Backhoe vs Tractor with backhoe

[Texasmark]

I've thought about the HF backhoe at times. How do you get it where you need it to work and then reposition it as you are digging with it?

Has a trailer hitch on the engine end. PUll it with your PU or a tractor. The wheels and stabilizer arms are about 3" square steel and are identical fit for the front and rear "receivers". When you get where you are going you lift up the machine with the bucket and swap the wheel positions with the outrigger arms.

 

[paulsharvey]

Read first couple, But; you didn't mention specifically any back hoe tasks; and for general, around the house stuff, the tractor is the tool. If you have specific back hoe task, rent a full sized one, $2500/month, ($750-1000/week) and do the heavy work. A tractor mounted back hoe is almost never the right tool for the job.

Tractor mounted backhoe is a pain, they tend to either stay on all the time, or end up stored for years in a barn. Not saying it takes 4 hours to put one on/off, but its not a 5 minute job. You can't pick up, and remanuever the whole machine from the hoe, (like a real back hoe), so you end up climbing down/up, and switching seats over and over. They will dig, but its dang hard to grade a trench, ready for conduit/pipe, they don't have Nearly the balls of a real hoe, and if your think stumps, a real stump is a fight for even a JD-85 sized mid sized track hoe, an hours long fight with a JD-310, or a day or more, (and maybe some broken parts) with a 30hp tractor mounted one.

 

[MaxLee]

Read first couple, But; you didn't mention specifically any back hoe tasks; and for general, around the house stuff, the tractor is the tool. If you have specific back hoe task, rent a full sized one, $2500/month, ($750-1000/week) and do the heavy work. A tractor mounted back hoe is almost never the right tool for the job.

Tractor mounted backhoe is a pain, they tend to either stay on all the time, or end up stored for years in a barn. Not saying it takes 4 hours to put one on/off, but its not a 5 minute job. You can't pick up, and remanuever the whole machine from the hoe, (like a real back hoe), so you end up climbing down/up, and switching seats over and over. They will dig, but its dang hard to grade a trench, ready for conduit/pipe, they don't have Nearly the balls of a real hoe, and if your think stumps, a real stump is a fight for even a JD-85 sized mid sized track hoe, an hours long fight with a JD-310, or a day or more, (and maybe some broken parts) with a 30hp tractor mounted one.

I like my tractor mounted back hoe not a pain at all.. does a lot of work for me since I have had it. I can put it on and off less then 5 mins. I have taken 10 stumps out this summer among many other things, no issues at all...

Ya know the best thing , the cost is included in my tractor payment at 0% interest
Ya know another thing... I don't have to schedule to get it delivered
Ya know another thing.... in my parts of the country a Mini X is 650 a day so I am sure a BH is close or more then that a day.
Ya know 1 more thing... I can hook a rotory cutter, land plane, wood chipper and venture out and get done what I need done.... or in 5 mins hook that back hoe up and get even more things done.

Lots to think about , the OP is a happy home owner, not running an excavation business

 

[paulsharvey]

Hey, I'm not saying they don't have a use, just offering my personal take. It really depends on the jobs. They really shine when it's small, necessary, but unplanned jobs. If you can schedule a whole week, I would rent, beat the heck out of it, get my jobs done and have them pick it up. Don't 100% know what the OP really has planned. What is the cost upgrade for a rear backhoe on say, 45hp machine? $7k? Now, if you can get a package deal where the price increase isn't that bad, I say, go for it. If we are talking $7k, that's a lot of week long rentals, of a better, more efficient machine, that repairs aren't on you, but thats just my opinion.

 

[Hay Dude]

I found the most versatile combo was my New Holland backhoe and my Challenger MT285.
I could take down trees and dig out stumps large rocks, dig foundations, footings, septic systems, rainwater retention systems and any other heavy work.
They I could use the smaller compact‘s smaller loader for lighter work and for a Harley rake.

When it came time to lay block or frame, forks on the backhoe could move lots of block, plywood, studs, etc.

A full size 4WD backhoe and a 40-50HP compact with a loader are a great combo. What you do is spend 20-25K on both used, instead of buying one new small machine.

 

[paulsharvey]

Another option, a imported tracked mini-hoe. Think I've seen posts where it was only like $9k (plus import fees). And the tractor.

A full sized TLB is not the tool for your garden, and depending on what the 6 acres is, soil type, moisture content, you might end up rutting it up pretty good (didn't say if it's yard/field/kinda landscaped woods, ect)

What kinda budget are you working with? If it's say, $40k, I would say tractor (and impliments) you want for your long term maintenance needa, and rent for the heavy work.

 

[4570Man]

I’ve had full size backhoes and they’re a lot of muscle for cheap but the lack of having attachments is extremely limiting. Sure the option exists to add attachments but it’s expensive and that’s going against the whole point of where you started. I’m not going to spend 30 grand to put a quick change coupler and a hydraulic thumb on the backhoe and a quick coupler and auxiliary hydraulic on the loader when I could just buy a different machine that has that.

 

[MaxLee]

I’ve had full size backhoes and they’re a lot of muscle for cheap but the lack of having attachments is extremely limiting. Sure the option exists to add attachments but it’s expensive and that’s going against the whole point of where you started. I’m not going to spend 30 grand to put a quick change coupler and a hydraulic thumb on the backhoe and a quick coupler and auxiliary hydraulic on the loader when I could just buy a different machine that has that.

I bought this in the spring, used all the attachments and BH alot. I know it limits, it very versatile , can do a lot of things with it. and I did add the hydrailic thumb to the BH bucket
Something like this would serve the OP for a long time.

 

[Hay Dude]

Hey, I'm not saying they don't have a use, just offering my personal take. It really depends on the jobs. They really shine when it's small, necessary, but unplanned jobs. If you can schedule a whole week, I would rent, beat the heck out of it, get my jobs done and have them pick it up. Don't 100% know what the OP really has planned. What is the cost upgrade for a rear backhoe on say, 45hp machine? $7k? Now, if you can get a package deal where the price increase isn't that bad, I say, go for it. If we are talking $7k, that's a lot of week long rentals, of a better, more efficient machine, that repairs aren't on you, but thats just my opinion.

Say what?

 

[paulsharvey]

What I was trying to say, is, the price to add a back hoe to a 'mid sized tractor' would pay for quite a few week long rentals of a real TLB. So, if it's the kinda work were you can line up a few days worth of solid back hoe work, and rent a real TLB for a few days, and get the jobs all done; that's what I would do. I dont think there is any argument that an actual TLB is more capable, more efficient, than a 'mid sized tractor with a back hoe'. Plus, yiu can abuse the heck out of the rental and not feel bad about it.

 

[Jims1025R]

Back in 1998, when I was looking for a backhoe attachment for my JD650 tractor, my JD dealer (who knew me, and what I would be trying to do with it) kinda winced. I knew from his look, I should think more. The backhoe attachment was $9,800. For $10,000, I bought a used mini excavator. I was immediately happy I made that choice, and 2500 hours later, I'm still happy about that choice. I even accidentally made a good choice of mini ex (JD15), and it has a lot of uumph for it's size. I have run other mini ex's in that size range, and mine seems to have a lot more pull for stumps and big rock lifting.

A mini ex is probably faster for trenching work, and having 360 swing makes some work a lot faster than the less than 180 swing of a backhoe.

And... when you get one stuck, you have the other to use to pull it out.

 

[MaxLee]

What I was trying to say, is, the price to add a back hoe to a 'mid sized tractor' would pay for quite a few week long rentals of a real TLB. So, if it's the kinda work were you can line up a few days worth of solid back hoe work, and rent a real TLB for a few days, and get the jobs all done; that's what I would do. I dont think there is any argument that an actual TLB is more capable, more efficient, than a 'mid sized tractor with a back hoe'. Plus, yiu can abuse the heck out of the rental and not feel bad about it.

Before I bought my compact with the BH I figure after 35 days at the current price at the time my back hoe would be paid for. 1/2 way there with 1 summer completed. Plus its used for other projects you would rent a BH for

 

[DK35vince]

Back in 1998, when I was looking for a backhoe attachment for my JD650 tractor, my JD dealer (who knew me, and what I would be trying to do with it) kinda winced. I knew from his look, I should think more. The backhoe attachment was $9,800.

$9,800 for a backhoe on a little 17 HP JD 650 in 1998 ?? Good grief.
I paid $5,200 for an 8 1/2' digging depth, 11' reach w/subframe and 18" bucket backhoe for my 35 HP tractor in 2003.
I've done lots of work around here with it the past 20 years and its still working great.
Available within minutes any time I need it.

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[MaxLee]

$9,800 for a backhoe on a little 17 HP JD 650 in 1998 ?? Good grief.
I paid $5,200 for an 8 1/2' digging depth, 11' reach w/subframe and 18" bucket backhoe for my 35 HP tractor in 2003.
I've done lots of work around here with it the past 20 years and its still working great.
Available within minutes any time I need it.

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Mine was 9k with 16" bucket in April this year, included the rear remotes. Hope mine last 20 years

 

[Rookkee22]

The way I read this the OP is trying to choose between a midsize TLB like a L47 and a tractor (like a 4701) that has both backhoe and loader attachments.
How about it OP?

Exactly right. If I got a tractor, I'd want something that can handle moving feld trees as well as installing and maintaining a small food plot/garden

 

[Rookkee22]

It also depends on what your property is like and whether you already have a house and barn or are planning on doing some building. Also on your plans for the trees.

The used construction TLBs like the Deere 310 are at a sweet spot on the market right now. If you are willing to take your time and research local schools, parks, city maintenance shops and such I'll bet you can pick up a good used TLB for way less than a compact tractor. Those old 310s are comfortable, durable, parts are fair, and the yellow Deere mechanics and dealers are pros.

We have a long driveway in the mountains and use our old 310 to plow snow. No special attachments necessary....just lower the bucket so it skims the ground and drive forward. Not much stops it.

About the only thing it won't do is till the garden - but it will even do that where the hoe bucket can reach.
Maybe someday a clever guy will make a tilling attachment for a backhoe bucket.

For 6 acres of suburban lawn the 310 would be out of place, but for a few acres of more rugged rural woodland it would be a reasonable choice.

rScotty

About 2.5 acres of lawn the rest heavily wooded with more and more feld trees each year.

 

[sd455dan]

Back in 1998, when I was looking for a backhoe attachment for my JD650 tractor, my JD dealer (who knew me, and what I would be trying to do with it) kinda winced. I knew from his look, I should think more. The backhoe attachment was $9,800. For $10,000, I bought a used mini excavator. I was immediately happy I made that choice, and 2500 hours later, I'm still happy about that choice. I even accidentally made a good choice of mini ex (JD15), and it has a lot of uumph for it's size. I have run other mini ex's in that size range, and mine seems to have a lot more pull for stumps and big rock lifting.

A mini ex is probably faster for trenching work, and having 360 swing makes some work a lot faster than the less than 180 swing of a backhoe.

And... when you get one stuck, you have the other to use to pull it out.

I tried to go that route but apparently used mini EXes are All Gold plated around here. At least there are some Good Old TLB's available.

Glad I Got mine. and compared to putting a backhoe on the back of my tractor

Nice to have a 15 foot digging depth with Good power and also works as a spare FEL machine with a yard bucket and darn good lift capability for under $10K. and makes a great compliment to my small utility tractor that can run PTO things like the brush cutter, 85" roto tiller, or 87" Inverted snow blower.

IMO Old backhoes are underrated on a cost per dollar capability chart as are Good used small utility tractors

 

[Too many Kubotas]

$9,800 for a backhoe on a little 17 HP JD 650 in 1998 ?? Good grief.
I paid $5,200 for an 8 1/2' digging depth, 11' reach w/subframe and 18" bucket backhoe for my 35 HP tractor in 2003.

I think I mentioned it earlier. but if not, you can get a Case 580 on the back of an ex-military Unimog for that kind of money, even today.

 

[Williy]

Renting?? First you have to take time to go and get one if
they have one available. Perhaps your rent it shop has dozens
just waiting for you? My tractor may be small with a backhoe
but I have it ready to use if I need it and yes I move my tractor
with the backhoe no problem. For me a round trip to the rent it
shop is approx 30 miles and most of the time all the large equipment
is rented out and you have to wait in line to use one! My neighbor
had to wait 2 weeks just to rent a air hammer. For most of us its
not feasible to rent too time consuming. I like having my backhoe
where its handy to get to and I wouldn't care if it takes 2 hours to
hook it up. It takes me about 5 to 10 minutes to have it ready;.
Plenty fast for me as I am in no hurry! And every one's situation
is different. Perhaps a lot of us don't live near a big city with a
large rent it shop with a large selection of equipment Then again
I purchased the backhoe with the tractor so saved a few bucks
Sure glad I'm not in the market for a tractor or attachments now
with the jump in prices

willy

 

[paulsharvey]

Ok, so, back to the OP, you haven't specifically said what you need the back hoe for. Yep, snow, trees, garden, but nothing about the hoe. I dont think you will be happy with just a TLB, but I don't know. If we are talking about digging 10 ft basement foundations or cutting a walk out into a hill side, or constructing a driveway/access road through a hill, or removing mature tree stumps; that's one thing. If it's running a couple water lines, and general light work occasionally, that's a different thing.

What I guess I'm trying to get at, is scale, and frequency of use. For major work, a JD-310 TLB or JD-35 mini hoe are about the minimum size, and I don't think you will be happy or efficient with a utility tractor or compact tractor mounted back hoe attachment. If we are talking about some water lines, 4 ft retaining walls, and some ditches; I think a tractor mounted hoe will work; about equivalent to work you would do with a micro-mini hoe.

Don't know what they go for $, but a JD-110, the hoe on those will do more work than you think looking at a mini TLB, and fit a nice niche for routine water/sewer service installs, where you want/need the versatility of the loader, and some road mobility; and the expense of a bit slower than a mini hoe.

Your soil conditions also determine a lot of this; clay/rock/sand/water table issue; and without knowing those, in a general fashion, we can all offer bad advise.

We need to know if you plan on measuring your holes in CF, CY, or dump trucks