Snow Best snow equipment?

   / Best snow equipment? #21  
Doesn't anyone use a FEL mounted snow blade?

That's what I am considering. I see models from LandPride, WR Long, and AnBo. Not sure what the prices or differences are yet, but I think the LandPride is around $4k.

I like this option because:
* with SSQA I can switch from bucket to blade in minutes (or less)
* 3rd function valve allows angling
* float position of FEL allows blade to follow contour of road
* if necessary, can raise blade many feet in the air

This last option would come in handy when trees droop across the road from the weight of the snow. Instead of getting off and shaking them, I can bump them with the blade at 5-6 feet off the ground and get them out of my way.

-Jeff
 
   / Best snow equipment? #22  
Doesn't anyone use a FEL mounted snow blade?

That's what I am considering. I see models from LandPride, WR Long, and AnBo. Not sure what the prices or differences are yet, but I think the LandPride is around $4k.

I like this option because:
* with SSQA I can switch from bucket to blade in minutes (or less)
* 3rd function valve allows angling
* float position of FEL allows blade to follow contour of road
* if necessary, can raise blade many feet in the air

This last option would come in handy when trees droop across the road from the weight of the snow. Instead of getting off and shaking them, I can bump them with the blade at 5-6 feet off the ground and get them out of my way.

-Jeff

I thought about that for a long time, and I think it is a good solution. But, If you hit something hard and fast when the blade is near maximum angle, I think that would be very hard on the fel arms, the resulting angle stress. I am not the most patient man, and get in a hurry, that is when most of my damage is done. FEL's are meant for straight attack angles with a bucket, an angled blade changes the geometry of this whole design. Maybe someone with more knowledge (experience) can speak on this. Philip.
 
   / Best snow equipment? #23  
Doesn't anyone use a FEL mounted snow blade?

That's what I am considering. I see models from LandPride, WR Long, and AnBo. Not sure what the prices or differences are yet, but I think the LandPride is around $4k.

I like this option because:
* with SSQA I can switch from bucket to blade in minutes (or less)
* 3rd function valve allows angling
* float position of FEL allows blade to follow contour of road
* if necessary, can raise blade many feet in the air

This last option would come in handy when trees droop across the road from the weight of the snow. Instead of getting off and shaking them, I can bump them with the blade at 5-6 feet off the ground and get them out of my way.

-Jeff




The issues with a loader mounted blade are numerous unfortunately;


The front end loader is ment for dealing with loose materials with a scooping bucket.

The use of a blade will create more pressure on the loader arms and distort them affecting the boom arms by stressing one side or the other force the boom arms away from the original geometry of the loader arm design.


The use of a quick attach system is problematic because it adds more wieght out in front of the tractor than the loader was designed to handle within the lifting arc of the boom.

If you do not have a trip edge on this plow you are in for a rude awakening.



If you are intent on using the boom and blade for smacking around tree limbs you have a death wish as these tree limbs have a mind of their own and you could be injured or killed as the branch may not break cleanly and will follow the cambium layer as it is stripping away from the limb and bark and will have a mind of its own.


In order to solve the snow problem on your tree limbs you should doing the responsible thing by trimming the limbs back beyond the road edge as they are going to eventually injure someone or kill them whether they are heavy with snow or not simply because of the stress of the limb wieght with snow or not.


An excellent example for this is the recent rash of fatalities and brain injury victims occured at Central Park in New York City, New York wherein several trees that had limbs reaching over the walk paths broke and as a result killed people or cause permanent brain damage to the victims.

For the money you want to spend or waste your better off buying an Allied Farm King snow caster from Ken Sweet who is a sponsor of the TractorByNet forum in good standing.

You can use the loader bucket for removing snow in tight spots and piling it to later.
be disposed of by the snow caster.

The snow caster will not leave any snow banks which is another bonus.
 
   / Best snow equipment? #24  
Thanks for the great feedback. I love reading things I have never thought of before. For example, I never realized the side forces the FEL arms would receive when plowing with an angled blade. I can see how arms designed for pushing and lifting probably would not like being pushed at an angle.

Now I have to re-evaluate my snow removal options.

-Jeff
 
   / Best snow equipment? #25  
Thanks for the great feedback. I love reading things I have never thought of before. For example, I never realized the side forces the FEL arms would receive when plowing with an angled blade. I can see how arms designed for pushing and lifting probably would not like being pushed at an angle.

Now I have to re-evaluate my snow removal options.

-Jeff

There are dozens, if not hundreds of people on this forum that use loader mounted snow plows with no reports of damage to their loader arms. There are anecdotes of "I know a guy" that bent loader arms on every kind of machine made, including wheel loaders and skid steers, but I personally have never seen a documented case of damage due to an angled snowplow. Loaders are quite sturdy.

The side load on the loader is limited by the lateral traction of the front wheels. The sideways pressure can't be more than the pressure it takes to slide the wheels. The same forces are at work whether your scooping into a pile of dirt while turning, as when plowing snow with an angled blade. When plowing snow, the surface is almost certainly slicker than the surface when working dirt on dry ground, so the loads are likely far less than when simply moving a dirt pile. The force directions are no different than pushing into something with one end of the bucket.
 
   / Best snow equipment? #26  
You guys are all off on this the best snow removal item you can have is a condo in Kona
 
   / Best snow equipment? #27  
There are dozens, if not hundreds of people on this forum that use loader mounted snow plows with no reports of damage to their loader arms. There are anecdotes of "I know a guy" that bent loader arms on every kind of machine made, including wheel loaders and skid steers, but I personally have never seen a documented case of damage due to an angled snowplow. Loaders are quite sturdy.

The side load on the loader is limited by the lateral traction of the front wheels. The sideways pressure can't be more than the pressure it takes to slide the wheels. The same forces are at work whether your scooping into a pile of dirt while turning, as when plowing snow with an angled blade. When plowing snow, the surface is almost certainly slicker than the surface when working dirt on dry ground, so the loads are likely far less than when simply moving a dirt pile. The force directions are no different than pushing into something with one end of the bucket.



Your missing the point, that he intended to use the loader and plow to poke and knock down snow accumulations creating low hanging branches.

Unless a plow has a trip edge the same laws of physics apply.


All traction is obtained by the linear movement and contact of the tire treads/chains/wieghting of the tires to the actual ground surface.


Any available traction is created by:

1. road surface type

2. current ground conditions affecting the amount of
adhesion that is available to the tires.

3 tread surface available to contact the road surface (which is not much rubber to begin with)
a. forward speed

If the tractors had sanders like locomotives they would be given the huge advantage of sand for adhesion of the wheels to the road surface; saying that if the

www.Instachain.com

folks created a set of chains that could be mounted on the BX to the row crop models they would have a barn burner of a product.

It would be simple enough to mount a set of insta chains on the rear axle even with a front implement carrier for a plow or snow caster.

continued;

4. tire type

5. snow chains
a. chain type

6. added loading of tires

The issue is more of snow loading and frozen snow banks and the freeze thaw cycles affecting snow wieghts wherein fresh snow fall wieghing 21 pounds per cubic foot will increase in wieght with a freeze thaw cycle.

The other issue is snow depth as well with regard to a plow versus a snow
caster wherein if you have snow banks you are continuing to push the snow upon itself and increasing the wieght per cubic foot of snow loading against the plow.

The more the snow is moved around the greater the wieght in the snow as the layers
are broken up and compressed with the plowing action.

The entire width and square area of the plow creates the force that will create the G forces that will be transmitted to the bucket pins and the lower arms and depending upon the plow angle will increase the forces generated to one side or the other unless the plow has a tripping edge.
 
   / Best snow equipment? #28  
You guys are all off on this the best snow removal item you can have is a condo in Kona

As long as the beer is cold and "Kiloweah"? is behaving I could suffer through it :laughing:
 
   / Best snow equipment? #29  
Your missing the point, that he intended to use the loader and plow to poke and knock down snow accumulations creating low hanging branches.

My idea to poke at snow-laden trees seems unrelated to the issue of lateral stress on the loader arms. I'm also not sure why it's so unsafe... currently I have to cut down the tree (can be dangerous to cut a tree with it's top bent down to the ground), or whack it with a long piece of PVC, or shake it by hand. I would think bumping the tree with the blade would be safer as I my body is not as close to the tree as the alternatives. If I'm missing something, please share - that's why I like these discussions! :thumbsup:

Unless a plow has a trip edge the same laws of physics apply.

All of the FEL blades I have been looking at DO have a spring trip.

The other issue is snow depth as well with regard to a plow versus a snow caster wherein

Our snow is often referred to as "Sierra Cement". It tends to be wet and heavy. The outdoor temps during our snowfalls are usually 28-34 degrees F. Usually the snow accumulation will be 10" or less. That's what usually falls overnight. Sometimes we have longer storms and I am not home to clear snow, and so I can find myself with 18-20" in the driveway and road.

I thought about a rear blower/caster, and while it would be cheaper, it would also mean driving backwards for most of my snow clearing time. Our driveway is about 650 feet and private road is about 1/4 mile and 12-14 feet wide. I'm pretty sure a front blower with mid-PTO would cost more than a FEL blade.

I'd like to hear from a couple folks who own and use a FEL blade for snow. Are there any around?

-Jeff
 
   / Best snow equipment? #30  
My idea to poke at snow-laden trees seems unrelated to the issue of lateral stress on the loader arms. I'm also not sure why it's so unsafe... currently I have to cut down the tree (can be dangerous to cut a tree with it's top bent down to the ground), or whack it with a long piece of PVC, or shake it by hand. I would think bumping the tree with the blade would be safer as I my body is not as close to the tree as the alternatives. If I'm missing something, please share - that's why I like these discussions! :thumbsup:



All of the FEL blades I have been looking at DO have a spring trip.



Our snow is often referred to as "Sierra Cement". It tends to be wet and heavy. The outdoor temps during our snowfalls are usually 28-34 degrees F. Usually the snow accumulation will be 10" or less. That's what usually falls overnight. Sometimes we have longer storms and I am not home to clear snow, and so I can find myself with 18-20" in the driveway and road.

I thought about a rear blower/caster, and while it would be cheaper, it would also mean driving backwards for most of my snow clearing time. Our driveway is about 650 feet and private road is about 1/4 mile and 12-14 feet wide. I'm pretty sure a front blower with mid-PTO would cost more than a FEL blade.

I'd like to hear from a couple folks who own and use a FEL blade for snow. Are there any around?

-Jeff

About your tree limbs:

You will have no control of the path that the limb desires to follow and that is the most dangerous part as the snow will simply be an extra wieght that will contribute to the speed of the falling limb and its direction of fall as the thickness of the bark layer and the first few cambium layers will determine the speed and direction of the falling tree limbs as the bark and cambium layes will act to direct the limb when or if it is shocked to a stop by healthy bark and cambium or simply breaking off at a point where the pressure of the falling limb is greater than the surrounding tree layers that could keep it from shearing from the trunk.




About your Cascade Concrete/Sierra Cement:

If you have an open station hydro tractor you can purchase a rear mounted snow caster and install one of "Clarences Impeller Kit" and zip right through
your accumulated snow fall as the snow will not be able to get hung up in the blower even though it is heavier snow as it can approach 51 pounds per cubic foot of condenced snow melt.

lots of the folks here have rear mounts and they simply use the left foot to run the reversing function as they are twisted slightly on the seat. If you get the up graded seat you will be fine with it as it twists slightly within the seat mounting frame to allow you to watch what is going on behind the machine.

many folks use truck mirrors or back up cameras too; I love mine for sure.

And the minute you lift your foot off the pedal the tractor stops as the snow caster is on the ground acting as a drag.
 
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