he would give you the tractor at cost if he could sell you everything else at full list plus labor. But in his defense, he did offer me a leftover pump of a different brand for much less. Still, he wanted to set it up with the Mahindra tank and other Mahindra/aftermarket parts that would have raised the price right back up there again with all the labor to fit and assemble. God only knows what I would have ended up with.

By the time you get all the fittings, filters, etc. you are looking at half the price of the Bradco setup. Going with this option will give you plenty of power for your hoe, without decreasing the hydraulic output for your loader, or use your remotes, in the event you want to operate the loader and hoe at the same time (comes in handy in those times of need when you are trying to get as level as possible or get stuck).

Maybe with some luck and patience, I can find the Mahindra kit (new or slightly used) at some more reasonable price. I'm sure I'd be happy with the BH power boost... not so sure about that issue of speed boost (this newbie likes a SLOWER BH for now, thank you)... and I save the cost and mounting complexity of a new grapple control valve. Still, I need to understand the difficulty/complexity/time added to BH removal and reinstallation every time I want to use the 3-pt hitch. That could end up happening a lot. I'm betting there will be times when 3-pt hitch work will outnumber FEL/BH jobs two or three to one!

Ideally, the whole arrangement is supported off the removable portion of the BH frame so it all could come off in one piece with the BH... but I'm not at all sure that is the case.

Dougster

 

[mlitt12345]

That is a nice looking grapple!! What was the build cost, if you don't mind me being nosey?

The upper lip of the bucket is definitely in need of beefing up. I bent mine when I raised the bush hog up, while it was on the back of another tractor. The tailwheel bound on the bucket and I had a chain hooked to the hog on the center hook. I figured I'd get a piece of 3/8 thick angle and reinforce it.

Yes 3/8 angle will work fine for reinforcing the bucket lip, I used flat stock because it was some I had left over from another project....A friend of mine helped me build it, the biggest expense was the fittings, hoses (long run from rear remote) and hyd cylinder.....the steel was mostly left over from other projects mostly flat stock and square channel......I did have to add a orifice inline to slow the grapple down it was too fast without it.......total price $350-400 give or take, can't remember exactly but much cheaper then a store bought grapple and alot lighter then a root grapple bucket.......mlitt12345