Another Ford 4000

[swilk]

I have been off and on looking for a reasonably priced tractor for the last year or two. Need something to bush hog and general property maintenance.

So ... I found a Ford 4000 diesel that looks to have had significant work done to it very recently. Guy was not sure of the year .... looks like early 70's maybe?

New short block. Water pump. Starter. Battery cables. Battery. All fliuds/filters. Steering wheel. Axle seals. Trow out bearing. Flywheel ring gear. Paint and decals.

Tires look good.

Seller has said the only thing wrong with the tractor is the headlights do not work .... the instrument panel does not work ..... and the 3pt needs "primed" if it sits for a long period of time.

So I ask ..... what do you think? Is the 3pt problem common on these models?

His asking price is very reasonable IMO ..... under $5k.

Tractor is a 4 hour drive and I plan to make the trip tomorrow if things work out.

 

[Duffster]

Looks nice.

Go get it. :thumbsup:

 

[Soundguy]

lamps in the instrument cluster not working is likely a fuse... tach should still work as it is cable driven off the back of the genny.. if it has been converted to alternator.. then no genny unless he got a real expensive delco 10Dn alternator with aux drive..

bad thing about the cluster not working is you have no oil pressure sender lamp.

if you go get it, take a test lamp with you.. probe battery hot and hook clip to sender ( disconnect wire on sender.. with machine not running, test light should lite up.. start tractor.. test lamp should go off at least within a few seconds.. and stay off at idle

as for the hyds needing priming... hmm I'd want to investigate that one some more... like is it an independent pto model.. etc.

bugs me that someone would do that much work ( machine looks good ).. and then bug out on running 3' of lamp wire and new 4$ lamp elements and a 4$ lamp switch...

kinda looks like 65-mid 68 to me..

soundguy

 

[wedge40]

A quick way to check year is to see how the power steering is set up.
If it has an external cylinder on the left side it's older 4000.
Thats a heck of price for a 4000 diesel. Even if it does need some TLC.

Wedge

 

[swilk]

I bought the tractor. It is a late 60's not early 70's.

A few things .....

When I got clarification on the 3pt priming issue it was not what I had originally thought he said. Basically he said if the tractor sits for a while the 3pt does not immediately respond when you move the lever. After a few seconds the lift operates normally.

It has been changed over to an alternator. There is no tach drive off the back. The reason none of the other gauges work is because the wiring is a complete and total mess. I will address this problem sooner rather than later.

I took the machine out and used it some on Saturday. The lift worked just fine and did not bleed off under the weight of a 800lb cutter with my 250lb buddy standing on top of it.

It had a faulty radiator cap .... wouldnt hold any pressure and would vent coolant out the overflow. I topped it off with a 50/50 mix of coolant and added a new radiator cap and now the system holds pressure. When I was using the machine I shut it down every 20 minutes or so just to look things over. Not having a temp gauge on a 100* day made me very uneasy. It never got hot. I could watch coolant circulate through the cooling system and grab the lower hose for a few seconds without getting burnt. Looks like the cooling system is working .... but I need that gauge/light.

The machine does have an injector problem I believe. It started running bad after a while .... "slobbering" (just learned that term from these forums), and seemed to have dropped a cylinder. I did some trouble shooting and found that when I cracked the fuel line going to the number 2 injector I did not get clean fuel from the line. It was very foamy. The tractor stumbled but would still idle. When I cracked the number 3 fuel line it was clean fuel and the tractor wanted to die. I swapped the number 2 and 3 injectors and the problem followed the injector.

I have contacted my local dealer and will be taking them all 3 injectors today to have them tested/repaired.

soundguy ...... I was considering putting in manual guages for the oil and water temp ..... from what you just said it seems the existing sending units are very simple and just require a switched "hot" wire and a bulb?

 

[Soundguy]

oil sender is just a pressure switch and runs a lamp.. ie.. no pressure, switch closed to ground, and lamp on.. pressure comes up over minimum psi, switch opens, lamp looses ground.

can't say what type of temp unit that mahcine has.. I don't own a 4000.

At very least, I'd get the oil pressure lamp working.. even if I had to rig a trailer marker lamp rigged from switched bat hot from the key, to a 194 marker lmap over to the sender.. making key on, lamp on, the once engine running, lamp off.. hopefully )

soundguy

 

[swilk]

Called the dealer yesterday to check on my injectors and I was told that all 3 checked out fine.

How could that be?? I explained to the nice man on the phone what the tractor was doing and what I had done to troubleshoot ..... he said "they checked fine".

So ... I go to pick them up this morning and got to talking to the counter guy about the injectors. Explained the situation again .... and he says "that sounds like an injector".

No kidding ....

So he goes and checks them again.

He noticed that one of them (the one I had marked thinking it was the bad one) would start to trickle fuel about 600lbs before it would break open.

He dug a piece of trash out of the injector about 3/4" long and 1/4" wide.

Now all 3 break and spray like they are supposed to .... and the tractor runs much, much better. Clean fuel from all 3 when you crack the lines.

 

[Opti-Mist]

I bought the tractor. It is a late 60's not early 70's.

A few things .....


It has been changed over to an alternator. There is no tach drive off the back. The reason none of the other gauges work is because the wiring is a complete and total mess. I will address this problem sooner rather than later.

FWIW - If the alterator conversion was the Ford conversion, the alternator should be a Motorola and the tach drive would be off the engine oil pump drive located on the left side of the block at the middle just above the pan rail. The direction of rotation is opposite of that of the generator so the tach would have been changed as well.

That tractor should last you a lifetime.

 

[Soundguy]

imho, lotsa people were too cheap to get the oil pump drive nipple to replac ehte plug, AND get the new cluster.. otherwise they's have gotten the 100$ genny fixed instread of putting a 25$ delco on it..

soundguy

 

[Opti-Mist]

Yeah, no doubt. Design Engineers usually come up a technically correct solution, not necessarily the most practical.

 

[swilk]

imho, lotsa people were too cheap to get the oil pump drive nipple to replac ehte plug, AND get the new cluster.. otherwise they's have gotten the 100$ genny fixed instread of putting a 25$ delco on it..

soundguy

I have to buy a new cluster no matter what I do. From what I can gather driving the tach off of the oil pump rotates opposite from running it off the back of the generator??

Can I use a 4600 series cluster and drive it off the oil pump?

The oil is just an idiot light so that should be no problem with the different cluster.

Would I need to change the temperature sending unit? What about the fuel sending unit?

 

[swilk]

hhmm .... seems that changing the temp sending unit would be required. Also seems that maybe the new sending unit is a different size than the original one?

Not willing to drill and tap the hole to a larger size.

 

[Soundguy]

I don't have my parts manual with me.. but hit the cnh site and lookup the cluster #'s for the 2 machines.

soundguy

 

[whodat526]

all the sending units on the 4000 and 4600 or the same basically the same tractor with the 4600 having a altenator and the 4000 had a gen. when new

 

[Soundguy]

all the sending units on the 4000 and 4600 or the same basically the same tractor with the 4600 having a altenator and the 4000 had a gen. when new

but the issue is the cluster.. that's why I sugested looking up the number...

soundguy

 

[RickB]

all the sending units on the 4000 and 4600 or the same basically the same tractor with the 4600 having a altenator and the 4000 had a gen. when new

You need to look into that a little further.

Coolant temperature senders are specific to the instrument cluster for the tractor model. 4000 and 4600 temp senders are different both in resistance values and thread size/pitch and are not interchangeable. Fuel tank senders are of differing styles within the 4000's production run, let alone the 4600 model.

 

[Tower]

Sorry to butt in on this thread. But my experience yesterday is all too familiar. Picked up a Ford 4000 from a dealer about an hour away. It was a trade in for a Kubota with a loader. Engine runs great, starts on a dime. Only issue they knew of was the PTO brake was worn. Will work on that later. Anyway, I'm currently on the hunt for a year so that I can buy proper documentation on the thing, as well as any parts that I need to order. The tractor is very similar to the original post except for the rear rims. And I have a split grille up front with the lower grill showing two holes where headlights would go(saw on one site that this means it's an "English version" of that model). Serial number on the block is pretty rough to make out. So looking for other ways to pull a year. First time logging in, so will post some pics later. Thanks in advance guys.

 

[whodat526]

the serial number is on the to of the bellhousing where the starter bolts on