Big $$$ AC repair on 03 Ford

[irwin]

I've been away for a day but I've read all the posts and I just got off the phone with the service manager.

He tells me that my compressor is 'locked up'. I asked him what that meant and he kind of stammered around a bit and said it seized up, all the internal parts burned out. Sounds very suspicious to me, but, I'm going to play devils advocate here. Maybe he doesn't understand AC systems, or maybe he misunderstood what the mechanic told him or maybe, and this has happened to me, he was having a hard time putting this in terms I could understand since he assumes (correctly) that I know nothing about these things.

He gave me this estimate:

1) New compressor: $320
2) New 'accumulator': $146
3) Refrigerant and oil: $50
4) Some type of seal: $7
5) Labor: $410

Total: $933

I'm assuming the labor is high because they have to pull a lot of stuff out to get to it.

Now, I talked to him before reading the rest of the posts in this thread, so I did not confront him with this. I politely thanked him for the info and the phone call. (I'm trying to keep this civil, remember, he and the owner of the dealership are patients of mine. Also, I did not by the truck there).

But it was around 96 degrees here today and I got in it after it was parked in the sun. It is a black truck. It took the AC a while to get going and it didn't get nearly as cool as it did 3 weeks ago, but after 5 minutes or so, it was relatively comfortable and the air felt cool coming out of the vents. There is definitely something wrong with it, but as several people mentioned, I'm assuming it should not be cooling at all with a compressor 'locked up', 'seized up' or 'burned out'.

I hope these folks have made a mistake and are not trying to fleece me. The cost for diagnostics was $80 for labor and $20 for refrigerant (why did they add refrigerant to a system with a 'locked up' compressor.

At this point I'll definitely get a second opinion either from the Ford place where I bought it, or from an independant.

If it turns out that they got the diagnosis all wrong should I ask for my money back in regard to the labor fee for 'diagnosis'?

What a goat rope!

Mike Z may have the best idea. I may just keep running the dang thing until it won't cool at all.....we should only have another couple of months in the high 90's.

We do a lot of AC repairs here at my shop. Like was said here already a compressor that siezes or locks up will not work at all, the shop won't be charging that system with R134a freon (or anything else) end of story. However if there are signs of leakage at the compressor, We (auto techs) are taught to replace all the parts listed by you in your last post. The prices are slightly high, but not abnormal. .. You may be able to find someone to replace the leaking component and not replace the accumulator (also called the receiver/drayer) and charge system for a little less.. you' have no warranty that way though..ac compressor warranties have a must do list but if you don't care about warranty try that approach.

The service manager acting guilty when asked for more info doesn't fill me with confidence, so I'd get another opinion.. just my $ 0.02..

 

[kenmac]

I've been away for a day but I've read all the posts and I just got off the phone with the service manager.

He tells me that my compressor is 'locked up'. I asked him what that meant and he kind of stammered around a bit and said it seized up, all the internal parts burned out. Sounds very suspicious to me, but, I'm going to play devils advocate here. Maybe he doesn't understand AC systems, or maybe he misunderstood what the mechanic told him or maybe, and this has happened to me, he was having a hard time putting this in terms I could understand since he assumes (correctly) that I know nothing about these things.

He gave me this estimate:

1) New compressor: $320
2) New 'accumulator': $146
3) Refrigerant and oil: $50
4) Some type of seal: $7
5) Labor: $410

Total: $933

I'm assuming the labor is high because they have to pull a lot of stuff out to get to it.

Now, I talked to him before reading the rest of the posts in this thread, so I did not confront him with this. I politely thanked him for the info and the phone call. (I'm trying to keep this civil, remember, he and the owner of the dealership are patients of mine. Also, I did not by the truck there).

But it was around 96 degrees here today and I got in it after it was parked in the sun. It is a black truck. It took the AC a while to get going and it didn't get nearly as cool as it did 3 weeks ago, but after 5 minutes or so, it was relatively comfortable and the air felt cool coming out of the vents. There is definitely something wrong with it, but as several people mentioned, I'm assuming it should not be cooling at all with a compressor 'locked up', 'seized up' or 'burned out'.

I hope these folks have made a mistake and are not trying to fleece me. The cost for diagnostics was $80 for labor and $20 for refrigerant (why did they add refrigerant to a system with a 'locked up' compressor.

At this point I'll definitely get a second opinion either from the Ford place where I bought it, or from an independant.

If it turns out that they got the diagnosis all wrong should I ask for my money back in regard to the labor fee for 'diagnosis'?

What a goat rope!

Mike Z may have the best idea. I may just keep running the dang thing until it won't cool at all.....we should only have another couple of months in the high 90's.

I don't see the evaporator listed. I guess they can replace this on your next trip . I haven't seen one yet that didn't leak or start.

 

[N80]

However if there are signs of leakage at the compressor, We (auto techs) are taught to replace all the parts listed by you in your last post. The prices are slightly high, but not abnormal.

And maybe that is what's up and the service rep may have just gotten things mixed up from what the mechanic told him.

In other words, the mechanic finds some sort of unfixable leak in the compressor, generates the repair list and then tells the service manager that the compressor is 'shot'. Instead of telling me the compressor is shot, the service guy says 'locked up' assuming that I wouldn't know the difference anyway.

The service manager acting guilty when asked for more info doesn't fill me with confidence, so I'd get another opinion.. just my $ 0.02..

Well, maybe he was more confused than guilty. I don't know. It does seem to me that if I have a leaky compressor that can't be repaired that they would just tell me that my compresssor leaks and needs to be replaced.

Its going to be 7-10 days before I can get a second opinion on it. But I'll let you guys know when I find out sometheing new.

 

[irwin]

And maybe that is what's up and the service rep may have just gotten things mixed up from what the mechanic told him.

In other words, the mechanic finds some sort of unfixable leak in the compressor, generates the repair list and then tells the service manager that the compressor is 'shot'. Instead of telling me the compressor is shot, the service guy says 'locked up' assuming that I wouldn't know the difference anyway.

Very possible, likely even.

Well, maybe he was more confused than guilty. I don't know. It does seem to me that if I have a leaky compressor that can't be repaired that they would just tell me that my compresssor leaks and needs to be replaced.

Its going to be 7-10 days before I can get a second opinion on it. But I'll let you guys know when I find out sometheing new.

Dealing with less than happy customers can be uncomfortable, and being uneasy can cause a less then confident reaction, .. Please let us know how this works out for you, and what the problem really is...good luck

 

[N80]

Well, here's an update. Just for a reference the first dealership told me the compressor was 'locked up' (even though it was still cooling) here is the estimate from the first dealership:

1) New compressor: $320
2) New 'accumulator': $146
3) Refrigerant and oil: $50
4) Some type of seal: $7
5) Labor: $410

Total: $933

So, yesterday I took it to the dealership where I bought the truck. They called me today and said the compressor itself was fine and that the problem was a leak in the condensor and that the compressor shaft seal was leaking and needed to be replaced. The new condensor, shaft seal kit and $481 dollars in labor comes out to $920.

At this point I'm getting the impression that I'm going to get screwed no matter what and there is nothing I can do about it. It has been in the high 90s and low 100s for the last week and a half with no let up in sight. My den and kitchen are being re-done after some water damage, I just paid $400 to get the downstairs AC fixed and spent $500 more yesterday when the upstairs AC went out and I'm about at my wits end as it is. I'd like to think I'm tough enough to do without AC but this truck is pretty much the family car so I had the second dealership make the repairs.

AC works fine now.

I asked the Service Advisor if there was any way that Ford could mediate this in some way and he said it was not likely on a truck that was out of warranty and had high miles (I personally don't think 52K in four years is all that high. For a Toyota that is barely out of the break-in period ).

So I asked him for the regional Customer Satisfaction reps number and he gave me an 800 number.

I really think ANY $900 dollar failure of any vehicle component is unacceptable in a 4 year old vehicle that has only seen extremely light duty. I doubt Ford will see it that way and since I've already had the repair done and paid for it I'm sure they won't be able to help me. This is very disappointing. This is my first American made vehicle in 20 years and so far it has been free of defects and I've been impressed. This event has ended that I'm afraid. I'll drive it till it croaks but I'll always have a sour tatse in my mouth about Ford. I'm very brand loyal until I get a failure like this and then I'm just the opposite. I'd have a hard time recommending a Ford to anyone at this point. That may seem unfair, and sure, I'm still stinging from a $900 loss, but that's the way it is. Unfortunately I don't think Ford can continue this sort of thing and stay solvent. Especially not now.

 

[kenmac]

Amen on the hot !! It's been over 100 deg. here for about a week!! I have been running my ##%%% off repairing a/c systems. This heat (& lack of maintenance by the home owners ) is killing them. The A/C parts on your truck( like all parts) have a good amount of mark up. Double the parts for labor & you have close to your cost. Price those parts at the local auto parts & you will know the mark up.

 

[riptides]

(I personally don't think 52K in four years is all that high. For a Toyota that is barely out of the break-in period )..

Hey I got 100k on my '03 F250 and it runs and looks like it came out of the showroom.

My '06 Exploder has 67k on it. Now that is what I call high miles!

This event has ended that I'm afraid. I'll drive it till it croaks but I'll always have a sour tatse in my mouth about Ford. I'm very brand loyal until I get a failure like this and then I'm just the opposite. I'd have a hard time recommending a Ford to anyone at this point. That may seem unfair, and sure, I'm still stinging from a $900 loss, but that's the way it is. Unfortunately I don't think Ford can continue this sort of thing and stay solvent. Especially not now.

I personally think it is hit or miss with any vehicle. Luck of the draw, star alignments, whatever you want to call it. I would not sour on it just yet. I have had computer parts go bad in both my Mitsub and Dodge at a thousand miles out of warrenty, both cost big dollars with NO help from either manufacturer.

You could be looking at the last repair you'll ever make until the wheels fall off, or you could be looking at a money pit.

In 15 years you could say, man that truck sure held up well, or -----

-Mike Z.

 

[RedRocker]

I personally think it is hit or miss with any vehicle. Luck of the draw, star alignments, whatever you want to call it.
-Mike Z.

Yep, we have an 02 Explorer that's been trouble free with 72K on it, my 97 Dodge dually has been trouble free cept for the 5th gear ordeal. I'd buy another Ford, but who can say it would be the same.

 

[mikim]

I personally don't think 52K in four years is all that high.....me either .. In 4 years I topped 100k on my truck. (F150) It is now 7 1/2 yrs old and I'm at 197k. Guess I'll be looking at new ones soon. I've never put this many miles on a vehicle before - but this one's been trouble free all this time. Maybe I'll just run it til it quits....new ones are so $$$$$$$$$$$!!!

 

[N80]

Mike, you are right. This may be one of those things where I'll look back on it and laugh. But I'm not laughing right now. I've priced a new tractor shed (pole barn type thing) and it was going to cost me about $1000 to build it. Poof, its gone. Tractor will have to live under a tarp a little while longer.

Could this be a freak type thing. Yep. Does that let the manufacturer off the hook? Not in my book. Anyway, here's hoping this will be the last major problem.

And just for the record, I also have a Nissan Murano which is a great perfroming car but it has had some minor issues. The difference is that Nissan is standing by it. Both problems, which cost about $250 each, occurred just after the warranty expired. The dealership ate both of them even though it was not where we bought it. They were both minor problems that should not have occurred that early and they admitted it and repaired them for free. One of them was just the sunvisor on the driver's side flopping down. There is no repair for this, just replacement, parts and labor = $250, which is totally insane, but they covered it without us asking them too! Ford did not do this even though I had the work done where I bought it. Just makes you think. The Nissan has had more problems (although small) than the Ford, but Ford has left me with a bad taste in my mouth.

As far as high mileage, to me, anything below 100k is low. My last three vehicles were going strong at more than 150K and accidents (none of them my fault, by the way) ended their careers.

I've had two vehicles that needed expensive AC repairs prior to this, one at 7.5 years, one at 10 years. That didn't bother me. That's life. Four years is too early.

But, I hope I'll be driving this thing for years and will be telling great tales about how long it has lasted, because, as I've mentioned, I drive a thing until it drops!