Air compressors?

Molerj · Jul 20, 2001

OK, now for air compressors. I am in need of a larger one. I have an old 1 hp that I bought
new but it is now undersized for my use. Suggestions; single stage, two stage, oiless (I
hate the noise of the oiless) ? I use it for a little bit of everything. I do lawn mower repairs as a side hobby
push & riders, (sometimes I wonder why) & use air tools for a lot of disassemble, reassemble. Also have
painted a few of my tractor projects (154 cub lo-boy & economy power king). I kind of
was thinking of a 60 gallon ingersoll rand single or two stage. I know the price of the two
stage is alot more, but then again it works alot easier & it probably would be the last one
I would buy. Also I was looking at prices in the Northern tool book & they sure vary alot
from what book you look at. A friend of mine gets a dealer book & their prices are different
too.

Bird · Jul 20, 2001

Molerj, if you'll go to the "Search" function near the top of the screen and search "All Forums" for the words "air compressor", you'll find a lot of discussion about them. I have a little sideline business of repairing automotive air tools, and of course, I've worked on just a few compressors as well, and have owned a variety of compressors over the years.

Now, it sounds as if you're going to use yours a lot, so stay away from the oiless (not only noisy, but if you run it for over 10 minutes at a time, you'll be rebuilding it every 6 to 8 months like I did when I owned one). I think you have started in the right direction for your shopping.

I'd recommend a 60 gallon tank, 230 volt, minimum of 10 cfm (preferably more), single stage (two stage is even better, but too expensive, in my opinion, unless you have a need for more than 120 psi), cast iron - not aluminum, and my strong preference is for the V-twin vs. inline cylinders (no scientific proof but I'm confident they cool better), and as big and deep a crankcase as possible. I tend to more or less ignore horsepower ratings on electric air compressor motors because they can be very misleading. Ingersoll Rand is a fine product, but you can very likely find cheaper ones that'll last a lifetime.

My personal compressor meets all the requirements listed above (and has a sight glass to check oil level). It's a Puma for which I paid $600 when it was on sale about 3 years ago.

Bird

MChalkley · Jul 20, 2001

Bird - As it so happens, I was considering purchase of a Coleman 27 gal vertical on wheels, 125 psi working pressure, 5.6 cu. ft. @90 psi, direct drive, 115v, 15A. The motor, compressor, and tank all have "Made in USA" on them. It's at Costco for $230. But it's oilless. I didn't realize they were prone to problems. Bummer... Is that inherent to the oil-less design? Or is it an implementation problem?

MarkC

Molerj · Jul 20, 2001

Thanks Bird. Not familiar with the Puma but I'll check around. If I remember right the IR
was around $550-600. Great board. I just found it this week. Can't get enough of it.

Bird · Jul 20, 2001

Mark, the oiless compressors work fine and last several years for home use to occasionally air up a tire or blow the dust out of something. I'm not familiar specifically with that Coleman, but believe it's the same as the Craftsman/DeVilbiss. Doesn't it have that nice cowling covering both the motor and the compressor. I've always said the cowling serves two purposes: (1) it hides the compressor because if you saw what you were getting you would't buy it (a very thin, teflon coated aluminum cup for the cylinder and a flat aluminum disk for a piston - as the teflon wears off they get noisier all the time), and (2) it contains the parts when they blow apart (really gets noisy when the squirrel cage turns loose). Look at the manual and see if it doesn't warn you to not run it for more than 10 minutes. The only good thing I can say about them is that they are cheap and you can completely rebuild it in less than an hour for less than $60./w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif When the reed valves break from the heat - only about $13-$14, and if you have the Craftsman models, they even have two repair kits available, one includes the crankshaft, the other does not.

Bird

Anonymous Poster · Jul 20, 2001

Mark, I bought the Coleman you described. A local farm store went under and mark everything down 50%, got their price in writing and went to Lowes for an additional 10% off. That REALLY p%ssed off the Lowes store manager. Good thing they sold it to me, when I went back to the farm store the other one was gone.

It has been a good unit, used it to help my brother in law roof 3 houses, did all the trim work in the house we built and have blown up numerous flat tires. It recoveres quick enough but it is noisy as stated in another posting. The good point to oilless is the weight if you're moving it around, no cast iron sleeve which of course is another downside of oilless.

My 2 cents worth.

MChalkley · Jul 20, 2001

Bird, I don't remember a "nice cowling" - it looked pretty homely to me... /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif. Here it is: http://www.colemanpowermate.com/products.asp?Type=compressor&Model=CL0502710. Is that the one? I didn't think the compressor looked all that cheesy, myself, but I'm not an expert on compressors. That's why I asked. Whadaya think?

MarkC

Bird · Jul 21, 2001

Mark, I don't claim to be an expert myself, and unfortunately, I'm not familiar with that Coleman and can't tell enough about it from the picture. It does look like it might be a little better than the Craftsman/DeVilbiss, but I just don't know. The place where I bought my current compressor is a dealership/factory authorized service for a number of brands, besides building their own, and their service man told me that you could normally expect any of the oiless compressors to last approximately one-tenth as long as one with oil in the crankcase. Now properly maintained, and with the oiless never running more than 10 minutes at a time and plenty of time to cool in between, he was talking 1,000 hours vs. 10,000 hours. A really good compressor costs more, but it sure doesn't cost 10 times as much as the oiless. On the other hand, if you can get 1,000 hours out of one and rebuild it for $40 to $65, maybe it's a good deal. And then again, I'm sure I probably never got 500 hours between rebuilds on mine.

Bird

MChalkley · Jul 21, 2001

Bird - Well, as Rosann Rosannadanna of Saturday Night Live fame used to say "Ne-e-e-ver mind..." I think I'll pass. I'm not the gambling type, especially not when I've been warned, and I'm not too keen on making plans to rebuild an air compressor before I even buy it, nor do I think it would be worth the money to ship it to Texas to have it rebuilt. /w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif

If any of you guys see any nationally advertised deals on a decent one, please keep me posted.

MarkC

JOR_EL · Jul 21, 2001

If any of you guys see any nationally advertised deals on a decent one, please keep me posted.


Mark, if you haven't seen it already, you might be interested in this post, and Bird's answer to it.

Larry

http://www.tractorbynet.com/cgi-bin...ment&Number=56167&page=&view=&sb=&part=3&vc=1

JOR_EL · Jul 21, 2001

My personal compressor meets all the requirements listed above (and has a sight glass to check oil level). It's a Puma for which I paid $600 when it was on sale about 3 years ago.

Bird, I just found this compressor on the Harbor Freight website (2nd page of compressors):
34887-1VGA
PUMA 6 HP, 60 GALLON AIR COMPRESSOR
$499.99

Does this sound like the one you have?

Thanks,

Larry

Anonymous Poster · Jul 21, 2001

...Well, as Rosann Rosannadanna of Saturday Night Live fame used to say ...

Now, she was definitely a hoot... /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

M. Sullivan · Jul 21, 2001

Suggest looking at Quincy. Got one last year, 5 hp, 50gal, cast iron pump for $550. Did the research and they appear by far the best. 2 stage not needed unless you want to paint commercially, run a commercial sandblaster.

Definately stay away from oiless. They are designed to use the bits of material (magnesium ) that wear off the rings and pistons as lubrication!! That's why they get louder; the piston and rings are sacrificial and get smaller and smaller until rebuild time or garbage can.

Good luck.

Bird · Jul 21, 2001

Larry, that's very interesting, and very close to mine. It says that's a model PK6060V and mine is a model PP6060V, made in '98. Harbor Freight's model says 115 psi, mine says 120 psi, theirs says 12.9 cfm at 40 psi and 11.4 at 90 psi and mine says 14.16 cfm with no mention of the pressure or the difference. Theirs looks like a light blue? compressor and mine's all black. Actually, I know little to nothing about Puma. Kind of like tractor buying; I went with a dealer I trust, Industrial Air of Texas. They said they have some in shops that run continuously up to 18 hours a day with no problems. Of course, these kind of compressors are definitely not portable - I have a little portable tank I can fill up to carry when I need to, and I have enough air hoses to run anywhere in or around the shop or even all the way around the house. Another thing I like about the Puma is lack of vibration. They come on an oak pallet and you just leave it on the pallet and hook it up. Some compressors vibrate enough to "walk" around, but this one has not moved at all in 3 years.

Bird

jinman · Jul 21, 2001

Bird, can you comment at all on the Sanborn brand that is carried at Sam's Wholesale Clubs? They have both oilless and, I believe, a dual stage upright for about $750. I've also been tempted by the gas engine portables, but my guess is that the compressor components will outlast the gasoline engine on most of these. I have two of the oilless "rattle-traps" and I think I'll move up when my big one quits. My small oilless is for my pneumatic nailers and I have never seen a little unit that isn't oilless.

JimI

Bird · Jul 21, 2001

Larry, your mention of Harbor Freight's price made me go look at the receipt for mine. I said it cost $600 and it was actually $499, but the total bill came to $617 with the regulator/filter, a hose, and some fittings I bought at the same time.

Bird

TWINKLE_TOES · Jul 21, 2001

Bird,

With respect to water/air separators. I have a dickens of a time with my sand blaster. It's a pressurized blaster and has a water/air separator in the line. I blast 100 grit garnet and it will continually clog, in the nozzle and in the valve where the sand and air mix at the base of the tank. The thing "spits" mud when this happens. When it works good it is very very good but when bad ......$#%@&. I have used an extension on the air hose wrapped in a water bucket to cool and condense the water before it gets to the filter. I crack the water blead valve on the filter slightly open in hope that may help. I think I need a better filter, or move to Arizona. The humidity in Western Wash. ranges from 99% to a little higher. The compressor is the oil free type and it does get hot after even a little bit of blasting. The combination is so bad that my neighbor has never asked to borrow it. Any words to the unwise would be appreciated./w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

Al

Bird · Jul 21, 2001

JimI, I really don't know anything about the company, but when we lived in town, a neighbor and I both bought little portable Sanborns from Sam's Club in the '80s; never had any problem with them; used mine to paint the exterior of 4 houses. I wouldn't hesitate to buy one if it met all my other specs. I just sold it when I retired and took off traveling. As for the gasoline powered ones, I've only used a couple of my neighbors' compressors with Briggs & Stratton engines. They're nice rigs, but everyone tells me the best ones are powered by Honda engines (and that's what I would buy if I were going to get one). It seems that the best and most popular are the ones with the two little horizontal tanks and one wheel in the front between the tanks.

Bird

Bird · Jul 21, 2001

Al, sounds like you have one of those water/air separators in the $50-$60 range (like I have/w3tcompact/icons/frown.gif). If you want to really keep all the water out, like auto paint shops, you're going to have to go to the dual models that start over $100; probably something in the $150 range would work pretty well. Since I only normally have 40-50% humidity, drain the water from the tank and filter daily, etc. I don't have too much problem, but I wouldn't try using an oil based paint in my paint gun without going to a more expensive filter; I do get a little moisture through it if I run it very long at a time, like with the sandblaster.

Bird

Bird · Jul 21, 2001

M.Sullivan, I don't recall ever seeing a Quincy, so they might be better; just not familiar with them. Now if someone really wants a fine air compressor, look at the Saylor-Beall. Of course, most of theirs are a little bit large and whole lot too expensive for me to even consider.

Bird