Another confused first timer

   / Another confused first timer #161  
Some outright deception has become the way business is done today.
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Yep and that's one of the reasons why I am here on this forum because I want to help educate the newbies so they don't get taken advantage of. One thing I have learned over the past several years in one of my businesses is the most lucrative deals are almost always sucker deals.
In the final price, how much of the responsibility for a purchase falls on the dealer and how much on the buyer? Sales agreements are pretty simple to read. Anyone can calculate interest.
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Good question but I would come back and say it's a 100% the buyer's responsibility to ensure they are getting the most bang for the buck. As a consumer you may not be able to control the price but you can control what you choose to buy and who you choose to deal with.
50 years ago it was assumed that it was common sense to go into any business deal with the assumption that each party was going to try to maximize their profit.
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That's still true today but negotiating a good deal for yourself takes work, time and practice and few people are willing to really a go at it. I don't know if it was like that 50 years ago or not as I wasn't around.
Customers didn't hate dealers for being that way, or vice versa. But it was understood that both parties had an obligation to protect themselves. The common saying was, "Buyer Beware." Seems like little has changed.
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What has changed is the industry as a whole seems to have cut out a lot of the negotiating and has gone to more of a fixed price model based off of rebates. There's one price for the cash offer and another price for financing. Another thing I have found is you have to watch MSRP as some dealers will play a game with that.
 
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   / Another confused first timer #162  
All expenses are baked into the price, if you look at the sales in aggregate. I've seen plenty of examples, though, of sellers being willing to take little profit, or in some cases a loss, to close a deal. Usually, that is with an expectation that they will make it up in other ways. (parts, service, future sales, or even Goodwill). If someone gets a good deal from a business, they will be more likely to speak highly of them and encourage others to shop there. Think of it like casinos. The Average person loses a little money every time. A few people make big money. A few others lose their shirt. The trick for the consumer is to be a winner more often than not. Businesses have the same approach. The businesses that get the most complaints from people are those who rigidly stick to prices or policies regardless of the situation.
 
   / Another confused first timer #163  
Torvy said:
All expenses are baked into the price, if you look at the sales in aggregate. I've seen plenty of examples, though, of sellers being willing to take little profit, or in some cases a loss, to close a deal. Usually, that is with an expectation that they will make it up in other ways. (parts, service, future sales, or even Goodwill). If someone gets a good deal from a business, they will be more likely to speak highly of them and encourage others to shop there. Think of it like casinos. The Average person loses a little money every time. A few people make big money. A few others lose their shirt. The trick for the consumer is to be a winner more often than not. Businesses have the same approach. The businesses that get the most complaints from people are those who rigidly stick to prices or policies regardless of the situation.
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I've seen plenty of examples, though, of sellers being willing to take little profit, or in some cases a loss, to close a deal. Usually, that is with an expectation that they will make it up in other ways. (parts, service, future sales, or even Goodwill).
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That only works with owners and people who have an actual stake in the company. Not with sales people working on a commission.
 
   / Another confused first timer #164  
The owner makes the decisions. If they tolerate bad behavior by sales people, they are complicit. Personally, I am not a fan of commission sales. It makes things more complicated. Ultimately, if the buyer and seller are not in agreement there is no deal.

To be fair, I know of a few situations where even a commissioned salesperson would take a short-term loss for a long-term gain. Those salespeople are generally those who have done it long enough and are good enough to see the long game....that and some compensation is often tied to units sold and/or new business relationships established. It all comes back to ownership/leadership. Set-up a compensation program that reflects you values and hold people accountable.
 
   / Another confused first timer #165  
Torvy said:
The owner makes the decisions. If they tolerate bad behavior by sales people, they are complicit. Personally, I am not a fan of commission sales. It makes things more complicated. Ultimately, if the buyer and seller are not in agreement there is no deal.

To be fair, I know of a few situations where even a commissioned salesperson would take a short-term loss for a long-term gain. Those salespeople are generally those who have done it long enough and are good enough to see the long game....that and some compensation is often tied to units sold and/or new business relationships established. It all comes back to ownership/leadership. Set-up a compensation program that reflects you values and hold people accountable.
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Torvy I 100% agree with what you're saying but in my experience with the Ag industry it doesn't operate like that. This goes back to what I was saying earlier about the compact tractor industry being a duopoly. In my particular town there are only four tractor dealerships and only two of them are on the side of town everybody lives and that is of course John Deere and Kubota. So they basically have no competition and when there is no competition they don't work to earn your business because they don't have to.
 
   / Another confused first timer #166  
The only way for that to get better is for people to continue to embrace change and buy from the LS, Branson, Kioti, TYM, etc. It becomes a circular argument when people will not buy an equal or even better tractor for less because of smaller dealer networks...the auto industry was the same until a critical mass of people abandoned bias for value.
 
   / Another confused first timer #167  
Torvy said:
The only way for that to get better is for people to continue to embrace change and buy from the LS, Branson, Kioti, TYM, etc. It becomes a circular argument when people will not buy an equal or even better tractor for less because of smaller dealer networks...the auto industry was the same until a critical mass of people abandoned bias for value.
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I will add to that that those manufacturers need to get their act together as well. Having a North American headquarters with no one to answer the phone and no willingness to return emails and phone calls is unacceptable.
 
   / Another confused first timer
  • Thread Starter
#168  
   / Another confused first timer #169  
Hoodoo said:
Enjoying following this thread, great info from all. Could I ask again about info on this specific tractor, please? Not so much on the dealer, but the tractor itself? Is this the type that would suit my needs? With the attachments included, is it a good value?
Thanks again.
I think I kinda got it narrowed down to Kioti/Kubota/LS......
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Wow that looks like a nicely equipped tractor with some awesome upgrades . What is Kubota offering ? I can tell you what I would do ! 👍
 
   / Another confused first timer #170  
Hoodoo said:
Enjoying following this thread, great info from all. Could I ask again about info on this specific tractor, please? Not so much on the dealer, but the tractor itself? Is this the type that would suit my needs? With the attachments included, is it a good value?
Thanks again.
I think I kinda got it narrowed down to Kioti/Kubota/LS......
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I see in the ad that the box scraper is listed as a "Gannon". FYI, Gannon is a brand. As a general rule most any rear box scraper is refered to as a "Gannon", even though it is not. I have a hard time believing that they would be including a Gannon brand scraper as they are usually the highest price units around. I've sold Gannon, Landpride and Woods along with a few others. More than likely, they will be using an "off" brand. Just my observation.
 
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