Backhoe problem

[rScotty]

BTW, which one is the relief, the #1 or #2?

I agree with ptsg. Number 2 seems to be the relief value - but I'm puzzled by the location. Still, if you put your hand on that control assembly and do not notice some sort of vibration when the motion of the BH stops, then I'd say that your relief valves are OK. I don't think you would miss the vibration of the relief valve working.

He says he never had such an issue and this suggestion came from TYM.
Also, what supports the idea of the connectors, the problem started with 2 stops per swing every 1/3 of the way. After i disconnected and connected the BH it changed its behavior and now it makes 5-7 stops.
I checked the connectors inside, they look like new, no dirt, no rust no anything else.
Hopefully tomorrow i'll be able to get new connectors and install them


Are you saying that that those ones are not good connectors? Which ones should i buy and how can i see the difference between the good ones and bad ones?

Also, i took a picture of the connection where the hose is connected. I guess it is PB point?

The support for the idea of the connectors is simply that something seems to be interrupting the flow and the connectors do have the ability to do that. The hydraulic force is going to be able to move most anythng else out of the way. I don't see anything that tells me those connectors are inexpensive or otherwise... and don't know of any way to tell. This is just speculation on my part because what you are having happen would make sense if a spring/ball blocking setup went bad.

The fact that it chanced when you disconnected and reconnected them sounds pretty suspicioius too.
BTW, if that device #1 is indeed a check valve as ptsg says.... then we have to include the check valve in the list of possible culprits. First I would confirm that the hose to #1 is the input pressure - if your hoe is plumbed like we think, that hose should come back from the front loader control valve PB port.

If so, see if tapping on the check valve changes things or if you can feel a vibration there.

If nothing works - but I'm hopping it will - then the next thing will be to remove that check valve or plumb it solid without the quick disconnects just to see if it works then. That may need putting in a dummy or different valve to make up the space.

And after that...if still no luck, make up a test gauge you can insert into the line. Not sure why.... It will be a T connector with quick connectors on each end and a guage in the center of the T connector. Whole device costs maybe 50 to 75 bucks to make up. Use a 0-5000 psi pressure gauge - usually that is a $30 item.

I'm banking heavily on the connectors or check valve. After that I am running out of simple ideas...
luck,
rScotty

 

[2515R Dude]

I support the connector plan. One thing that concerns me is that if I understand correctly you are only seeing the pause in one direction of movement and not the other. I understand on multiple functions but only one way. Is that correct? If so that leads me to suspect the valve itself as a problem.

That is a stack type valve so there could be an issue with where the spool valves mate together. Or if it is only on the two functions, swing and boom curl then maybe you could swap spool valves to test. But that would be a process and somewhat time consuming.

So you don’t see the symptoms when curling the bucket?

No, it is both ways, right or left, starts fast then hiccups amost to the end, same with the curl functions, stops in the middle, hesitates a sec or two and keeps going

 

[2515R Dude]

First I would confirm that the hose to #1 is the input pressure - if your hoe is plumbed like we think, that hose should come back from the front loader control valve PB port.

As much as i understand the #1 is on the return hose, going back to the gear box. The one which comes from the PB is on the opposite side just below the #2 relief valve

If so, see if tapping on the check valve changes things or if you can feel a vibration there.

No vibration whatsoever. The only noise i hear is when i lower the boom, i hear loud sound of running fluid

If nothing works - but I'm hopping it will - then the next thing will be to remove that check valve or plumb it solid without the quick disconnects just to see if it works then. That may need putting in a dummy or different valve to make up the space.

And after that...if still no luck, make up a test gauge you can insert into the line. Not sure why.... It will be a T connector with quick connectors on each end and a guage in the center of the T connector. Whole device costs maybe 50 to 75 bucks to make up. Use a 0-5000 psi pressure gauge - usually that is a $30 item.

I'm banking heavily on the connectors or check valve. After that I am running out of simple ideas...
luck,
rScotty

I hope it works without drastic measures.
Just spoke to the dealer again, he offered to come over, change the connectors and see what is going on. Great guy.

 

[oldnslo]

Are there two or three connections - hoses between the tractor and hoe? If only two where does the return line connect to? Have you tried lowering or moving the 3 point lever to lower to see if makes any difference? If only two lines and going back through 3 point and lever was moved to full raise it might cause these symptoms.

My two cents, should I ask for some change back

 

[2515R Dude]

Just found the schematics, looks like the hose from the check valve is supposed to be on the return line. So, mine is installed correctly.

 

[K5lwq]

No, it is both ways, right or left, starts fast then hiccups amost to the end, same with the curl functions, stops in the middle, hesitates a sec or two and keeps going

Then I am really on board with the connectors being changed. Makes the most sense to me.

 

[2515R Dude]

Are there two or three connections - hoses between the tractor and hoe? If only two where does the return line connect to? Have you tried lowering or moving the 3 point lever to lower to see if makes any difference? If only two lines and going back through 3 point and lever was moved to full raise it might cause these symptoms.

My two cents, should I ask for some change back

There are only two hoses, one comes from PB and another goes to the return port.
No, i haven't tried the 3point, i'll tomorrow.

Yes, you will get a full refund as soon as the BH starts working correctly

 

[rScotty]

As much as i understand the #1 is on the return hose, going back to the gear box. The one which comes from the PB is on the opposite side just below the #2 relief valve

Yes, judging by the diagram it does seem that it is plumbed just as you say above. It is always best to trace the hoses as you've done just to be sure. My guess is your problem is not in the valve body. It may be in the check valve. From the checking that you have done it doesn't seem to be in the relief valve.

If you post a few more hydraulic diagrams we may be able to make some more progress...

The three point....re: OldnSlo #24..... Well, we can hope his guess is right. Wouldn't it be nice if all it took was moving the 3pt lever!
Usually the three point system has some isolation from the loader & remotes so we can ignore it when the PB is being used for rear remote pressure and the only other hose is going to the sump But that's not an absolute design rule. A tractor doesn't have to be made or plumbed that way - it is just a mechanical assumption and is the reason we haven't mentioned the three point so far.
Here's hoping....
rScotty

 

[two_bit_score]

I need to hear how this is resolved.

 

[ptsg]

The Tank line coming from the BH does feed the remotes (which this tractor in particular doesn't have) and then feeds the 3 PT. Could possibly cause the issue, although the 3 pt valve on Bransons won't keep applying pressure with the arms fully up like other manufacturers do. Once it gets to position set by the lever, there is no more pressure being applied to it.

I'm also leaning towards one or various stuck load check valves on the BH valve bank.