Anybody use a turning /moldboard plow?

[LD1]

50HP = Plow 2 acres in a little less that two hours, (1-1.25ac/hr.)
30-40HP = Plow 2 acres in a little more than 2 hours (3/4ac./hr)?

So....for 2 acres, maybe the total time difference is 30-40 minutes?
I am retired, so I really don't see much difference.
For 100 acres it WOULD make a big difference.

Yea, not much difference.

But I didnt specifically jump to a MX from my L3400 just to plow two acres faster.

The most recent conversation in this thread is Darmstadter wanting to buy a MX to plow 4 acres.

With a MX, and a 3-bottom that would be a ~3.5-4 hour job
With a 30-40hp and 2-bottom that would be a 6 hour job.

Significant to him??? Maybe? Is it worth the extra cost and more compaction? MAybe? Only he can answer that. I'm just laying out the facts

 

[ovrszd]

As a kid we farmed with Ford tractors, starting with an 8N, 2 bottom plow. Later got a 641 that would pull a 3 bottom plow. Later got an 861 that would pull a 3 bottom plow much faster. We plowed 75 acres each fall. Each of those upgrades were huge!!!!

 

[jeff9366]

HP is important for speed while plowing. But if you are considering a HST tractor that may be a moot point.

I plow with a 3-14 plow and a MX5100.

Medium range just doesnt have the power. Must stay in low which limits to ~3.5 MPH.

The 3-14 is a good match, traction wise, with loaded ag tires.

The OP needs to know that a 14" plow has about 20% more draft resistance (resistance to being pulled through the ground) relative to 12" plow(s).

A 16" plow has about 50% more draft resistance relative to 12" plow(s).

This is due to wider, higher plow contact with a wider plow, sunk deeper, moving a greater volume of dirt.

For breaking sandy Florida soil for a food plot a 12" plow of two or three bottoms should be ample. I recommend a two bottom plow to a plow neophyte. In north Florida most only plow once every ten years.

 

[LD1]

As a kid we farmed with Ford tractors, starting with an 8N, 2 bottom plow. Later got a 641 that would pull a 3 bottom plow. Later got an 861 that would pull a 3 bottom plow much faster. We plowed 75 acres each fall. Each of those upgrades were huge!!!!

641 vs 841......thats what power does. Not so much emphasis on weight/traction.

If something "can" pull it.....it can pull it FASTER with more power

 

[ovrszd]

641 vs 841......thats what power does. Not so much emphasis on weight/traction.

If something "can" pull it.....it can pull it FASTER with more power

Yep .

 

[BrokenTrack]

I plowed up a 10 acre field a few years ago with a single bottom 1952 Dearborne Plow. It took three days, but once it was done, it was done, and I could regrade it, and get it seeded down with oats and grass. It came out really great.

It took a little extra fuel granted, but it was a lot cheaper to just buy 15 extra gallons of fuel, than it was to pay someone else to do it with a bigger tractor.

 

[ovrszd]

Great tractor seat time!!!!

 

[LouNY]

Well for what it's worth;
a Farmall H was rated for a 2 bottom 12" plow
a Farmall 400 was rated as 3 bottom 14" (we used a 4 bottom)
the Farmall 560 handled a 4 bottom 16" quite well
I don't know that a Ford 8000 was rated as we used a 5 bottom 18"

All of our plowing with those tractor was on very stony ground you could not plow fast.
Plus the early trip plows you had to back up to reset the bottom that tripped.
In 68 we got the "big" Ford with the 5 bottom that had spring reset bottoms so much nicer.

If you are going to try and plow your ground properly your plow bottom should be as wide as your tire,
if the tire is much wider you will be running up on your turned over ground and packing it back down.

 

[LD1]

Well for what it's worth;
a Farmall H was rated for a 2 bottom 12" plow
a Farmall 400 was rated as 3 bottom 14" (we used a 4 bottom)
the Farmall 560 handled a 4 bottom 16" quite well
I don't know that a Ford 8000 was rated as we used a 5 bottom 18"

All of our plowing with those tractor was on very stony ground you could not plow fast.
Plus the early trip plows you had to back up to reset the bottom that tripped.
In 68 we got the "big" Ford with the 5 bottom that had spring reset bottoms so much nicer.

If you are going to try and plow your ground properly your plow bottom should be as wide as your tire,
if the tire is much wider you will be running up on your turned over ground and packing it back down.

Great point there at the end.

Don't know if ag tires are an absolute. But r4's would make things more difficult. Wider and less traction.

I will add that my 14" bottoms work fine with the 14.9 tires on the mx. Not sure 12" bottoms would work as well

 

[jeff9366]

I will add that my 14" bottoms work fine with the 14.9 tires on the mx. Not sure 12" bottoms would work as well

Good point. As my smaller R4s fit in the furrow of my 12" plow, I really have not focused on this. In my brain now.

 

[jjp8182]

Just for comparison/consideration I pull a single bottom 16" behind my L3560 without a problem .... and that's through a relatively heavy loam/clay (ground is likely less than 2% grade).

Having R4s on my tractor (with full set of wheel weights) I usually have more problems being traction limited than I do with being power limited ...even when operating in medium range on the HST transmission.

As I like to say; when it comes to draft implements all the horsepower in the world doesn't matter if you can't get it to the ground ..... which is where machine weight and soil composition come into play.

 

[LD1]

Just for comparison/consideration I pull a single bottom 16" behind my L3560 without a problem .... and that's through a relatively heavy loam/clay (ground is likely less than 2% grade).

Having R4s on my tractor (with full set of wheel weights) I usually have more problems being traction limited than I do with being power limited ...even when operating in medium range on the HST transmission.

As I like to say; when it comes to draft implements all the horsepower in the world doesn't matter if you can't get it to the ground ..... which is where machine weight and soil composition come into play.

But if you CAN get it to the ground....power is speed.

Alot of plows just dont turn well below 3mph.

So same can be said in reverse....all the traction doesnt matter if you cannot pull it fast enough to actually turn the sod

 

[jjp8182]

But if you CAN get it to the ground....power is speed.

Alot of plows just dont turn well below 3mph.

So same can be said in reverse....all the traction doesnt matter if you cannot pull it fast enough to actually turn the sod

Very true there is a sweet spot for most implements when it comes to speed -- so the really the trick is finding the balance of weight/traction & power to do the work required in the soil conditions that are present.

Unfortunately it'd seem many new models of compact tractors have gone down the road of having more power than they can get to the ground.

Which makes the the "if" part of "But if you CAN get it to the ground....power is speed." a point that needs to be considered as neither engine horsepower nor weight/traction alone solves the problem - which is where the old (and now seemingly unused) concept of measuring drawbar horsepower comes into play for draft implements.

It's really an interesting problem from an engineering, and practical perspective ...especially when the composition, moisture level and cohesiveness/strength of the soil can make such a significant difference in how the soil itself reacts to the transmission of power from the wheels/tracks, and creates the draft loading on the implement.

 

[jeff9366]

It's really an interesting problem from an engineering, and practical perspective.

Most over 25.49-horsepower tractors involuntarily increased by two or three horsepower with engine changes made to meet Tier IV emission standards.

That said, the steady increases in same tractor model horsepower are driven by marketing. It takes a skilled tractor salesperson to get impatient compact tractor shoppers to consider tractor attributes beyond HORSEPOWER and PRICE/FINANCING.

 

[LouNY]

Here is some good information on setting up a plow;
https://open-furrow-agrosphere.net/Documents/DHC/The Moldboard Plow.pdf

 

[milkman]

Here's a small version of farming. Plowing is really satisfying, including the smell of fresh-turned soil.

Kubota BX22 Plowing the garden - YouTube

Here's another at Ball Hollow Plow Day, start about 7:00.

YouTube

 

[BrokenTrack]

I always liked mowing and plowing.

Plowing beats out mowing, only because it is one of few tasks on the farm where it does a better job the faster you can go.

We plowed one farm as a kid (not my own) that was sod and sand. We could plow it so fast because there was no rocks, that the soil would roll out of the furrow, flip completely over, and land right side up. Now that was moving!

 

[papa joe]

I pull a set of old Ford plows, 2 14", with a L3901 gear drive and R4's. Last fall I plowed my 4 acre truck patch. This spring I will hip on 46" rows, then plant in sweet corn, purple hull peas, water melons, and cantaloupes. The 3901 pulls these plows very well. I have over 20 attachments for my tractor, but my "turning plows", as they are called in these parts, are my favorite to use.

 

[BrokenTrack]

I got to plow 100 acres up a few years ago. It was on a leased farm that had a pretty good grade, maybe 15% grade or so, and I ended up plowing straight up and down it. I had a Ford 8830 tractor using a 7 bottom, 16 inch, spring trip, rollover plow.

Years ago we used to hay that field and be scared to death that halfway up it we would spin out on a cow turd, and the 120 HP Massey Ferguson, baler, and trailer would go backwards down the hill. Now a few years later I am plowing that same hill, with a 7 bottom plow going uphill, and in the rain. It really showed how improved farming had gotten.

It was a challenging field too because there was a lot of ledge. I would have to pick my three point hitch up at the last second to cut the sod right up to the rock, then hallway through lower it to follow the contour of the rock while using the tailwheel to lift the back half of the plow, then settle it back down again. But by cutting the sod completely, when you disc, you can crowd that ledgerock and cover much of it with soil if you do it right.

For what it is worth, the USDA says best management practices is to just cut the sod and no deeper, but I go as deep as I can. On 90% of that field, the resets were rattling because the plow-points were riding on rock.

 

[CoyPatton]

One big concern for moldboard plowing is the depth of top soil. If you are in an area that only has 6” of top soil, you may well be turning up the next level of soil that is less useful for crops. If you purpose is to work your soil to increase your top soil depth and plan to add the needed supplements spending several years in this process plow as deeply as you can.
If you are wanting to plan this season, use a combination of disc and chisel and a drag. 40+ years ago we called these “do alls” because they in ground that had been farmed the past season could be prepared to bedding in one pass. With 60+ years of not being farmed, you probably want to disc in several passes to cut the sod and roots then run a chisel plow to break every apart.
As you seem to have already done the plowing you may be able to skip the discing if you are not a heavy clay based soil.
Good luck on your planting and harvest!